Orkules

Yes, we felt you deserved to feel pain for the agony, destruction, and sorrow you have inflicted upon hundreds of players. However, the reparations, as has been stated repeatedly, is more to slow your rebuilding than anything also. It also acts a a symbolic gesture.

Kind of hard to be that monster when you don't win.

Do you even read what we post? Like seriously, do you? Cause I don't think anyone in Vanguard seriously asked for Valhalla to give us reps while not being at war with us.

Besides us being heavily engaged fighting NPO? I think we also have no treaties allowing us to hit you.

Kick $@! bro. Good luck.

1. Many of their larger members are represented there yes. 2. That is not remotely comparable. I do not consider restricting outside aid as anything beyond light terms, barely above white peace. In fact, it's so close I call it that for ease of reference. This is because it does almost nothing to restrict their regrowth. Not to mention, restricting outside aid doesn't do much considering their allies conditions. 3. Did we ever claim that? I honestly don't know which is worse. I know the combination of both, however, does a fair job of slowing things down. You are fighting alongside us, and have worked with this in our coalition. You are friends of friends (I think). We would like to see some consideration. At the very least, you could have reacted graciously to our objections. You did not. You insulted us, called us monsters, and made it seem like we were insane for revenge. It does not please us.

I think a combination of the two would have restricted their aid slots and decreased their warchests as they have to rebuy even more tech than before. Quite simply, Valhalla, like many alliances is this war, was smart and had warchests. Big warchests. Half of the use of a warchest is the rebuild later. With nothing decreasing their internal slots and forcing them to rebuy sent out tech to further decrease warchests they can sky rocket in strength.

It also took NPO, TPF, the OPP, UPN, and UCN to take down TDSM8. Who's the badass now?

Please...die in a fire.

Ok, I can't believe I'm the one doing this...but this is a bit absurd even for me. Mhawk's Phoenix Federation does not deserve any blame or grudges based on Total Farkistan. They're not even the same alliance. I don't think any off TF!'s leadership still remains. Pulling TPF from UjW is a fairly silly stretch as far as I am concerned, once again the leadership possibly even membership is no longer present. Don't blame them for their actions, especially not those of TF! I'm all for and completely ok with grudges and holding people responsible for their actions but that is stretching WAY too far, even for me.

A lot of UjP members hold grudges against TPF for bailing on us and more or less leading to the annihilation of the Unjust Path during the war.

I think I may have been. As I said in the bit I editted in, I only bring this up because I don't want people claiming things that aren't true. Given the love for PZI (especially for those reasons) at the time I am honestly not too surprised it happened even if I think it was bull. I know I'm bitter, I know I hold grudges. Be where I have been and see if you don't. But I am hoping to move past them after this, even if it will be hard for me.

Not really no. There were indeed some offensive joke pictures involved and the nazi mudkips are true (old gift from a friend in NoR, had to do with a joke we had about nazi mudkips in their military or some such shenanigans). I think there are others who you PZI'd but I cannot say for certain. The term was so common then I honestly stopped keeping track of it long before it happened to me. Mhawk, I had to delete my nation and hide my identity. I'm sure you can understand why there would be some badblood on my end. My posts are more in concern to those claiming it never happened. I know you know what happened and I know that you do not support this anymore. I'm not trying to insult you, I'm not trying to make you seem evil. I will, however, call people out and provide evidence if I see them lying or saying something that isn't true through lack of knowledge. I openly admit that I am a bitter player and that I have more trouble than I should letting the past go, it is something I'm working on. As I said with Valhalla, I hope that you guys truly have changed or are willing to not allow friends to get away with the things they used to do, whichever fits you best. After this war I will give you that benefit of the doubt, especially given the honor and courage you have shown. That does not mean I think you should get off scott-free but you shouldn't get hit too terribly hard (I actually wanted Valhalla to get hurt more than you guys, as I've said you helped TDSM8 on several occasions). Once this is over, I'll do my best to move past my feelings of you based on the past, is that fair?

Also, to those of you still doubting whether TPF has ever enacted perma-ZI I give you this for your viewing pleasure: http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=12359 Term #9 is the one we're looking for I believe.

