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The Death of Cyber Nations


Iotupa

911 views

Until the thread has been replaced, I will leave my words here for people to read and comment on.

The Death of Cyber Nations comes not at the hands of the NPO...no, it comes at the hands of all of those who have allowed the NPO to continue its dirty underhanded tactics, its back stabbings, and its systematic removal and banning of the players of this game. This has led to a community that is dirty, underhanded, dishonorable, and not unlike the cesspools of The Internet, those that once had an alliance here. A community that has degenerated so far that the staff of the Cyber Nations wiki would threaten anyone who would attempt to remove anything not related to CN, so long as the unrelated information was created by Pacifica. A community that has degenerated so far that people are seen applauding suicide in the Water Cooler, going so far as to ask for nude pictures of the deceased. What we once decried as terrible actions by the likes of GOONS, /b/, LUE, we now see Pacifica and friends doing openly and without reproach.

Alliances like the GGA, once proud and honorable, now nothing more than a shell bent to the will of the IO staff of Pacifica. Alliances like Viridia, proclaiming their hatred of eternal ZI, stand by as their closest allies continue to control the ability of people, PEOPLE, to play this game. Not numbers, not pixels, PEOPLE. A job once left to the moderation staff and admin has been taken by alliances.

To all of you, all of the players, all of the people, out there, I apologize. I apologize for allowing myself to remain blind for so long...so long. I apologize for allowing myself to be a part of this machine, to actively police the eternal-ZI lists of my one time allies, to make sure that our "enemies" did not come back to enjoy this game again.

And to my friends...I apologize to you, as well. I apologize for allowing my flaws and crooked past in the machine to bring about both the downfall of our alliances, and the downfall of our nations.

And to those whom have wronged me, Derek Jones, ironchef, tearowe, BearerofTruth, ALdbeign, Emperor Lester II...I apologize to you for allowing my bullheadedness to make my decisions for me. I should never have resigned from Triumvir to Elder Statesman prior to you betraying me. If I had remained Triumvir, perhaps I could have exposed further what I told you then, and what has been proven now: Bilrow was and has been an agent of the New Pacific Order, with nothing but Pacifica's interests at heart. I let down the Grand Global Alliance. I let you down, old friends.

To ironchef: I thought that you had changed...your words screamed change. But I was blinded...blinded by hope, I suppose. The hope that perhaps one day the GGA would be returned to its former glory, after the shell that is there now was absorbed by Pacifica. But I should have listened to my head, rather than my heart, as only a day later you had returned to the GGA at the behest of Pacifica, to rip out what little heart she had left. You repeated your actions, once again, only this time not to me, but to shaneprice. He was the only hope for the GGA...now there is none.

These logs are unaltered in any way other than to remove conversational pieces that had outside information or information not relevant to the CN conversation. They come from the two or three days prior to ironchef being recalled to the GGA at the NPO's behest.

[22:47] <ironchef> also I left because I knew Aldb and Sog would not make the move they had pland till i was out of the way

[22:47] <Jonathan_Brookbank> What move was that?

[22:47] <Jonathan_Brookbank> I haven't kept up with CN much.

[22:47] <ironchef> after Bilrow left

[22:48] <ironchef> Aldb !@#$@#$ lost it

[22:48] <ironchef> he had a list of members he wated out so bil would come back

[22:48] <ironchef> even after Bilrow told him he was never comeing back

[22:48] <ironchef> he kept it up

[22:49] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Bilrow has been NPO for far longer than he has been wearing the AA.

[22:49] <ironchef> I got a copy of his list

[22:49] <ironchef> and gave it to the Tri

[22:49] <ironchef> but because of who Aldb is they didnt feel it would be good to kick him for what eh was doing

[22:50] <ironchef> so he got censerd for it

[22:50] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Who was he looking at

[22:50] <ironchef> well after he was told Bilrow would not come back

[22:50] <ironchef> him and Sog put a plan in place to kill the GGA

[22:50] <ironchef> form th inside

[22:50] <ironchef> one long time member after the next

[22:51] <Jonathan_Brookbank> You should have let him do it.

