Samwise Posted October 1, 2012 Report Share Posted October 1, 2012 [quote name='Stonewall Jaxon' timestamp='1348563479' post='3033916'] I now await excitedly the upcoming Neutricide [/quote] Original. And a little funny coming from someone sitting in hippy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightmare448 Posted October 1, 2012 Report Share Posted October 1, 2012 Haters gonna hate, and talkers gonna talk. Nightmare is gonna bash you pixel lovers when NPO declares war in less than two weeks. Marneus Calgar is my !@#$%*. Love me or hate me, i hate you. Woooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Systemfailure Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 [quote name='nightmare448' timestamp='1349134432' post='3036390'] Haters gonna hate, and talkers gonna talk. Nightmare is gonna bash you pixel lovers when NPO declares war in less than two weeks. Marneus Calgar is my !@#$%*. Love me or hate me, i hate you. Woooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo [/quote] http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=417054 Bring It Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brehon Posted October 2, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 When this world speaks of Francoism, I find they really don't know much about it. I apologize for that and will in turn make it a focus of mine for all of you. I have been told in the past I have a duty and a responsibility to Bob. I take that seriously and as such, I will be sharing my thoughts and understandings. How does this affect this thread and discussion? The ending result, the point and the meaning of this impending war are all rooted in Francoism and by simple definition Bringing Order to Chaos. Each day from now until the Declaration of War, I will share with you the piece and points. In this we can better understand one another and while we are at it have some fun. We are at Day 10. Tomorrow the first in the series begins. o/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bakamitai Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 Hail Order! Hail Francoism! Hail Pacifica! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magicninja Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 October revolution eh? Sounds....like baka sucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alterego Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Starfox101' timestamp='1348986751' post='3035863'] It has only been suspended. Never forget that. [/quote] I think its been made clear that vox will only ever be an anti-NPO movement and cared more about hurting that alliance than freedom. I think every member was someone that came up against NPO in the old days and lost. I doubt you will have popular support next time because your message of fighting oppression is a lie. Your true message is we hate NPO. Edited October 2, 2012 by Alterego Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CodFCS Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 You're gonna huff and puff, and make a big blow? [img]http://www.big-t-shirts.com/ProdImages/big/1086.jpg[/img] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewie Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 My body is ready Brehon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omfghi2u2 Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 Cant wait to see what is going to happen. -omfg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernhard Klein Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 (edited) How does a Francoist reconcile conflict to the end of "bringing order to chaos" if said conflict gives rise to precisely the antithesis of security from "war and fear" he so adamantly espouses? Or is it that the chaos of consolidation (i.e. bringing order) is for the greater good and thus deemed an acceptable - necessary even - form of chaos? I stumbled across Vladimir's essay, [i]The Morality of War[/i], and was hoping that it would answer this question. I'd love to hear a "modern" Francoist's answer. Edit: To clarify, I am not a so-called "moralist." I merely wish to understand as I may yet be swayed. Edited October 2, 2012 by BKlein Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bombuator Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 [quote name='Brehon' timestamp='1349153422' post='3036515'] When this world speaks of Francoism, I find they really don't know much about it. I apologize for that and will in turn make it a focus of mine for all of you. I have been told in the past I have a duty and a responsibility to Bob. I take that seriously and as such, I will be sharing my thoughts and understandings. How does this affect this thread and discussion? The ending result, the point and the meaning of this impending war are all rooted in Francoism and by simple definition Bringing Order to Chaos. Each day from now until the Declaration of War, I will share with you the piece and points. In this we can better understand one another and while we are at it have some fun. We are at Day 10. Tomorrow the first in the series begins. o/ [/quote] You must be very confident who you are going to roll [quote name='bakamitai' timestamp='1349153644' post='3036520'] Hail Order! Hail Francoism! Hail Pacifica! [/quote] You should change your sig to "October Revolution" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeros Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Vorenus' timestamp='1349062369' post='3036169'] Bob doesn't need Vox Populi. Bob needs a maelstrom to rise up, crush Pacifica permanently, and salt the Red Sphere as the appetizer to the wanton obliteration of anything and everything mortal. The screams and tears of the self-congratulatory pretentious moralists would, of course, act as dessert in this wonderful meal. [/quote] I would worry about other people, and not moralists, if such an effort were to be