TehChron

[quote name='Comrade General' timestamp='1322455722' post='2854252'] GinoTheRoman Flashpoint Kommando A few lesser know names but where big names in their time on a smaller scale maybe [/quote] No offense, and I mean this. I understand that there are reasons why you want these guys' names out there. [i]But[/i], there are reasons why people don't name folks like Seerow, myself, Zhadum, Anthony, or TheBlitz in these kinds of lists. And it's because our accomplishments, while impactful in the communities we were in, simply weren't all that relevant on the larger stage, which is what this question of Legends is about. So...meaningful? Yeah, sure. But Legends of CN? Not by a long shot.

[quote name='Lincongrad' timestamp='1322453760' post='2854234'] Not sure what can be done besides just leaving it alone. Regent Pancras thought about posting a retraction or something, but decided that the damage had been done. I don't know what it is.... Legion members just seem to have a 'special' relationship with the Big Boards. We're very aware of this internally. [/quote] Oh please. Scapegoating is what got you all into this embarrassing position in the first place. You already know it wasn't just Regent who overreacted. Also Im taking particular note of the fact that you didnt imply that a straight up apology was on the table.

[quote name='Feanor Noldorin' timestamp='1322429117' post='2853995'] Dilber, Archon and Sponge are my top3. I'm unsure where to put Ivan since I wasn't here when he was in power. [/quote] Basically Ivan is an individual whose strength is the ability to get the best stuff possible out of any possible situation. If you don't actively block everything he tries to do, he will wind up destroying you. Only reason why he hasnt been all that relevant lately is because people just plain fear his potential influence due to his sheer level of infamy. Perhaps the single biggest examples of just how much of a boss Ivan was are the [i]Oath[/i] and his single-handed destruction of the Independence Council. The first of which took massive balls and intimidation to force through the ODN of that era, and the second of which people to this day [i]still[/i] aren't sure how he managed to pull it off. If you all don't mind me saying, in terms you can put into perspective, Ivan, at full power, is the best of all of those three you just mentioned. Only slightly less skilled a diplomat than Dilber, slightly less verbose than Archon, and slightly less driven than Sponge. But Ivan's charisma back then outshines anything that has appeared in CN since, and he is, without a doubt, the single greatest strategist in CN history. Don't believe me? Play him in a Supremacy1914 game, and see what happens. So yeah, Ivan's #1 in my mind. He's done things with this community that no one has ever been able to match, and created institutions that took years and the coordinated efforts of multitudes to undo. Don't get me wrong, what Dilber and Sponge and Archon managed were fantastic all on their own, but until Karma, everyone in Cybernations was still playing in Ivan's sandbox.

[quote name='Muddog' timestamp='1322357256' post='2853075'] I have to agree with a member of Deinos? I'm interested to see if they follow the same pattern for the other nations that posted and shredded the PR capital legion had. [/quote] The problem is that if they did that, they'd apparently wind up gutting their government.

[quote name='AlmightyGrub' timestamp='1322342449' post='2852856'] Good Morning TOP. It is a beautiful day. I am not sure why it took you so long, it seems you could have done this a long time ago when most of you where actually in our range.... Your lack of courage cost you true revenge. Good Luck, Have Fun and Die. [/quote] What's amusing about that implication is that it's your alliance's nations that fell behind. So if that's the case, is it truly their lack of courage that lead to this result? It's not as if TOP hasn't given the New Polar Order a chance to build itself up for this fight that it knew was coming, eventually.

[quote name='Ardus' timestamp='1322325107' post='2852569'] Great read my ass. I'm astounded by my horrible grammar. [/quote] lol as if i have the balls the criticize anyone's grammar

[quote name='Lincongrad' timestamp='1322305214' post='2852305'] Wait wait wait, I got this... So to fix our PR fallout from this thread I should apologize for our government's reactions, right? Right? The apologies of the government for the actions of our members deeply disgust me. Immediate dissociation comes across too strongly. Words fail me. I've rarely been more shocked. Think of the children! WHEN WILL THE APOLOGIES END?!?! Don't worry, bro, I got this covered. Situation contained. [/quote] Where's the apology for publicly begging raiders to hit a member that resigned after making a silly thread? Get out. Seriously. You should be embarrassed that your government members literally tripped over themselves to throw Smurf under the bus over this.