[22:51] <ironchef> he even went after tearowe

[22:51] <Jonathan_Brookbank> GGA is worthless anymore.

[22:51] <ironchef> called her a spy

[22:51] <Jonathan_Brookbank> A sad shell of its former self.

[22:51] <ironchef> and after about 20 long time members had left

[22:51] <ironchef> and there was nothing I could do to stop it

[22:51] <ironchef> I left

[22:51] <ironchef> and I told the Tri

[22:51] <ironchef> just watch

[22:51] <ironchef> one of them will let it out

[22:52] <ironchef> they will tell you the GGA is dead

[22:52] <ironchef> and needs to merge with NPO

[22:52] <ironchef> about 2 weeks after I was gone Sog said it

[22:52] <Jonathan_Brookbank> ALd actually supports this NPO now?

[22:52] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Wow, he has lost it.

[22:52] <ironchef> they should have kicked the two of them

[22:52] <ironchef> yes he does

[22:53] <ironchef> and its sad

[23:12] <ironchef> as for Valhalla it is closer to NpO, TORN, TPF and GGA than it is to NPO

[23:13] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Valhalla close to NpO?

[23:13] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Never thought I'd hear those words.

[23:13] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Unless killing was in there "Valhalla is close to wanting to kill NpO"

[23:13] <ironchef> Valhalla was one of the first to sign a treaty with them after the Hyperion war

[23:13] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Yes.

[23:14] <Jonathan_Brookbank> But NpO is not the old NpO, so I suppose it makes sense.

[23:14] <Jonathan_Brookbank> NpO is ran by the NPO controlled government.

[23:14] <Jonathan_Brookbank> So meh.

[23:14] <ironchef> CJ and Grub have become good friens

[23:14] <ironchef> *friends

[23:14] <ironchef> and your right

[23:14] <ironchef> NpO is a strong alliance

[23:15] <ironchef> good members that are true to NpO

[23:15] <ironchef> I have so much respect for all of them

[23:15] <ironchef> they pulled together got reps payed I never thought they could

[23:15] <ironchef> and didnt have members run off after the war

[23:16] <ironchef> they all worked together to get it done

[23:16] <ironchef> and are a proud strong group of people

[23:16] <Jonathan_Brookbank> You should get cj to leave Continuum.

[23:17] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Make a bloc with those others.

[23:17] <ironchef> Continuum is a shadow of what it onec was

[23:17] <Jonathan_Brookbank> That it is.

[23:17] <ironchef> and he did make one'the duck roll block

[23:17] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Who is in that

[23:18] <ironchef> IRON, TORN, TPF, and another alliance

[23:18] <ironchef> I would have to look

[23:18] <ironchef> but NPO was not asked to join

[23:18] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Well why don't those alliances leave Continuum

[23:19] <Jonathan_Brookbank> So many blocs is annoying

[23:19] <ironchef> because Gramlins left Con.

[23:19] <Jonathan_Brookbank> So why does that mean no one else can leave

[23:19] <ironchef> and in no wa

y do they want to look like they suport any action gram makes

[23:20] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Why is that

[23:21] <ironchef> Molon Labe is the other one in Duck roll

[23:21] <ironchef> there are reasons

[23:21] <ironchef> I cant realy say

[23:23] <Jonathan_Brookbank> aka Gramlins is next on the curbstomp list lol

[23:26] <ironchef> I dont know

[23:26] <Jonathan_Brookbank> lol

[23:26] <ironchef> but I do know they have been pushing for war

[23:26] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Gramlins has?

[23:27] <ironchef> there is just trouble there

[23:27] <Jonathan_Brookbank> I don't believe that for a second.