Valhalla forced the situation that led to it but I was in fact on TPF and Elysium's PZI lists. I have never been on Valhalla's list. Slayer was the one who told me if he ever found out who I rerolled as he would come for me, mhawk is the one who threatened me after misunderstanding that led to me revealing my identity. Did I say you deserve disbandment? No. Actually I would say aside from Echelon you, of the remaining parties, deserve the least. You and Echelon probably deserve a bad beating and a good bit of reps. However, none of you deserve disbandment as I believe nobody deserves that forced on them no matter the crime. I hold supporting your allies against you because of your allies actions, not because you honored your agreement. That you were true to your word doesn't change the fact that you allied yourselves to, and supported the actions of, monsters. I want TPF to stay. I want them to come back and I want them to change. But I also want them to pay a bit for what they did and I have never advocated white peace for everyone. Do you deserve to get beaten up a bit? Yes. Do you deserve some terms? Yes. Do you deserve something more than a tiny bit of terms? Yes. Do you deserve disbandment? No. Do you deserve utter annihilation? No. If my earlier post gave you the impression I thought you deserved as much as NPO I am sorry, not my intention. Stop twisting my words. I am honestly tired of you guys doing that to us.

I also recall him forcing an inspection of our forums and my perma-ZI.

Hi, I'm somebody who TPF perma-ZI'd. In truth I was eternal ZI'd, they just had the exact same name at the time. Stop with the "We never did it!" stuff. Also, I would definitely say that I openly and vocally disagreed with the terms given to Old Guard and Valhalla, as did many others. They deserved worse. MCXA is admittedly the one of you that I cared the least about and GGA frankly I don't see as a threat even if we hadn't touched them, let alone forcing them to rebuild with terms. I think you deserve worse even if just for helping the NPO so well and loyally while they did what they did. As for how I sound...not entirely sure what you mean but I assume it's the harsh terms and the like. Well you people do deserve it. But you won't get it because we, and I am included in this, don't believe in that kind of thing. You will get a reasonable amount of terms but they will not be ridiculous or over the top, even if true Karma or retribution would demand it.

I suppose it might. Just as much as TPF caving to Valhalla for TDSM8's surrender terms during the BAPS War.

You make it very hard for me to believed the "Valhalla reformed!" bull that's floated through this thread. Good job.

Yes because saying no when NPO comes a knocking was so healthy for alliances at that time. Actually kind of why we're here.

Yes, because that will make them learn not to pull this again if they get the chance. It'll teach them very well. They need some terms, the deserve punishment. Yes, many of those on our side did some of this as well but they are trying to make that right. To make things even worse for you, some of those you keep bringing up actually did not want to enact the terms they did in the last war. An excellent example is the majority of alliances fighting CnG (VE especially since you people love mentioning them so much) wanted to give us white peace and planned to until NPO showed up and forced harder terms.

Zero infrastructure, zero tech, and all of their cash sent to us. At the point they will have come close to paying for their crimes. That is what they deserve. It isn't what they're going to get.

You guys rock

Hi, I'm a person who TPF PZI'd (though it was called that, at the time people still called EZI PZI, so it was the other in truth). I was forced to reroll and then prevented from telling my friends who I was. Nice to meet you both, please tell me of this fictional TPF that never had a P/EZI list. Now, to be fair Slayer did give me a private agreement not to track me or search for me if I rerolled. However, if he found out who I was he promised he WOULD come for me. Mhawk honored this agreement and after a misunderstanding in which I mistakenly believed myself off this apparently non-existent list and put my old name on my profile, he threatened me with renewed war if I did not remove the name from the profile.

Vox, you did something no other could have done. You truly started the process that led us here and your unrelenting spirit kept the movement alive until the day where your goals could finally be realized. I am proud to have fought alongside your alliance in two wars. I will miss you guys. I would have joined you when TDSM8 but for my desire to help keep the alliance alive. I almost joined again when TDSM8 got ready to disband. I don't remember who I told but they talked me out of it. I would have been honored to call you brothers. Good luck.