undertaken. NPO has done a lot to move away from its past. You could possibly have gotten away with such a crusade a couple years ago. Now however, color me skeptical. Of course, if you think you are willing to walk through the maelstrom of war to see this done, then I say go for it. Bob is boring and none of the alliances seem to have any overarching goals. Mind you, I am of the opinion your chances of succeeding in this crusade are about zero. Edited October 2, 2012 by Aeros Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrenster Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 [quote name='Vorenus' timestamp='1349062369' post='3036169'] Bob doesn't need Vox Populi. Bob needs a maelstrom to rise up, crush Pacifica permanently, and salt the Red Sphere as the appetizer to the wanton obliteration of anything and everything mortal. The screams and tears of the self-congratulatory pretentious moralists would, of course, act as dessert in this wonderful meal. [/quote] I support this. Will you take up the charge? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alterego Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 [quote name='Jrenster' timestamp='1349210491' post='3036716'] I support this. Will you take up the charge? [/quote] ask him why the hate. at 210 days old he has no clue why he is calling for that unless he is someone else Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cortath Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 (edited) [quote name='mmansfield68' timestamp='1349063379' post='3036170'] I agree with the former, but with regard to the latter, I should like to clarify a grilling before the eating. That [i]WOULD[/i] be garish! [/quote] I prefer my babies a la crue. [quote name='BKlein' timestamp='1349207351' post='3036686'] How does a Francoist reconcile conflict to the end of "bringing order to chaos" if said conflict gives rise to precisely the antithesis of security from "war and fear" he so adamantly espouses? Or is it that the chaos of consolidation (i.e. bringing order) is for the greater good and thus deemed an acceptable - necessary even - form of chaos? I stumbled across Vladimir's essay, [i]The Morality of War[/i], and was hoping that it would answer this question. I'd love to hear a "modern" Francoist's answer. [/quote] You can find many "modern" Francoists essays here: [url="http://cybernations.wikia.com/wiki/Francoist_Papers"]http://cybernations....rancoist_Papers[/url] in the Francoist papers. In particular, [i]A Primer on Francoism[/i] was written by an outstandingly good looking man. To answer your question more fully really doesn't require a "modern" answer, but something that's been articulated before. The world in a state of nature is a chaotic one. A nation born on this world lives without security and without real freedom. For while they are unencumbered by another sovereign, their freedom is restricted by the politics of our barbarous world. A young nation adrift in the sea of some new sphere will immediately fall prey to tech raiders, and be unable to grow their action, or realistically act with the full freedom of actions given them at creation. Nations such as these are forced to give up their sovereignty to a greater power, who offers them freedom of action in exchange for the unification of nations' sovereignty in the person of an autocrat, an Emperor. Now the word "autocrat" speaks profoundly to the form of government we have. The etymology of the word means "self-ruler." While the solitary nation is a self-ruler, its ability to act as it would will is constrained by our chaotic world. It is a self-ruler in name only; a farce perpetuated by the cruel world into which we are born. However, the Francoist Emperor, united in his person the sovereignty of all nations of Pacifica, is truly an autocrat, a self-ruler as the world means. The Emperor, can protect those who have unified their sovereignty in him, and in thus giving up a part of their sovereignty, they gain true freedom. That, is of course, only one side of the coin of Francoism, but it's not one you've asked a question about, so I will refrain from speaking of the unification of wisdom in an Emperor. I have written about that topic before. How does one reconcile conflict? I don't quite know where one finds in Vladimir's fine work, [i]The Morality of War[/i], any sort of refutation of using war as a tool for the primary moral (and existential) duty of alliances: to protect collective security. Not all alliances functions as mine does: others attempt to achieve collective security through less effective forms of government, but ultimately, all alliances maintain that same moral imperative. War is neither moral nor immoral as such: it advances the security interests of an alliance, or it does not. While one might think that "bringing Order to Chaos" is an abstraction, it is not. One might make the calculation that engaging in such a struggle in the short-term far more greatly benefits an alliance's security in the long-term than lying back and waiting what the morrow will bring. Bringing Order to Chaos, is also, of course, the fundamental tenet of Francoism as I articulated above: the unification of sovereignty of disparate and separate nations into a single sovereign removes them from the state of chaos of nature and gives them true freedom of action. Edited October 2, 2012 by Cortath Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sounion Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 so dramatic. why not tell us now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cortath Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 [quote name='sounion' timestamp='1349215550' post='3036774'] so dramatic. why not tell us now? [/quote] That wouldn't be much sport, now would it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Buscemi Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 [quote name='BKlein' timestamp='1349207351' post='3036686'] How does a Francoist reconcile conflict to the end of "bringing order to chaos" if said conflict gives rise to precisely the antithesis of security from "war and fear" he so adamantly espouses? Or is it that the chaos of consolidation (i.e. bringing order) is for the greater good and thus deemed an acceptable - necessary even - form of chaos? I stumbled across Vladimir's essay, [i]The Morality of War[/i], and was hoping that it would answer this question. I'd love to hear a "modern" Francoist's answer. Edit: To clarify, I am not a so-called "moralist." I merely wish to understand as I may yet be swayed. [/quote] You monster! Look what you made Cortath do! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
