jgolla

I am seeing the same thing. It looks like it is an illegal character in Imperial Empire's capital city placement, https://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=254123. Alliance Map Error Image Imperial Empire Map Error

Excellent read, Schattenmann. I cant wait to see CoJ get their money. Well I might have to wait :/

I see a lot of speculation, but no proof. What's the point?

[quote name='Sigrun Vapneir' timestamp='1283623792' post='2441553'] Raiders damage the community every day, and you say nothing. [/quote] I know that it is useless to discuss raiding. I am against it, but I know many support it. It is a discussion that will never have an answer that everyone will agree on. I think this discussion is more about when it is and when it is not appropriate to raid.

[quote name='Salmacis' timestamp='1283611644' post='2441377'] I believe wicked is arguing that the OP is more looking for consideration rather than to improve rogue hunting rules. OP knew that, for many raiding alliances, the official stance on this would be "lolno". It seems to me that Otter isn't some naive newbie... He has the mileage of an experienced attention whore. [/quote] I disagree. I believe Otter is using the OP to improve rogue hunting rules. It just so happens he did not have this idea or come accross this problem until it happened to him. This is the first time I have seen this happen too.

[quote name='Sabertooth' timestamp='1280969391' post='2401174'] This alliance is pretty awesome, imo. [/quote] Then why leave

[quote name='Grumpdogg' timestamp='1283469946' post='2439584'] It's a sad sad day when the once proud Pacifica borrows from the Big Book of MHA Strategy. Where is the ORDER in allowing ghosts to suckle on the teat of mother Pacifica and claim her protection without giving anything in return? I can't think of any possible reason an Order would want to promote the idea that you can happily remain outside of the system and yet gain the main benefit of membership - protection. I encourage you to speak out against this madness within your alliance before Vlad has contortions trying to work "ghosts are good" into his Francoist wafflings. [/quote] You misunderstood what I was trying to say. I meant an alliance, that allowed ghosts to hide under their AA, would lose "using ghosts as meat shield". Surely a fellow Order member knows that Pacifica does not and will never stand for ghosts hiding under our AA.

[quote name='The MVP' timestamp='1283465867' post='2439542'] I made a thread (on your forums) and haven't attacked yet. [/quote] That doesn't sound much like asking to me. Sounds just like this thread, but in a different location.

Lord to the Gizzle, I just saw this a couple of days ago and have been checking it daily. Excellent work.

[quote name='wickedj' timestamp='1283453999' post='2439375'] I just want to point out Valhalla had a situation happen similiar to OP's and i, oddly enough, dont see a thread around anywhere going OMG A TECH RAIDER FILLED A SLOT OH THE HUMANITY!. they filled the remaining slots and are going on about their buisness [/quote] I believe that is what is happening here too. I thought this discussion was more philosophically based about what is right when it comes to raiding a rogue. Aeternos Astramora was just using his situation to make it a little more concrete so everyone would understand where he is coming from. At least that is how I saw it.

[quote name='The MVP' timestamp='1283431044' post='2439078'] Attacking your own AA, even if it is a ghost, is considered bad form. [/quote] How is it considered bad form? If I see that, I assume it is a ghost (or possibly something worse) and the alliance is taking care of their business.

[quote name='Sabertooth' timestamp='1283428568' post='2439066'] The meat shields are in general under 500 NS with only a couple usually in the 1000's range. Not much meat there and not many people are able to attack nations in the 3-500 NS range, because of the 75/133% rule. Your nation has to be brand new to attack such a nation. Obviously you keep the ghosts for a different purpose other than meat shields. To boost your population perhaps? Your dreaming if you think they can be used as meat shields. [/quote] For an alliance that takes care of their own ghosts, this is probably true. But if an alliance does not take care of its ghost problem, it is conceivable that they would have ghosts of greater size. Publishing this list of ghosts would be a determent to that alliance if they were in a war, because the attacking alliance would know exactly who to hit and who not to hit.