[quote name='suryanto tan' timestamp='1322304609' post='2852298'] I have no idea why ones would announce that their ex-members is free for others to attack. If you want to discipline your own member, you better do it yourselves. You should not let the 25 nukes in his possession scared you off. If you worry that the Legion will get attacked because of his post, well, you need to grow some balls. Your dearest ally in NpO is under attacks, offering a statement of support is the least you can do if you cannot afford to offer military/finance assistance. [/quote] What makes that statement ironic is that it was due to Polars aid shoring up their lackluster warchests at the lower levels that allowed the Legion to hold out against us after the first two rounds finished up. Just thought Id put that out there for people to chew on.

[quote name='Omniscient1' timestamp='1322303975' post='2852289'] Finally, Come back home Smurf. [/quote] He's welcome to join the NSO. You know that has always been your home, Omni. Now Smurf can experience it for himself.

[quote name='Regent Pancras' timestamp='1322303218' post='2852275'] Just to confirm, Unknown Smurf has resigned from The Legion, however his AA hasn't been updated yet. He is no longer afforded the protection of The Legion though, so if any tech raiders out there want some of his 5,542.54 technology, his nation can be found [url="http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=260793"]HERE[/url]. As far as The Legion is concerned, this matter is closed. [/quote] [i]sigh[/i] Now that's just lame on your part. One should generally save real pettiness like that to private channels rather than openly drawing attention to just how hurt your feelings are. Well, whatever. Seriously low on your part.

Ardus, I honestly did not remember that you were the one who said that. You have balls. I mean, I knew you were a good leader for MK, but that gave me a pleasant surprise. Also great read and such.

[quote name='Larajoseph' timestamp='1322302414' post='2852261'] [font="Verdana"]I am not a member of Legion government. I have no authority of any kind. I do, however, have opinions. This is the post I made when Unknown Smurf posted his resignation from the Legion shortly after he made this demeaning, insulting post: His resignation thread was dated about 3 minutes after the original post in this thread. Even he knew he'd finally gone too far. In another post on our forums, also time-stamped a minute or two after this post, he stated he was drunk. That is not an excuse or a reason for doing this !@#$. There is no !@#$@#$ excuse or reason for this post. As a member of The Legion, I wish to publicly and abjectly apologize to all of the fine alliances he insulted in his original post, and pray you will accept the apologies of at least myself in the spirit in which they are offered. [/font] [/quote] Stop. Just stop. Your overreactions are only making it worse. Some people find that kind of thing hilarious, but I really don't. So please, just stop. We get it, hes not a member anymore and etc etc.

Edit: Random double post

[quote name='Regent Pancras' timestamp='1322300953' post='2852231'] Unknown Smurf is not a member of, nor does he speak on behalf of The Legion government. He is an idiot who does not know when to keep his mouth shut, and who decided to post a frankly imbecilic post on a subject he knows nothing about.[/quote]See? Not that hard at all. [quote]This is totally undiplomatic language which as Minister of Foreign Affairs I am disgusted by. On behalf of The Legion Government I wish to offer an unreserved apology to any of the alliances insulted in Unknown Smurf's misguided attempt to be funny or shine the spotlight on himself. [/quote]That's quite the overreaction, by the way. As a fellow MoFA (Master of Lies) I have got to say that if you want to be more successful at your job you oughtta pop your collar and chill. Appearing to take these kinds of things so seriously somewhat impedes your ability to do your job. Friendly advice. [quote name='generals3' timestamp='1322302129' post='2852256'] It seems a lot of people didn't notice what smurf did there. Ah well, i thought it was funny. [/quote] "If you have to explain the joke then there [i]is[/i] no joke!" That's the problem with trying too hard to be clever. Stuff flies over peoples heads and the effort becomes wasted.

[quote name='Alexander Kerensky' timestamp='1322295061' post='2852147'] As Proconsul of the Legion I definitely say Unknown Smurf, at best is three sheets to the wind on this, this was neither intelligent nor funny. I find it unfortunate that a member of Legion would post something like this on their own in a desperate need for attention. It would seem that some lose the concept of their actions and how it reflects not on themselves but on the Alliance they are a part of. [/quote] Couldn't you have found a member of government to make this comment who hasn't been guilty of doing the same thing a number of times themselves? Also: Smurf.

[quote name='Il Impero Romano' timestamp='1322296131' post='2852164'] No offense, but you personally make people not like your alliance. Something to think about and friendly advice. [/quote] He's had a habit of doing that since he was in the NPO. Happy Hunting, TOP, no one deserves this more than you all do.

