Striker DCS

My sentiments exactly. I would only add that if this war isn't persecuted to it's fullest, the NPO that we all despise for their thug actions over the past years will be back and nothing will change.

That is just the point. THEY always took it to far. NPO should be disbanded forcing them to join other alliances as they did to so many others. I have had my say, let the vote speak for itself...

I have never heard complaints about GATO or the Legion. I am sure if they were to act as NPO has acted there would be a "Karma" waiting for them.

And who gave them the right to create such a doctrine? They did. How's that doctrine holding up now? lol It amazes me that they still carry that same $@y arrogance. These peace terms are just what they want so they can get out from under the sledge hammer that is wacking away at them. Let them stay in peace mode, sooner or later they will be dealt with and their will be no more "doctrines" from NPO

Our original alliance (Digital Combat Soldiers) was attacked and many of our nations destroyed for no reason other than the fact we were on Red Team. Try not to speak if you dont know what you are talking about. From my original post: No reparations, apologies, or reorganization terms can be big enough or strong enough to erase what they have done. What they did, they did with malice and forethought. I speak for myself but I am sure that many will share my opinion. No surrender, no terms, no reorganization, no survival. NPO deserves to be completely and totally destroyed. Their alliance name should be removed from the game never to be used again. They lived by the sword and so they should die by the sword, no quarters. Any attempts by NPO to weasel out of their situation should fall on deft ears. NPO thought nothing of destroying nations and alliances just because they could. The only fitting and fair way for this to end is with their complete destruction and their alliance name removed from Planet Bob, never to be used again. No poll yet has asked this simple question? They argue about the terms... I say no terms, total ZI...

Unless we deal with NPO properly the whole war was a waste of time. Least we forget all that they have done. It would be nice if only those that have had their nation or alliance destroyed by them should vote on this matter. Their arrogant refusal to accept the terms dictated to them has only proven their mindset. NPO is still trying to justify their past deeds and actions. http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...t&p=1621181

I have not read all of the pages in this long thread. To be honest I could care less about any reparations paid or specific terms of surrender. I speak for one small alliance (out of the hundreds) that was abused by NPO during it's reign of terror. No reparations, apologies, or reorganization terms can be big enough or strong enough to erase what they have done. What they did, they did with malice and forethought. I speak for myself but I am sure that many will share my opinion. No surrender, no terms, no reorganization, no survival. NPO deserves to be completely and totally destroyed. Their alliance name should be removed from the game never to be used again. They lived by the sword and so they should die by the sword, no quarters. Any attempts by NPO to weasel out of their situation should fall on deft ears. NPO thought nothing of destroying nations and alliances just because they could. The only fitting and fair way for this to end is with their complete destruction and their alliance name removed from Planet Bob, never to be used again. Anything less than their total annihilation would not satisfy the wrongs they have committed. For any alliance or bloc to consider anything less than NPO's complete destruction would allow their many actions to go unpunished. I hope the day will come when NPO is no more and those NPO officials who sponsored and dictated their many crimes on the world have felt the total and complete wrath of Planet Bob. I vote for the complete and utter destruction of NPO.

The only way it would work is if enough people are interested. Thats why I didnt put it in suggestion box yet. I think a one round trial would let everyone know if it makes the game more interesting.

