Jump to content

Shurukian

Members
 View Profile  See their activity

  • Posts

    581

  • Joined

  • Last visited

 Content Type 

Posts posted by Shurukian

  2. The True Purpose of Protectorate Treaties

    in World Affairs (IC)

    Posted

    The better part of all protectorate treaties I have ever read usually involve more than just protection. When I founded a short-lived alliance called Imperium (as you know), The Legion (our protector), had a member stationed there in an oversight position to make sure we were running our alliance properly. Furthermore, another member came over and gave us amendments to our guides, showed us effective ways to recruit, and much more. It is more than just protection. Overall, that is a good example of a protector doing their job.

    However, since they just gave them to you, you weren't able to drum up member support and activity to get them involved in the task. Not only would they become more knowledgeable with trial and error circumstances, but they would become more involved in the community. As you remember, I was a part of SPQR, and activity was always a huge problem. So I would argue that they weren't giving you exactly what you needed, they were simply giving you what you needed so you would sit nice and quiet. An alliance can always benefit from trying their own methods to see what works and what doesn't.

    Shurukian, if you hadn't the slightest clue how to run an alliance, and you were protected by TPF, and they weren't guiding you, where would TSI be now? How can growth be encouraged if no assistance is given at all? At SPQR, and still a noob at alliance creation, Sparta promised assistance in our treaty to show us how an alliance operations. As Klaus said, we got nothing. Not even protection when we needed it. We have an issue that almost sparked war with the Socialistic Empire, instead of military preparation we got nothing. We had to diffuse the situation ourselves.

    Three things from this. First of all, if I had no clue how to lead an alliance, then I would never, ever be stupid enough to create one. When you create an alliance, you have a duty to your citizens to be able to lead them. If I didn't think I could do that, then I wouldn't hurt them in such a way. Second, as for what you've said about Sparta, I believe you've proved my last statement correct:

    If you've found no such thing in the past, maybe you're simply finding bad protectors.

    Third, the best that should have been provided to you in the situation with the Socialistic Empire was a mediator. They should not have been there as the bigger kid on the playground that tells the smaller one to sit down and shut up. If you create the issue, you should clean it up. Once they dismiss and clean up one issue, more are always to come. While they might have had more participation in the way of a third party, they shouldn't have tried to fix it for you.

    In otherwords, we were on our own. No one is asking to funnel over recruited members. No one is asking for a mock-Viceroy. Any noob alliance needs a little kick in the doopa to get moving in the right direction. Without it, the alliance is doomed to the ages.

    I would horribly disagree with this. It is always known that you should never start an alliance without at least 8-10 people who are active and willing to help. If you have a leader that is not committed to succeeding and seeing his or her alliance grow, then the alliance might as well be dead on the spot. Again, a protectorate treaty does not make your protector 'Daddy'. Every alliance must have their own experiences and views. If you're always waiting around for your protector to tell you what to do next, or to get the next guide from them, then maybe you should ask how qualified you are to be leading an alliance. Having a constant guiding hand is never good, and the protectorate simply becomes a burden to the larger alliance. Most protectorates are signed for two reasons: You either see potential in the alliance, and want to foster a new ally, or you see a naive person wanting to do something they have no knowledge for, and a possible merger of a few new members might be in store when it fails. While some alliances may have pure intentions, and a willingness to help, most do not, and that's simply how it is. Coming from TGE, Isaac, you can surely see that's true.

    However, I think we can agree that is boils down to a case by case basis. As Janax said earlier, the quality of the protector equivocates to how well the alliance will do.

    Yes, I believe it does boil down to a case by case basis. However, if you look at the protectorates that have been successful, contributing alliances, almost none of them were the kind of protectorate that was led by the hand, as you suggest a protector should do. They all had knowledgeable people with diverse experiences leading them to what they would become.

  3. The True Purpose of Protectorate Treaties

    in World Affairs (IC)

    Posted · Edited by Shurukian

    But as I am trying to point out, Protectors rarely play any role for a smaller alliance, including that of protector.

    I would have to strongly disagree. As Janax said, protectorates should not be led by the hand of their protector. Alliances should want to grow themselves, and work to encourage stability and hard work within their own alliance. If you are constantly being led and helped in everything you do, then you will never be independent, and simply be a burden on those protecting you. As a protectorate of TPF right now, I can say that we've been fully protected, and they offer any help that we ask for. However, I would never be naive enough to expect them to do my job for me. It is my responsibility to make my alliance grow and float. Not theirs. After all, they do have TPF to lead. If I cannot lead my alliance without help, then why would I every expect to become a sovereign entity?