[23:27] <ironchef> yep

[23:27] <ironchef> !@#$ JB they have been pushing GGA for one over a year now

[23:27] <ironchef> not becasue they give a !@#$ about GGA

[23:27] <Jonathan_Brookbank> ironchef, GGA definitely pushed Gramlins first, lol

[23:28] <ironchef> but becasue of the friends GGA has

[23:28] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Bilrow was going to attack CTC for the hell of it

[23:28] <ironchef> true

[23:28] <Jonathan_Brookbank> GGA was going to force Gramlins off green when we signed Dilrow

[23:28] <ironchef> but I'm taking after the Bilrow thing

[23:28] <ironchef> just little things

[23:28] <Jonathan_Brookbank> I mean, GGA definitely started the issues with Gramlins

[23:28] <ironchef> Gramlins has no issue with GGA

[23:29] <ironchef> they would just use them to get the war going

[23:29] <Jonathan_Brookbank> We'll have to agree to disagree on this.

[23:29] <ironchef> their issue is with NPO

[23:29] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Gramlins isn't looking for a fight with anyone.

[23:29] <ironchef> no that they are the only one

[23:29] <Jonathan_Brookbank> But they will defend if they are attacked.

[23:29] <ironchef> *not

[23:29] <ironchef> things are changeing Jonathan

[23:30] <ironchef> people are not as close to NPO as one would think

[23:30] <ironchef> and like NpO all it will take is one big $%&@ up to get them killed

[23:30] <ironchef> Moo knows this I'm sure

[23:31] <ironchef> how could he not feel it

[20:03] <ironchef> degen is a good man

[20:03] <ironchef> and will do what he feels is the right thing

[20:03] <ironchef> even if NPO is not happy about it

[20:04] <ironchef> the GGA is makeing new forums

[20:04] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Yes

[20:04] <Jonathan_Brookbank> I've been upset about Bilrow's access forever

[20:04] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Did they kick him out of their IRC channels yet?

[20:05] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Prodigal_Mischief, I mean.

[20:05] <ironchef> Bilrow got pissed about something kenkolk did and took the roster

[20:05] <ironchef> he is not in any of the Gov chans

[20:05] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Yeah, kenfolk told me he got kicked out

[20:05] <ironchef> Moo made him give the roster back

[20:05] <ironchef> well the kick was for something he just did last week

[20:06] <ironchef> but this was last month that Bilrow got all pissy

[20:06] <ironchef> I think it was BS he got kicked

[20:06] <ironchef> but its good he is not there now

[20:07] <ironchef> an alliance like GGA is not good for him

[20:07] <ironchef> he likes to tlak !@#$ on IRC way to much

To New Polar Order: I forgive you. I forgive you for allowing yourself to be puppets of the GGA, NPO, and IRON, to betray your word and the bond of a treaty with an ally. But remember what those people you now once again call your allies have done to you. It would be wise to evaluate your leadership, as they may not be for your growth, but instead the growth of Pacifica once again.

To IRON: I remember you...the real you...the truly Independent Republic of Orange Nations. That is dead and gone now, your onetime leaders, after admitting to me yours and their puppetry, prove it by moving into the domain of the puppet master. Your current leadership is a sham, lacking in honor in any sense of the word.

  • FinsterBaby, an IRON Council member - After attempting to talk to him regarding my status on their banned players list, FinsterBaby went so far to say that he wanted me to die...an in character hatred that, for him, apparently has grown to include real life death wishes.
    [22:07] <FinsterBaby[iRON]> You're scum, we don't like you, we want you dead.
  • iamthey, an IRON Council member - After informing me that they followed the wishes of their allies when it comes to their banned players from CN list, he still sees no issue when shown that the only ally that they are following is Pacifica...all of their other allies have seen fit to allow me to play Cyber Nations once more. He also did not care that his fellow councilperson had told me he wanted me to die.

[22:02] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Hello, sir.

[22:08] <Iamthey[iRON]> Good evening

[22:08] <Jonathan_Brookbank> You are IRON council, correct?

[22:08] <Iamthey[iRON]> Yes

[22:09] <Jonathan_Brookbank> May I ask you a question?

[22:09] <Jonathan_Brookbank> I attempted to talk to Finster, but he appears angry and unlikely to answer.