[quote name='Sandwich Controversy' timestamp='1283366881' post='2438374'] Wouldn't a good alliance want to avoid having ghosts embarrassing them, killing their average NS, and making the alliance more difficult to command? If not, why get rid of ghosts at all? Your alliance prides itself on it, even. [/quote] I am not saying don't get rid of ghosts, I am all for destroying them. What I am saying is let the alliance in question take care of killing their own ghosts. I know I would not take to kindly to someone trying to "help us" with our ghosts.

[quote name='Sandwich Controversy' timestamp='1283361642' post='2438311'] If alliances would publish lists of ghosts publicly and allow anybody to have at them it would solve problems for everybody - especially the arguments over raiding. [/quote] If alliances did that, it would get rid of using ghosts as meat shields in major conflicts and make targeting the actual alliance easier. I am in favor of alliances taking care of their own business with respect to ghosts. If they want help, I am sure they would ask for it.

[quote name='Wentworth the Brave' timestamp='1283307099' post='2437758'] I don't like when people go rogue on alliances. Sorry MVP, I like you but gotta root for Sparta here. [/quote] Did that hurt as much to say as I think it did? Just kidding Wentworth. I agree with you, rogues are bad.

[quote name='rabidman' timestamp='1283306623' post='2437739'] raiding is raiding no matter what. Being a hippy, you don't know that. If i had the tech, i'd be raiding as well, but i'm a newer nation. raiding's just another way to have a smaller "war". We do this for !@#$% and giggles and if you don't like it, delete, we don't care. [/quote] So you don't raid because you are scared of losing. That's a pretty tough stance. I am all for war, for the right reasons. Tech, land, or money are never the right reasons.

[quote name='rabidman' timestamp='1283305736' post='2437716'] you see them as a rogue, a raider sees them as a target. if you don't fill his slots, someone else will. I don't know about you, but thats logical to me. [/quote] The raider also knows they are attacking rogue and knows that they are messing up someone's stagger. I just don't see the point in raiding a target that's getting nukes fir roguing. What does that really get you? Maybe I just don't get raiding.

[quote name='rabidman' timestamp='1283305364' post='2437703'] Raiders do not have to consult with an alliance to attack someone. Why should they miss an opportunity? [/quote] As a courtesy. I am personally against raiding but if the raiders would dish out some real damage or maintain the stagger, we would not be having this discussion.

[quote name='Masterof9puppets' timestamp='1283305360' post='2437702'] Something seems flawed in yours, good sir, peace mode saves an alliance from a whole week of hurting. It gives them the option to repair their injured nations, replenish their strained military, and whatnot. Consider it an act of courtesy given by the rouge, thoughtful that he is. [/quote] I don't believe the rogues alliance asked to be saved from "a week of hurting". I am sure the nations in question would gladly take the pain in or to maintain the stagger and make sure the rogue gets what is coming to him.

[quote name='Masterof9puppets' timestamp='1283304913' post='2437687']The raider is one less nation that the rouge is able to nuke, ga, ac, cm, navy, anything, therefore the raider is helping the rouged alliance by saving them from losing more of their precious techs, infras, and lands [/quote] By giving him the option o possibly getting into PM you are helping the alliance he is roguing? Something seems flawed in your logic.

[quote name='DictatatorDan' timestamp='1283303599' post='2437664'] [color="#FF0000"]Just to elaborate, not that anyone needs it, or would even understand it, when an alliance raids a rouge that is actively attacking another alliance, it deprives that alliance of the ability to do maximum damage to that rouge and take care of the threat as soon as possible. Doing so means that the alliance that is being attacked incurs drastically more damage than it should.[/color][/quote] I understand it and agree completely. It's really a case of courtesy. A rogue is someone who has wronged another nation or alliance. You could at least have the decency to maintain the stageger before raiding.

Excellent speech, Emperor Cortath. Ever forward o/

You would think this would be fairly obvious, but people still do seem to have trouble with it.

o/ KungFuMasterHamster You are missed.

Long time coming, but I am glad we are finally here. o/ Red Dawn