    And as an edit, TPF has given very much to us, in the ways of guidance, but mainly in friendship. I would argue that Protectors should be the main motivating force to make an alliance want to succeed independently, by their example and friendship, not by telling them what to do and when. If you've found no such thing in the past, maybe you're simply finding bad protectors.

  5. Attention "The Phoenix Federation"

    in World Affairs (IC)

    Posted

    Alliances have always been held responsible for their past. In the case of TPF, the people who are at the centre of that (Slayer, Jbone, OBB, TBB) have either left the world entirely or are still in TPF, so I don't see why the alliance should get a clean pass for its actions.

    Yes, I understand that alliances have been held responsible for their pasts. What I'm saying, is that I see no good reason why. All it does is hamper growth and change. An alliance should be judged by their current leadership, and I see nothing destructive and terrible that mhawk has done.

  6. Attention "The Phoenix Federation"

    in World Affairs (IC)

    Posted

    I'm not talking about you. You are demanding TPF get white peace because they got beaten down good. Considering TPF's (and OPP's) penchant for picking clean the bones of defeated alliances after they are beaten down (as badly or worse than TPF's current beatdown), why should they be given such leniency?

    Okay, I'm not necessarily addressing just this post, but a few others that have been calling out TPF and OPP's past actions.

    First of all, when you look at TPF, they've seen an almost complete government switch to the former Elysium government. The same with the members in OPP. OPP currently consists of TSI, 64Digits, and possibly IRAN (I don't know what's up with that situation). In the last war, most of TSI government were at TGE. IRAN has obviously had a large government change, and 64Digits has all but ceased to exist on the political scene since HoT got wiped off the face of Bob. So for the past actions of OPP, I don't know what they are, and frankly, I don't care, because the past is the past. I refused to be defined by my treaties rather than who we are as an alliance. In the four wars that I've led alliances through, I've never asked for reparations, and unless someone does something horribly disrespectful, that trend will continue. I see no reason to get funds out of an alliance that you've beaten.

    I didn't join OPP because of the amazing history it had. I didn't know much about the history at all. TPF was an ally of TGE, and someone I naturally went to. However, anyone that knows me well can say I'm very much so a hippy, friendly, whatever, person. If TPF were continuing their past trend of actions, I wouldn't be in OPP today. However, I have faith in mhawk, and the reason I sand so staunchly behind TPF is because of how much I believe in his actions and ideals for TPF. If you'd like to call him the same as the past governments, I'd ask for examples. If the current TPF was out to hurt everything in sight, or the current OPP was, then I'm sure things would be a lot different. The idea of blaming an alliance for their past has always been an odd one to me. GOONS has reformed, but with new leadership. Should they be held to their past actions? As soon as mhawk does something to warrant the hate that TPF receives, I'll pack up my bags and find some new friends. But I don't see that happening any time soon.

    As for the peace mode issue, as in the OP, I think it's been fairly well explained that it's a tactic of war. Hell, I hit peace mode to get nukes and build up my warchest. It's amazing what five days in peace mode can do for you in a war. Especially if you're on the losing end.

    I think everyone's fought a nice fight here, and see no reason for half the trolling and fighting that's going on in this thread. But maybe that's just me.

    Fakeedit: Again Tyga, not specifically directed at you, yours was just the last post I read that mentioned the issues that were bugging me. :P

  8. The "I Don't Know Anymore" War

    in World Affairs (IC)

    Posted

    It's been said from the beginning that Karma is simply a coalition of alliances together for this war. So for those saying that this will kill Karma in the future, there will be no Karma to kill. Karma will die as soon as this war is over. I also think it's safe to say, that the next war will probably be current Karma alliances vs. other Karma alliances. While treaties are dropping and the MDP web is breaking up on the Hegemony side, it hasn't yet happened to the Karma side. And that's what the next war will probably be.

    Similarly, it doesn't matter what terms you give them. Everything grows back. All you can do is hamper it, unless you plan to full destroy them, which would just be detrimental to Bob.

  9. Hey-ho hey-ho it's off to work we go

    in Alliance Announcements (IC)

    Posted · Edited by Shurukian

    The thought of RAD made your alliance surrender. How does it feel?

    You made a miserable decision signing a treaty with a pathetic alliance in The Phoenix Federation. Pay for the decisions you've made.

    At least your leader acknowledged this mistake to some extent and surrendered.

    Time for Avalon to find this revelation. Until that time, we'll FORCE it.