Nothing about TE can be changed without the admin stepping in and making the changes. If you want a training area where all nations could learn how to grow and war on an equal footing then the way to do it would be to take out all alliances and treaties. I know this will be argued that it doesn't give you training for SE wars. But that is the problem..., we know it has turned out to be the problem in SE (boring) due to too many alliances and treaties and is reflected in TE. If you ask anyone what the problems are with both SE and TE you will find that most people agree they revolve around alliances and the many treaties. What has happened in TE is that alot of the SE alliances have just stepped into TE bringing all that crap with them. Imagine 3500 or more individual nations all growing and fighting it out equally. No big alliances to dictate "how the game is played" and no treaties or bloc's that give those certain nations advantages that others don't enjoy. Many things are done by nations within TE that would not be done if they didn't have their alliance to back them up. Too many small, unaligned nations that join CN:TE soon quit when they are faced with fighting off huge AA's that are raiding them. How many nations go inactive and quit (ruining the game) simply because of how unfair the game is. Everyone knows the game is slanted in favor of whoever belongs to the largest alliance. You can tell this by how many people automatically join the largest alliance when joining the game. I truly believe creating a CN with NO alliances or treaties permitted would be utterly awesome. It would give every nation that joins an EQUAL chance of being successful. The winner would be determined by sheer individual abilities and a whole lot of luck. Raids and wars would be thought out well, implemented carefully, and diplomatically resolved in most cases. It would be a real tournament experience. I know that many people would be afraid to play in an equal setting, they need the comfort and protection that belonging to a huge alliance provides. But there are many nations (people) out there that would welcome the chance to play in an all-out "Nation Building Simulation" and forget about the "Alliance Building Simulation". We already have that and we already know how to do it... and most would agree it is boring and ruins the game. This would require actual game changes taking out the pages and abilities to form alliances and rules regarding treaties and pacts. Right now there are nations that could and would join you in a battle and those are your (very seldom thought of) trading partners. Protecting and supporting your trades by assisting and protecting those trading partners would become much more important without alliance and treaty support. This could be enhanced by creating a page where trading partners could send out a request for assistance to all their trading partners whenever they are attacked. If you choose not to assist them then they could and most probably would drop your trade, putting your nation at a disadvantage making less income thereby lessening your chance of finishing in the top 100 nations. This could not be accomplished without major changes being made by admin, and to get admin too make these changes would need a general concensus and agreement by the majority of the players involved that this would improve the game. I see one of the major benefits to the game and for admin and that would be slowing the number of nations that leave of go inactive soon after joining. We would all belong to one alliance, NONE... PS: That might be the easiest way for admin to implement this change and that would be to give everyone only one choice in selecting alliances and that would be NONE. From that point on we would all belong to one happy but disfunctional family that most of us can identify with. I challenge each and every one of you guys out there to consider this and if you agree, lets make it happen. One thing for sure, after one round we will all know whether it worked to make the game more interesting. Almost everyone that plays this game gets to deal with all that alliance crap in SE and thats a good place for it, but, using the term so frequently bantered about throughout these forums, this is TE... So lets really make it different, and by different I mean lets make it exciting. All you guys that are afraid to play and need to hide under your mothers skirt, stay in SE. Those of you who feel they can make it on their own and welcome cutting the apron strings, join a REAL tournament edition.

You guys keep speaking of this treaty as though you were forced by it to come in and curbstomp us and I cant believe Sethly said what he said but he is entitled to his opinion. The truth is it could have been settled in a way that left you guys with a lot more than our tech, it could have left you with some shred of honor and integrity. The kind of honor and integrity that other alliances have earned in the past. I believe had it been Thai of MHA or BG of TPF they would have gone about it in a way that accomplished a balanced end to the war, and left themselves with the dignity that large and respectable alliances earn. You could have brokered a peace through threat alone, but peace was not your objective. The truth is you guys were only interested in the curbstomp and you could care less about doing anything in an honorable way. You were all giddy with excitement, tickled with the idea that you had the excuse to do exactly what you are doing. When I think of honorable alliances I think of MHA, LE and TPF. Yes the big kid in the schoolyard can do two things, he can come in swinging or he can choose to use the sheer power of his size to negotiate a clean and honorable peace that was satisfactory to all concerned. Since somehow you guys managed to become the largest alliance in TE you should learn from those that have filled that position before you. There, I went ahead and posted in the thread that was for other alliances to respond in but reading Sethly's post made me do it.

