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Idea: Do away with the entire roll system


Fizzydog
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Roll System Changes  

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I'm not here to type an essay or anything. I just want to send an idea out there. If you have an actual opinion other than "lol no", then please do post. Even if is a "lol no", at least explain so you don't look like a fool.

Basically, I've found the roll system...stupid. Let's be honest, the "RP" is all determined by tech, like practically everything is. Which rules out free, open minded RP and implants a direct path for the two or more RPers to follow once the roll has been done with.

So I've thought: why do we even NEED a system like this? Why not just have the entire thing decided by legitimate RPs? Basically, the RPers could play it out and if there is anything wrong, a GM will make them fix it. So instead of them whining OoCly, a GM will be contacted, or they could be already viewing the thread, and they would make a ruling. Less complaining, more fun. So instead of rolls and crap, you RP out whatever is happening, just like a war. This does away with luck and instead puts actual writing skills to the test, like the game should be.

Nuclear bombs and SDI's won't be changed. They would still require a roll, since that is honestly the only good way to do it.




Once again, I am not writing an essay. Just throwing an idea out there. Don't go "waah waah not enough detail." Something you want to change? Then do it. It is simply an idea in its simplest form.

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[quote name='Triyun' timestamp='1300745381' post='2672606']
I'm pretty sure this will just vastly increase the capabilities of larger nations. So I think we'd need to see specifics.
[/quote]
WHat would it "increase"? Are you implying that larger nations have better RPs? Ifso, they DESERVE to win, and not just because their manly tech levels IG.

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[quote name='Voodoo Nova' timestamp='1300745434' post='2672608']
How would you deal with someone who comes up with an infinite number of impenetrable defenses on the spot to defeat said "RP-Only" spy attack? The reason the roll system exists is to prevent that from happening in the first place.
[/quote]

You would actually have to find loop-holes and think hard. Oh no! B-)

Edited by PresidentDavid
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[quote name='Voodoo Nova' timestamp='1300745434' post='2672608']
How would you deal with someone who comes up with an infinite number of impenetrable defenses on the spot to defeat said "RP-Only" spy attack? The reason the roll system exists is to prevent that from happening in the first place.
[/quote]
For one, if you mean when the RP starts then the person would obviously be RPing defenses without even building them earlier, which I assume is against the rules?

But if you mean beforehand, well, impenetrable defenses are near impossible. You can only pull security so tight until you start chocking yourself. And even if not, with even the best technology a nation could still be breached.

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Technology does not influence your spy odds, spy odds are determined by the number of spies, land and the threat level ig. In essence the current roll system puts the smaller nations on a more even playing field because it does not take a lot of money to get to 550 spies, 800 requires a wonder but is still doable on a low level. So if you want to remove an advantage of the smaller nations you want to abolish the roll system. If you want to keep it more even you will keep it as it is.

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Spy operation odds are determined by the following formulas:

Attacking spies chances of success are determined by (number of spies) + (technology level / 20)
The defending nation's counter intelligence systems are determined by (number of spies) + (technology level / 20) + (land total / 70). Threat level modifiers are also taken into account for the defender.

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[quote name='Fizzydog' timestamp='1300745481' post='2672610']
WHat would it "increase"? Are you implying that larger nations have better RPs? Ifso, they DESERVE to win, and not just because their manly tech levels IG.
[/quote]

The United States Coast Guard budget alone dwarfs the entire defense, coastal territorial integrity, and covert budgets of most small nations. Large nations have greater capabilities as far as surveillance, situational awareness, etc. Further they tend to have more money to spend on information assurance and verification. More resources when RP ability is equal means that the larger nation almost always will win. I am sorry but objectively speaking, yes bigger nations are stronger. If you do not like that I'm sorry but we are RPing nations this is not a individual role playing forum. I have participated in several individual role play forums in the past of various genre. In those role playing does matter. This is a national RPing forum, many people have made some fascinating world leaders but the underlying fact is that a nation with more resources with a terrible leader will almost always have more capabilities than a weak nations with a fantastic leader.

Further I would point out that the nations that are the most influential at the moment do not always have the highest NS. They just have higher NS than most. I would say that people who are truly the strongest tend to also know more about the equipment which governments use to keep their nations secure. They know how to use pieces of the puzzle of national power and how to make it all fit together. Ultimately the success of covert action is knowing how covert actions are performed and how counter covert actions are performed. It has nothing to do whether someone has an interesting back story. The current system's success is based mostly on chance alone. You change that system, those of us who are up to date with the latest DHS DARPA projects are going to have a larger measure of success than those that aren't. Take Sarah and me. If we both had the same 50k nation, she's probably going to develop a lot more developed character for the spy, she's more into that stuff, but I'm going to likely have a better idea of what tools I have available to under take the covert action and do that part of the RP. I will be advantaged in this particular type of RP.

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To be fair though:

I've participated in a variety of individual rp forums as well. The ones that utilized a stat system to determine player abilities and dice rolls for success were the most orderly ones. The gamers still had to rp out the success or failure of the dice rolls.

The forums that didn't use any stat system or dice rolls at all were a mixed bag. Some ran very well, but normally those were very small communities of rpers who had known each other for a very long time. Most larger communities tend to be rife with whining and complaining.

Last..

We are in CNrp.. That is cybernations roleplay. You can't ignore the aspects of game play in favor of the roleplay or it defeats the entire purpose of the style of rp that we do.

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First of all , LOLNO

Now the reasons.

The importance of spy rolls is principally to protect the RPer from pure Tech'er. The concept of spy rolls ensure that not everyone has to be expert in intelligence operations, security technologies etc. You win a roll, you get to RP a success in your roleplay.

The thing to be understood is that like Triyun said not everyone is proficient in technology terms. Different people have different fields of expertise. To base the espionage results principally on the RL knowledge the player has on these systems would immediately cause an imbalance in RP.

Then again the principal purpose of these rolls are to prevent abuse. A totally random mechanism to determine win/fail conditions based on IG capabilities is much less prone to abuse than a completely GM determined system. GMs are humans too, they too are occasionally prone to error (speaking about others, not the Infallible, Exalted, Omnipotent Me). GMs may also not be personally well versed in tools and trades of espionage in which cases their judgement may be once again be impaired.

So the spy rolls should remain and GMs should remain in a position of adjudication and moderation.

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You want to go back to the system where the RPer with the best techno-babble won because nobody else 1) cared enough to waste their life making that crap up, 2) cared enough to spend hours arguing with a brick or 3) COULD argue with that brick (cough LVN cough)? :blink:

Edited by Emperor Mudd
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[quote name='Emperor Mudd' timestamp='1300765540' post='2672897']
You want to go back to the system where the RPer with the best techno-babble won because nobody else 1) cared enough to waste their life making that crap up, 2) cared enough to spend hours arguing with a brick or 3) COULD argue with that brick (cough LVN cough)? :blink:
[/quote]

Is it wrong to give people with common since and intelligence the ability to use it and try to make themselves better then others? Just saying ^_^

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[quote name='PresidentDavid' timestamp='1300792799' post='2673070']
Is it wrong to give people with common since and intelligence the ability to use it and try to make themselves better then others? Just saying ^_^
[/quote]

Having common sense and such is nice and all but especially with rp's that can seriously $%&@ someone's nation up there needs to be some moderation, the best way to keep the spy system fair is by putting in a fully random system.

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