    Excuse me, but I acknowledged no such thing. All I acknowledged was that TSI had put up a good fight and spent our resources. I also knew that TFO would be asking for nice reparations. My 'folding' was simply to the effect that if I wanted to be able to pay these reparations, we would have to bow out now, before RAD unleashed on us. I apologize that you see that as acknowledging that TPF is wrong in some way, because I never said such a thing. I'm proud to be a TPF protectorate, and no war will change that. TFO and IS were good partners to fight, and I wanted to ascertain that we could get them what they wanted Reparations wise. (Within reason.) I see no strategy in letting another alliance hit us simply to decimate our reserves and rendering us not only incapable of paying TFO and IS, but also having us owe reparations to RAD as well. Or perhaps you could point out the strategy in such?

    I don't really understand what you're trying to play here. First you tell me that warning me of RAD was something to help TSI, to prevent us from getting hammered. Now you're saying it was simply to make us fold? If we had 'loved our infrastructure' we would have never entered the war in the first place. I would expect that since we acted with honor towards you, and your protectorates, we would receive the same. I would hope that I am not wrong in that sentiment. You tell me you're glad we're out of the war, since you don't mind us, now you tell us we're dishonorable for surrendering?

    Twisted, you know I enjoy our conversations, but I must ask that if you have respect for me, you will have respect for my members as well, regardless of your disagreements in opinion. I would also probably suggest sober posting.

    That is all.

  10. Final Soldier Announcement

    in Alliance Announcements (IC)

    Posted · Edited by Shurukian

    After the conversation I had with AUT on IRC, I actually think that Soldier is better of disbanded, then having him come back and try to lead them again. AUT changed how Soldier worked, changed the identity of Soldier, instead of sticking up for his ideals when threatened. That is why you lost all of those active members AUT, You changed Soldier for the worse.

    magicninja, from what I've seen you did a good job at attempting to salvage soldier and clean up AUT's mess, but you got hit hard, and I'm quite sorry to see you fail.

    Soldier, you were a good alliance, and wherever you guys go, you will be greeted with open arms, as any alliance would be happy to take members of your quality and caliber.

    I would disagree. I worked closely with AUT at Soldier, and while they weren't perfect, he didn't drive them into the ground. I think that the factors of why they needed to disband can be placed on the shoulders of both AUT and Magic. AUT left to help us in Elysium, and didn't feel welcome going back. It's a very reasonable claim from Magic that he was only in the alliance two weeks, and the membership didn't know him as well, which wasn't the best move from AUT. Similarly, when you look at Soldier's nation list, you'll see a large influx of nations 13 days ago. I think Magic just needs to learn that recruiting from other planets, (OOC: Off site recruiting) may boost your numbers for a bit, but unless a government is sound and concrete, they won't be able to handle the influx of new nations.

    Edit:

    I'd also like to make the Request that AUT and Melutar stop flaming each other for once. You two give me headaches. - _ -

  15. An Announcement from The Sasori Initiative concerning the War

    in Alliance Announcements (IC)

    Posted

    You fought amazingly well TSI, I can only imagine IS and TFO had to have been amazing fighters as well to hold out for so long. :P

    j/k Good fight and good luck rebuilding everyone!

    P.S. Not too harsh of terms, I doubt these will even come close to repairing the damage TSI did to TFO, but I've only heard IS had exactly one war with TSI, so why are they getting reps???

    IS had much more than one war with us MBP, no worries. :)

  16. An Announcement from The Sasori Initiative concerning the War

    in Alliance Announcements (IC)

    Posted

    I would also like to mention that I did take Twisted telling me about RAD as an act in good faith. We've been on very good terms the past few days, and I fully understand that they would want to protect their protectorates. It didn't sound like a threat to me, and I would have reacted much less friendly if he had. It was a factor in my decision, but I found it to be helpful information, rather than a threat. I do think that an alliance is obligated to defend their Protectorates, and it was used to get us out of the war, I do understand why.

  17. An Announcement from The Sasori Initiative concerning the War

    in Alliance Announcements (IC)

    Posted

    It's funny how lies are perpetuated over and over again once its mentioned, and nothing to the contrary is acknowledged. Such is CN today.

    My query with Shurukian with irrelevant lines taken out:

    [12:33] <Shurukian[TSI]> I think if we have to give TFO 13-15k straight up with no money for it, Karma might come knocking at your door. XDDD

    [12:36] <Twisted|Away> Haha well, I want to let TFO learn and go through the process as well.. they are a good bunch, and getting that experience is crucial. I'll talk to him later either way. And I thought it was some 13k tech in tech deals?