I guess my suggestion (see above *) to keep people from Swat, Fark, and Adult from adding comments to this thread wasnt very visible or possibly misunderstood (probably just ignored, lol). Any person other than those that are members of said alliances feel free to comment. Thanks

Please, no SPAMMING or TROLLING this thread. This poll was posted to seek the opinion of all nations and all alliances within the CN:TE world. All are welcome to vote and we hope you do. Please familiarize yourself with the facts before voting. See thread... *Comments are welcome but please limit comments to nations in alliances other than SWAT/FARK/ADULT. They have their own thread for voicing their opinions and comments. Disclaimer: I have taken it upon myself for posting this poll. I did not get permission nor was I requested to do so. I am personally interested in what everyone thinks about how some things are done in TE, what is considered honorable actions and what is considered dishonorable actions. I understand this is TE and pretty much everything goes here but sometimes somethings are not honorable or done with integrity. I alone take any blame and all responsibility for it's content. EDITED: For obvious reasons we will deduct alliance active member count from all results. We already know how they are going to vote.

Hey there StOAKEd, hows it going. I dont think I heard any crying just a statement of the facts... Have at it, do your best, who knows maybe if you guys try real hard you might encourage others to jump into the fray. I mean whenever there has been something in the past that is this unfair I have found that other alliances band together to right the wrongs perpetrated. I think I can easily speak for the rest of swat in saying it doesn't bother us as much as you might think. Like I said above, there is no shame in having been rolled by an alliance three times you size. Actually it is somewhat of a compliment. There is always some aa out there that has no regard for fairplay and this time it appears to be FARK. TE is meant as a training ground for swat. A place to learn and I must say we have learned alot this round. Not necessarily about wars, raiding, or about growing your nation quickly and rerolling if necessary. You also learn about how to, and how not to, conduct your alliance with honor and integrity.

If my calculations are correct (as of this posting) Fark has sent out 29 nations so far to attack us. Combine that with Adults 23 active nations comes to a total of 52 nations attacking our 44 active nations. I am sure more are to follow. I mean it kinda runs with the same principle as stated above. One thing I have learned from TE is that not many here believe in a fair fight. Actually they run from fair fights and enter only into fights they have a 100% chance of winning. A small limited engagement or simply a declaration without attacking and demanding a truce would have gone a long ways in showing Fark's honor and integrity. I have to say that in my 4 rounds of TE I have never seen a one-sided unfair war as we are witnessing here. What goes around in this game comes around sooner or later. Perhaps Fark will enjoy getting rolled by a much larger force in the future. We can only hope.

WoW, did someone notice the 800 pound guerilla in the room! It seems no one our size ever attacks us, it always seems to be either several combined alliances or the biggest alliance, lol. I must say at least our attack on Adult was relatively fair and balanced. We didn’t combine forces with anyone or do we now ask for any assistance with our war with Adult. Even though we took a decisive advantage with an update blitz it was still against someone with the same number of active nations and with a stronger average ns. It was intended to be a 1vs1 war without calling in any big guns to curbstomp anyone. It appears that we have a good old schoolyard fight going on now since Fark decided to jump in. You know the kind I’m talking about. The big bully of the school weighing in at around 250 pounds (not the brightest kid) beating up on the skinny 90 pound kid with glasses on. I guess there cant be any doubt as to how the fight will end. Stats: Fark 172 active nations w/ans of 2358 vs Swat 45 active nations w/ans of 1569 I had just talked to our leaders today to see if we could offer a truce or white peace to Adult because it was never our intention to stomp them into the ground. The reply I got was that we need to at least give them the opportunity to hit us back before we offer peace. I considered this to be a gallant idea, let them hit us back and then offer an honorable peace to them, something they could accept with dignity. I guess this was to be expected since this is TE and not many alliances like a fair fight when they can stomp someone using the good old 3vs1 rule. Last war it was three alliances against our one, now it is an alliance easily 3 times our size and almost twice our strength attacking us when we are already in a war with the majority of our slots full. So go ahead and have your fun. The little kid in the schoolyard can always pick himself up and go home knowing he lost an unfair fight too a much larger opponent, while the big fat (ugly) kid gets to gloat to his friends that he beat up some small kid one third his size. To me it is all about losing honor and respect whether it is SE or TE. Give us a good pounding then go brag to your friends how you beat up the little guy. I would consider offering you the best of luck like the poster above me but I really dont think your gonna need it...

why? ...are we running out of threads?