[22:09] <Iamthey[iRON]> Sure

[22:11] <Jonathan_Brookbank> I w

as placed on what I thought to be the IRON eternal ZI list about 7 months ago for being in Vox Populi for 4 days, and although I did not found it, I was put on the founder list by Starfox when he made the thread.

[22:11] <Jonathan_Brookbank> I have since been informed that IRON has no eternal ZI list.

[22:11] <Jonathan_Brookbank> And I have been informed that, I believe, 5 founders who were in Vox Populi for longer than 4 days have been set free.

[22:11] <Jonathan_Brookbank> I was curious as to what ZI list of yours I was on, and what the process for removal was.

[22:12] <Iamthey[iRON]> In IRON the term PZI and EZI are synonymous

[22:12] <Iamthey[iRON]> And the onlyway to get off is a majority vote of the council

[22:12] <Jonathan_Brookbank> So what do PZI and EZI mean to IRON?

[22:13] <Iamthey[iRON]> A PZI is a permenant ZI on all current and future characters of the individual

[22:13] <Jonathan_Brookbank> OK.

[22:13] <Iamthey[iRON]> anyone who would warrent a PZI gets an EZI basically

[22:14] <Jonathan_Brookbank> So my 4 days in Vox Populi warranted me being banned from CN, alright. I believe this was prior to your time on the council but I could be mistaken.

[22:14] <Iamthey[iRON]> The majority of the council has voted to keep you on the list their reasons are their own.

[22:14] <Iamthey[iRON]> it was

[22:14] <Jonathan_Brookbank> The vote has already taken place?

[22:14] <Jonathan_Brookbank> I was under the impression you had no forums when I talked to Shan early this morning.

[22:15] <Iamthey[iRON]> We have other means of communication

[22:15] <Iamthey[iRON]> either way a consensus was reached

[22:15] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Alright, so it is IRON's policy to remove certain players CN playing priviledges.

[22:15] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Is there any chance of this policy changing in the future?

[22:16] <Iamthey[iRON]> There is always the possability you might be removed in the future from the list

[22:16] <Iamthey[iRON]> but right now the answer is no

[22:17] <Iamthey[iRON]> and its not so much we are removing your privileges it simply that if we do find you we will ZI you.

[22:17] <Jonathan_Brookbank> That is removing my privileges, as it is impossible to separate myself from the name Jonathan Brookbank even if I reroll into a secret character, as it is my real name.

[22:17] <Jonathan_Brookbank> So it is inevitable that you will find me.

[22:18] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Do you as an alliance keep track of why players are banned from the game?

[22:18] <Jonathan_Brookbank> I would be interested in knowing the charges against me.

[22:18] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Other than "He's evil."

[22:18] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Which is what I was told 7 months ago.

[22:19] <Iamthey[iRON]> IRON doesn't operate on typical jurisprudence, the council holds soverignty over the military and may choose to exercise its use as it decides. Simply put it doesn't need to charge you with anything. But to be fair, our forums which would have that information are down

[22:19] <Iamthey[iRON]> while we have some temporary forums they lack any of that info

[22:20] <Iamthey[iRON]> Probably because you were a founding member of vox

[22:20] <Iamthey[iRON]> or at least were listed as one

[22:20] <Iamthey[iRON]> either way NPO hasn't taken you off their list

[22:21] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Aye, that is not relevant when it comes to IRON.

[22:21] <Jonathan_Brookbank> I am approaching each alliance to discuss what is necessary for them.

[22:22] <Iamthey[iRON]> Why is it not relevent to us?

[22:22] <Jonathan_Brookbank> As I said, GGA and Valhalla have allowed me to continue to play, so now I have come to you.

[22:22] <Jonathan_Brookbank> You are a sovereign alliance, yes?

[22:22] <Jonathan_Brookbank> I was under the impression IRON held its own ZI lists, not controlled by the NPO.

[22:22] <Jonathan_Brookbank> If I am wrong, I can talk to NPO about your list as well.

[22:22] <Iamthey[iRON]> Sure but do we care about the opinions of friends of course.

[22:23] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Two of which have decided to allow me to play, yes.