[quote name='AzureShadow' timestamp='1322236676' post='2851011'] It seems like the only actual disagreement we have here is that you think them screwing you was intentional, while I think it was not. Apart from your vigorous anti-Legion epeen stroking, of course, which has nothing to do with this thread or our discussion whatsoever, as I'm arguing entirely from my point of view from \m/. I'll echo the sentiments of dcrews20 and say that having Grub or another high-up in Polar comment on this would be nice to clear up whatever misunderstanding most of the world still seems to have on this issue. [/quote] Well, to be fair, given the circumstances, I find it fairly difficult to figure out how they could have done so on accident, when everything they did at that time was entirely deliberate. Well, Im sure if you were to actually look it up on the threads from back then, you'd find numerous gems of Polar members blaming us for it, due to some nonsense about our insufferable egos being why we deserved to be left hanging. Oh well. But since it's Grub, I can't imagine hed deny it.

[quote name='AzureShadow' timestamp='1322224862' post='2850960'] It sounds more to me like there was a serious miscommunication issue between you and your allies, rather than an actual "master plan" on their part. That's not something to be ashamed of or anything, it happens between alliances all the time.[/quote] Wait. Wait. [i]Wait.[/i] The New Polar Order doesn't tell [i]anyone of their involved allies of their intent to peace out, including ourselves and STA and somehow the error lies with the people who were intentionally left in the dark?[/i] My god. It all makes sense now. Thank you, [i]so much[/i], for opening my eyes. Grub! Can you ever forgive me? [quote]Is it possible Grub lied? Of course. It's also possible that you're the one making reaching assumptions about NpO's intentions when the far simpler explanation is just a serious issue with lack of communications. Hell, we in \m/ probably had better communication with NpO during the war while we were fighting them than you did at the time, going by what you're telling me. [/quote]Um. Yes, actually. The NpO kept people not fighting alongside them more abreast of the situation than those that they dragged into their coalition alongside them. It's like you're beginning to grasp the problem here, but refusing to reach the conclusion that the facts of the situation lead to. [quote]Regardless, this discussion has no place in this thread, and it's been derailed long enough.[/quote]The OP is a question requesting a detailing of the history of CN. We are discussing two competing views of an event in CN's history. One is correct, and one is stupendously false. Since the OP wants to know about CNs history, surprisingly enough, me correcting your misrepresentations is entirely on topic. Honestly. Lately Im thinking you Legionarres are trying to rip off my playbook and are failing spectacularly at it. But mere imitation will only get you so far.

[quote name='AzureShadow' timestamp='1322195012' post='2850802'] I think you're the one being disingenuous by trying to claim that Polar intentionally screwed over their allies. Their allies screwed themselves over quite nicely by turning that war into something a lot larger than the original intent of the war was.[/quote]Hello. I am in the NSO. I was in the NSO when the New Polar Order peaced out with you, then redeclared against TOP and didnt even bother to let us, their MDP partners, know about this grand master plan ahead of time. What leg do you have to stand on again? [quote][b]NpO made it quite clear to \m/ in negotiations for the blanket white peace that they did not want the war to escalate any farther than the conflict between our two alliances. [/b]Trying to make it appear otherwise is foolish and, quite frankly, wrong. I won't claim to know what the ultimate desires of Grub or anyone else in NpO were during that war, but I do know for a fact that the war started between us with the intent of them trying to teach \m/ and friends a lesson and vice versa and the expanded conflict that started as a result had motives by the offending parties for completely different reasons.[/quote]Um. Then Grub lied. Shocker. Grub expanded it by inviting TOP and Co to the party, via their chains with us at the time (I know what Im talking about? Wild I know) [quote]EDIT: And, for the record, I'm in no way trying to stick up for Almighty Grub or NpO in general. I still harbor quite a bit of resentment for him from how much of a prat he was during that whole deal. But I'm also not going to let blatant falsehoods such as what you're trying to pass as the correct version of history go unobjected either. Unfortunately my account on the \m/ forums no longer exists or I'd go dig up the discussion we had about this very topic. [/quote]Name one falsehood I've stated, rather than you "knowing" or "assuming" or "not thinking". Before you go spouting hyperbole, at least make sure that [i]you have some of the facts on your side first[/i]. You may believe that you recall events correctly. You may not think you're misrepresenting what happened. But the fact is just...simply...that you're wrong. Oh well. And this is your weekly history lesson, courtesy of TehChron.