I guess I see your point. Appreciate everyones point of view especially Thai and BG. Wanted to run it by you guys first, should have... lol. I am just looking for a way to create more targets for everyone. Hate being in the spot where everyone you want to raid is in some AA that is "off limits". Somebody somewhere start a war before this gets boring. Or someone just declare an alliance that deserves to be rolled, except Swat, we have already enjoyed that this round

I agree, this isn't a perfect idea, but this wouldn't necessarily be about knocking the largest alliance down. Depending on how the voting went it could just as easily be a smaller alliance. There would be much competition in the voting, getting your members to vote a certain way or even getting them to vote at all. When it comes right down to it the alliance selected would probably be the most hated or feared alliance. In a secret vote everyone has the right to vote the way they want, depending on the strategy... It would only add another depth to the game. If everyone saw the selected alliance as their "tech raid" target instead of an alliance beyond reproach. Right now the top two or three alliances along with their treatied alliances dominate the game. It would be a way to keep balance in the game and eliminate the need to form blocs such as the Initiative. It could create a fairer and more level playing field for all alliances and more of a leveling effect bringing many AA's up as it takes larger AA's down. Wouldn't it change how the game is played? No longer could an alliance win by sheer numbers or by forming pacts and treaties. It would assist smaller alliances in their ability to move up in strength and numbers creating many more alliances sharing in a balance of power. Imagine all alliances with relatively the same balance of power, size and strength. The wars would become awesome. Before you'all start beating me up about this, lol, it is just a suggestion. Not perfect or any where near, just an idea. Another way to do it could be limit the size of alliances to 350? lol Have 20 alliances or more with the same numbers of nations could also level the playing field and make the game more interesting. Anyway, just a thought...

IMO Needed to add this; The voting process should include all sanctioned alliances, the top 12. Every nation that chooses to vote can place a single vote for the sanctioned alliance that is getting too big for it's britches and needs to be trimmed down for the sake of all others. Each vote would bring with it a new war and new targets. This way everyone will always have targets to war against.

The Next Big War = Fail, Fail, Fail I am but a small player in this proposed “next war” but I see this idea of a limited war with fail written all over it. In theory it sounds fine and could be enjoyable for the many that have already felt the devastation of war and now find themselves rebuilding, including myself. I understand Thaisport and Burning Glory’s reasoning behind this and that, I believe, is to put some fun back in the game for all those that are beginning to lose interest. The problem with this theory of a limited war is that the larger or more powerful alliances that have won the wars or have managed to stay out of any wars will not stand by and watch their alliances damaged or undermined in any way that might affect their chances of success. That said, I have a proposal to make that all alliances should consider. Let us all play the game the way it was intended to be played… Forget the pacts and treaties, forget the blocs or any of the ties that bind one AA to another. This is and should remain a game of cutthroat. I enjoy the card game of Spades in all the various forms played, but most of all I enjoy the three handed game of Cutthroat. This game puts two players against the top player whoever that top player may be, and as the top player is brought down another top player takes his place thus becoming the target for the following hand. If we start playing this game the way it was intended before pacts and treaties ruined it, it could become much more interesting for all. There is not one alliance in the game that could dominate if ALL the other alliances decided to take it down. This at first might not sound fair to those alliances that enjoy the pacts and treaties they seem to carry with them from round to round giving them advantages other alliances don’t enjoy. In reality a game of cutthroat would keep this game fresh and interesting till the bitter end with no one alliance dominating and controlling the entire round. Each week there could be a silent vote from all nations (I guess the voting system in the forums could handle the size) that want to be involved in the voting process, nominating whatever alliance they think should be brought down to size. This would increase forum participation to somewhere in the neighborhood of 80% of active nations and give all nations the chance to determine the fate of the cn universe. The result of that vote could be posted on the forum and would determine the next targeted alliance. Whatever alliance poses the greatest threat or somehow manages to piss-off the rest of the universe could very easily become the next target. A target not determined by a few players but selected as the target by ALL of the players. If this idea caught on and became a standard practice throughout the game any thoughts of becoming a large, dominating “super” alliance would soon disappear. As you grow closer to the top you also grow closer to becoming selected as the next alliance to be brought down. With this theory in place no one would have any idea who the winner of the round could be or would be till the absolute end of the round. This theory has no-fail written all over it and could remake the game, keeping it interesting and fun for all throughout the entire round.