    [12:37] <Shurukian[TSI]> Nahhh, Jens thinks it's for free. :P

    [12:38] <Twisted|Away> I thought Jens got it when he entered with:

    [12:38] <Twisted|Away> [11:31] <Jensofthedesert[TFO]> I guess we are up for the cheap tech deals for us

    [12:38] <Shurukian[TSI]> I got this-

    [12:39] <Shurukian[TSI]> 13:21… Jensofthedesert[TFO]: Shouldn'y we technically be getting it free?

    ...

    Shuru, don't forget to mention I let you know RAD was joining the party to ensure you would get out quicker..

    The logs are correct. They brought it up as their terms, I went to Twisted about it and asked them to talk to them. However, for those saying it, I guess it was the original terms.

    As for the RAD comment, yes, we can't handle a full offensive of RAD, and that was basically the reason we threw in the towel. I didn't want to bring that up, but if you want to, that's fine. We could handle TFO and IS, and wanted to continue the war. When you mentioned RAD, yes, I thought about my alliance, what that kind of attack would do to them, and what reps to a third alliance would mean.

    So there, the reasoning for TSI's surrender, all on the table. I hardly think anyone could blame me.

  20. An Announcement from The Sasori Initiative concerning the War

    in Alliance Announcements (IC)

    Posted

    I would like to mention, as an aside, that Internet Superheroes were some of the nicest people I've ever dealt with. Extraduty wanted very little, and I offered the tech deals to him as a thank you. I thank Internet Superheroes for this war, and would like to say that they are some of the best opponents we've faced. Not only did they fight well, but Extra personally helped us out with a few problems during the war. I would ask that no one troll them, and that they be held in good regard, because they are honorable people.

  21. An Announcement from The Sasori Initiative concerning the War

    in Alliance Announcements (IC)

    Posted · Edited by Shurukian

    30627770.png

    FLAF.jpgIsflag.jpg

    There is a time in every alliance's life where they must fight, and sometimes, surrender. It has come that time for TSI. The terms are as follows.

    TSI will remain neutral for the rest of the war, and will not aid any nations involved in the war. All violations of this will be taken on an individual basis, and treated as an act of war.

    All damages done after the update of May 5th/May 6th will be added or subtracted to the reparations, depending on the offending party.

    TSI will pay the following at the total of 6,500 technology and 60 million

    - 2,300 technology at 3 million per 150 to TFO

    - 1,400 technology at 3 million per 150 to IS

    - 1,700 technology at 3 million per 100 to TFO

    - 1,100 technology at 3 million per 100 to IS

    - 250 technology, bought by Shurukian, at the rate of 3 million per 50 from TFO

    - 250 technology, bought by Shurukian, at the rate of 3 million per 50 from IS

    - 250 technology, bought by Tokugawa Mitsukuni, at the rate of 3 million per 50 from TFO

    - 250 technology, bought by Tokugawa Mitsukuni, at the rate of 3 million per 50 from IS

    Extraduty and Shurukian will continue their war until midday, May the 5th, on the basis that neither nation has been nuked, and both would like pop each other's nuke cherries.

    I would like to mention that Tokugawa and I have elected to take on the individual tech deals to lessen strain on the alliance, and were not demaded by IS or TFO. Both have been good opponents in war, and TSI has been able to make a few friends in the mentioned alliances. We wish them all the best in the future.

    Signed for the Sasori Initiative:

    Shurukian, Empress

    Tokugawa Mitsukuni, Minister of Defense

    Kharn420, Minister of Foreign Affairs

    Signed for Internet Superheroes:

    Extraduty, Master of Army, Intelligence, and Murder

    King Xander the Only, Lord of Lolitics

    Sakura, Lord of Nightmares

    Signed for The Forsaken Ones:

    JensoftheDesert, Emperor

    Edit::

    Since the posts are all burried now, I would like to mention that Extraduty has been a huge help throughout this war, and I do believe that he is a wonderful leader for IS that has an honorable commander. THD of TFO has also been a wonderful person in this, and it's saddening that he missed the talks today. Similarly, Twisted has been a good help in this war, and has kept it friendly. I thank all three of them for this. I have large amounts of respect for both parties receiving the reps, which is part of the reason why they were accepted.

  23. Get your warslots here!!!

    in Open World RP

    Posted

    Slayer, I'll miss you. Hopefully you'll stick around on IRC so I can bug you every now and then.

    To some of the attacks in this thread, just wow. You go after a guy for this, and then level the same amount of attacks at him. If anything, that just makes you worse. There's absolutely no need for it whatsoever. Want to be bitter about an online game? Get off the internet.

×
×
  • Create New...