[quote name='AzureShadow' timestamp='1322176915' post='2850663'] It got started over an \m/ member calling Grub a racial slur in IRC, combined with \m/'s string of general ill will towards the game in general and a complete lack of control of its members by the government. I was in \m/ during the whole ordeal, and really we deserved it. The horrible response on part of our government to one of its members going out of his way to be a belligerent asshat was half the reason I left in the first place. The war exploding into the cluster**** [b]it turned into was no fault of ours, nor of NpO's[/b], and I'm still rather unsure as to why people continue to blame them for such. They ended the conflict with us because the conflict was over, the rest of the wars that started as a result wasn't their problem. [/quote] ... I'm sorry. Are you sure you know what you're talking about? Grub not only arrayed the coalition personally when he declared on \m/, but I'm relatively sure that the only alliance to change sides mid-conflict in that particular war (and any war, iirc) was the New Polar Order. That was totally their fault. They carried out the action entirely of their own volition. And your alliance government intentionally provoked him, thinking they could get away with it. You might have a case if Grub ended it completely after peacing out with \m/. No one would have had a problem. The issue comes from the fact that the New Polar Order [i]intentionally took that war and used it as an opportunity to screw over the entire coalition they had assembled, including direct allies.[/i] Additionally, what other wars werent their problem? It was all the same war. *shakes his head* And all I need to do is look at your AA to prove my point about the only people giving the NpO any leeway are the ones who can't do any better. Sheesh man, either you're being horribly disingenuous or just have no idea what you're talking about. Either way you're trying to present a view of events wholly divorced from reality.

[quote name='hormones74' timestamp='1322182580' post='2850711'] ALRIGHT PEOPLE!!!!! Back to the task at hand. 1. Polar lacks in testicular fortitude. 2. They went to PM over rumors. 3. Polars testicles still haven't dropped. 4. Polar is hiding behind SF[s] over a rumor.[/s][b][i]in order to save themselves from the FAIL military juggernaut.[/i][/b] [/quote]I felt the need to correct this misconception before it carried on any further. [quote name='Tygaland' timestamp='1322183653' post='2850717'] It seems you are not fine. Can I offer you a hot beverage to calm your nerves? I have been told to eat worse things right here on the forum. Regardless, I shall have to decline. I don't like salad. [/quote] Not even Raspberry chicken or Asian salad? Heathen.

[quote name='lordliam' timestamp='1322092038' post='2850060'] I think the original rationale behind the whole thing was that we were under obligation to defend our allies, even if our allies were on different sides. So it resulted in a very confusing, essentially three-sided war. Can't remember the details now really but I recall a lot of confusion and anger on the part of many members in Polar. It doesn't help that I myself was ordered to attack one side and then ended up taking hits from another bloc entirely. Not good times for Cadia. [/quote] The New Polar Order declared, got TOP/IRON/STA and NSO and its friends involved. Then cut its losses and changed sides midconflict, leaving all of the people that went in with them out to dry. And Im pretty sure it got started over Grub crying the victim over some IRC shenanigans, it was kind of lame. That being said, BiPolar is probably the single biggest backstab in CN history. There were no "three sides", just two, and the Polars rather happily threw their allies under the bus. It's honestly no wonder that no one trusts that alliance , except for the folks that can't do any better.

[quote name='AlmightyGrub' timestamp='1322040901' post='2849627'] There are crossfire issues that I regret, but screwing TOP is not one of them. [/quote] Sorry, but this is the only part of you hanging yourself on a cross again that really caught my attention, but... No. No you don't regret that in the slightest. And that's why most people who once called Polaris allies and brothers wouldn't waste their piss should your alliance be set on fire themselves. Because as far as you're concerned, the only thing regrettable about that decision was that it backfired so spectacularly for you. Not the collateral damage.

[quote name='Voytek' timestamp='1321995621' post='2849236'] has anyone really been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like? [/quote] Ow. That physically hurt. Great impression.[quote name='D34th' timestamp='1321995707' post='2849238'] They see me rollin, they hatin [/quote]No, I'm just genuinely curious. But ok if you want to feed your martyr complex, then by all means, feel free to think that.

[quote name='Londo Mollari' timestamp='1321995477' post='2849232'] Good meatshields don't have the habit of betraying you midwar and then leaving to fight for the other side. [/quote] Yes, but a fine meatshield just sits there, takes up offensive slots, and complains about how no one loves them anymore. [quote name='Londo Mollari' timestamp='1321995350' post='2849230'] You mentioned that their being in peace mode would preclude gathering together and rolling them. It worked pretty well for the Continuum with FAN, and Polar is no FAN. [/quote] Ah, I missed that particular episode.