Sounds like a win, win treaty to me.

Have worked on our flag (as if nothing else is going on) and came up with this. With all the wars going on I thought this might lighten things up. Take your eyes off of IRC and your mind off who and when your going to destroy someone for a minute and let me know what you think. You can't tell to well with this pic but the flag is confederate gray trimmed in gold. Larger version looks much clearer.

Yes and No... It is about war, but it is also about all the other aspects that govern nations and alliances, diplomacy, negotiations, treaties, pacts, etc. In essence it is a complete minaturized version of CN:S on steroids. Check out our newest flag, think this might be a keeper...

I have managed to miss the whole thing. I am sorry to hear about all that has taken place but I am happy to hear that you guys have worked things out. FreedomvilleAT's apology was more than compelling and all that will read it will know it came from the heart. I commend her actions and believe her intentions although misguided, were honorable and were meant for what was best for their alliance. In this game it is very hard to keep personal feelings separate from what is best for your alliance. Admitting you made a mistake and apologizing for it makes her actions honorable. I hope you guys take the next step and renew friendships. It is only a game, friends can last a lifetime.

I guess I am a little out of the loop on this so I dont know the specifics. In the time that I have known Sethly he has been straight up with me. I see him in all the alliance IRC's and have witnessed purely professional conduct from him. He represented NAAW Govt extremely well during negotiations ending the BW/NAAW conflict. When you are operating in a diplomatic capacity behind the scenes, negotiating with many different people that all have different agendas, it is easily possible to get yourself in a situation where your discussions and conversations could be misconstrued. I am not aware of the details and really do not need to be. The reason for this post is too point out that sometimes things aren’t always what they seem to be. My gut feeling in this is that Sethly is being misjudged. I feel he is honest and has shown integrity. This problem should be given a fair "airing" before passing judgment on his character. Loose lips do sink ships and nothing is as reprehensible as a man who would betray his country. Is that really what happened here? As a diplomatic envoy you carry with you many tools and weapons in your arsenal. Leading someone to assume incorrectly is one of those tools. Information is a tool that can be used many different ways to achieve a goal and sometimes you have to make it look as though you are passing on relevant info when really you are simply passing on disinformation. Everyone should be given their day in court. All involved parties need to reevaluate whatever information they have received concerning this matter, double check for inconsistencies and arrive at an honest conclusion. This can not be accomplished until it has been aired in the court of public opinion. Bring out the facts and let everyone decide whether Sethly did operate as a spy or did he possibly fall victim to the good old "slip-of-the-tongue", or is it all based on bad or misguided information. Either way Sethly should be given the highest consideration based on all that he has done good for NAAW in the past. I for one need to know more before I take any "one persons" slant on what has taken place. Quick Edit: I just looked at his nation and it appears his nation is suffering right along with other NAAW nations. Whatever he hoped to gain from doing any spying doesn't appear to have been successful. Normally spies have something to gain for their spying... As I said, I do not know all that is going on here, and that will be just the problem for everyone else that reads this post. We need more information in order to form our own opinion on what has happened.