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The Undefeated


Haflinger

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I see this little confusion has flared up again, in the Sanction Race no less. <_<

The name Invicta, which is Latin for "undefeated", doesn't mean "never lost." It's the OOC motto of Kent, which is the home of one of our founders.

If it really meant what you think it means, we'd have had to give it up the first time an Invicta member lost a ground battle. Which I lost one of, I think, in the SOLID war last year.

Wikipedia has a lot more information on our name. I will note that a conditional surrender is mentioned there, right in the freaking article.

Which, like it or not, is what Invicta got. We were offered a white peace, turned it down, twice, the second time we were approached we made a counteroffer which we expected to be refused, and it was accepted. That's what happened.

You can ask Näktergal. She figured it out.

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Haf's right. I would also like to add that I have never taken our use of the word "undefeated" as being literal. It means undefeated in spirit. Think of it like the movie "Rocky." At the end of the film, Rocky actually lost the big fight . But he was not "defeated." That's really the essence of what we're trying to capture in that slogan.

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Yay, I get a mention! :P

Though, literal meanings aside, I'm still fuzzy on how someone can accomplish every goal they had going into a war, totally rescue the people they went in to defend, and get out without having to pay a single rep or meet a single term, yet be considered "defeated" at all. :wacko:

Sure, it may have bordered on a Pyrrhic victory... but if you get everything you wanted and walk away bent but not broken, is it really a loss?

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So, the fact that Invicta just happened to decide to change its motto from "Glory to the Undefeated" to "A Spirit Undefeated" after the first war that it lost - sorry, didn't win - after nearly two years of barraging friends and enemies alike with "Glory to the Undefeated" was just an unhappy coincidence?

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Yay, I get a mention! :P

Though, literal meanings aside, I'm still fuzzy on how someone can accomplish every goal they had going into a war, totally rescue the people they went in to defend, and get out without having to pay a single rep or meet a single term, yet be considered "defeated" at all. :wacko:

Sure, it may have bordered on a Pyrrhic victory... but if you get everything you wanted and walk away bent but not broken, is it really a loss?

I wouldn't say Invcita got everything they wanted. Surely the loss of NS was not wanted.

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Yay, I get a mention! :P

Though, literal meanings aside, I'm still fuzzy on how someone can accomplish every goal they had going into a war, totally rescue the people they went in to defend, and get out without having to pay a single rep or meet a single term, yet be considered "defeated" at all. :wacko:

Sure, it may have bordered on a Pyrrhic victory... but if you get everything you wanted and walk away bent but not broken, is it really a loss?

I wouldn't say Invcita got everything they wanted. Surely the loss of NS was not wanted.

Look again at our stats. We're well over a million NS bigger than we were before the war.

Several of our allies lost NS, and that makes us sad. But that happens in war, we were frankly expecting to be a 500K alliance when the war was done.

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