queenhailee Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 [quote name='Vorenus' timestamp='1349062369' post='3036169'] Bob doesn't need Vox Populi. Bob needs a maelstrom to rise up, crush Pacifica permanently, and salt the Red Sphere as the appetizer to the wanton obliteration of anything and everything mortal. The screams and tears of the self-congratulatory pretentious moralists would, of course, act as dessert in this wonderful meal. [/quote] You'd save Brehon a lot of work if you'd go ahead with this. And NPO's allies would probably name all their first born after you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernhard Klein Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 [quote]To answer your question more fully really doesn't require a "modern" answer, but something that's been articulated before.[/quote] Forgive me, perhaps I expected that the ideology might have undergone some revision/divergence (intentional or not) over the years since that work was produced. [quote]I don't quite know where one finds in Vladimir's fine work, [i]The Morality of War[/i], any sort of refutation of using war as a tool for the primary moral (and existential) duty of alliances: to protect collective security.[/quote] You're quite correct: the legitimacy of war is not refuted in TMW. I was just curious as to how broadly the Order is willing to interpret the concept of "security." I guess time shall show us shortly. In any case, your answer clarified a few other questions that I had, so thank you for your time. I'll quit bugging y'alls now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cortath Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 [quote name='BKlein' timestamp='1349219355' post='3036801'] Forgive me, perhaps I expected that the ideology might have undergone some revision/divergence (intentional or not) over the years since that work was produced.[/quote] That's quite alright. Francoism is an utilitarian ideology that only recognizes value in efficacy. When the material conditions of our world change, those institutions that no longer serve our purposes must be discarded and new institutions, better suited to challenges of modernity, must be constructed in their place. It is not incorrect or wrong to re-examine our values and ideologies to ensure that they still serve the purposes and goals against which they were originally measured. [quote]You're quite correct: the legitimacy of war is not refuted in TMW. I was just curious as to how broadly the Order is willing to interpret the concept of "security." I guess time shall show us shortly. In any case, your answer clarified a few other questions that I had, so thank you for your time. I'll quit bugging y'alls now.[/quote] Security, is of course, an idea, and there is no universally agreed upon measuring stick. Circumstances for all alliances are different. Some are weak; others strong. Some are resolute; others timid. Each alliance's individual material conditions will dictate how it views its security, what strategies it will use to achieve security, and what tactics are appropriate to achieve such a strategy. The key to understanding this world is to be able to understand those three things and upon placing a rational actor at its center, evaluate the choices before you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hormones74 Posted October 3, 2012 Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 [quote name='Alterego' timestamp='1349210792' post='3036721'] ask him why the hate. at 210 days old he has no clue why he is calling for that unless he is someone else [/quote] He is someone else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brehon Posted October 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 Ardent and stalwart; these are the two descriptors with which we begin our very first steps of self realization, as we look to make sense of our inner chaos. This very chaos keeps us from progressing, growing, or evolving and thus, becomes our first "war." During this process, building blocks are found and used to begin creating and forming our reality. Francoism demands a process of constant re-evaluation and self-examination. Have we escaped from the primordial chaos of creation? If we have, has the world, in changing, chained us once again? Truth is discovered and creates the first layer of skin. Each layer you go through is internal, personal, and quite often passionate. Too often we look to bypass this step because it is uncomfortable, difficult, and painful, but the first step has to be made and it has to be done through individual determination. Never be afraid of your own personal revolution. Thus, today, with nine days remaining, we acknowledge that journey. Tomorrow we touch on tempering those lessons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Stuart Posted October 3, 2012 Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 Been awhile since I have seen Francoism talked about so openly. I have to say, I approve, it's been far too long. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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