[22:24] * Iamthey[iRON] shrugs

[22:24] <Iamthey[iRON]> If you would like me to cite fin's reasons for your remaining on our list I can do that as well

[22:24] <Iamthey[iRON]> though I am sure you are already aware of them

[22:25] <Jonathan_Brookbank> I am unaware of any reasons beyond the "Jonathan is evil," reason I was given 7 months ago.

[22:25] <Jonathan_Brookbank> So any you give me would be extremely beneficial.

[22:26] <Iamthey[iRON]> You really want me to call you a redshirt?

[22:26] <Jonathan_Brookbank> As I said, Finster seemed to be in a not so pleasant mood, so he was not very helpful in obtaining information from.

[22:26] <Jonathan_Brookbank> If that is in the quote, I suppose it must be included

[22:26] <Jonathan_Brookbank> .

[22:27] <Iamthey[iRON]> I have answered your question already johnathan

[22:27] <Iamthey[iRON]> what is required to get off our list is that the majority feels comfortable doing so

[22:27] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Wait, I thought you said you were going to cite Finster's reasons.

[22:27] <Iamthey[iRON]> That was his reason >_>

[22:27] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Oh.

[22:28] <Iamthey[iRON]> Yeah thats why I asked you if you really wanted me to call you that

[22:28] <Jonathan_Brookbank> His reasons was that I am a redshirt and he has already answered my question.

[22:28] <Iamthey[iRON]> no

[22:28] <Iamthey[iRON]> first part was his reason

[22:28] <Iamthey[iRON]> the second part was me going back to you wanting me to answer your question

[22:31] <Iamthey[iRON]> Anything else?

[22:32] <Jonathan_Brookbank> No, I believe that will be it. I appreciate you taking the time to talk to me rather than hurling insults and wishing death on me as a person.

[22:32] <Jonathan_Brookbank> You are a reminder of the IRON I once knew.

[22:33] <Iamthey[iRON]> Heh, well I try not to get too personally involved in the game.

[22:33] <Iamthey[iRON]> But i'd appriciate it if you try not to insult my collegues by complimenting me

[22:33] <Iamthey[iRON]> you'd*

[22:33] * Iamthey[iRON] shrugs

[22:34] <Jonathan_Brookbank> I was not trying to insult him.

[22:34] <Jonathan_Brookbank> That is what he did.

[22:34] <Iamthey[iRON]> I know

[22:35] <Iamthey[iRON]> You were implying IRON has degenerated

[22:35] <Iamthey[iRON]> But given your position I understand your sentiment; anyway.

[22:35] <Jonathan_Brookbank> I would not say that wishing in real life death upon someone is an increase in quality, but I digress.

[22:35] <Jonathan_Brookbank> I will let you go.

[22:35] <Jonathan_Brookbank> Thanks for your time.

[22:35] <Iamthey[iRON]> Np

As can be seen, IRON cares only for the opinion of one of their allies...the New Pacific Order. Keep this in mind, others who would choose to treaty or remain treatied to IRON, that they care not for what you do or believe.

To Pacifica: you have bested me as I was. All the while I have attempted to pull at the hearts of the people, of old friends, of potential allies. To appeal to their love of CN, their love of the community, their love of the game and the continuation of it. But that did not work, no, it did not. They chose to sit idly by, watching as the number of players dwindled at your hands and the hands of your cronies. I suppose I could have appealed instead to their fear, as you have done for so long. Hovering in the background, never dirtying your own hands, always sending your dogs after anyone who would dare step out of line. I suppose the Unjust War was what truly tipped me off to your true nature...refusing to fight for either side, honoring none of your treaties, watching as everyone else slowly chops off strength from each other, allowing you to return to the top without raising a finger of your own.

And to the world at large: Do NOT allow yourself to be bullied, to be controlled by fear. The NPO has proven time and time again not that they are the "best military in CN" as they claim, but instead that they rely on a (possibly rulebreaking) script and even more so on their allies. They fear that which they do not control, they fear the nuclear weaponry you own, they fear the loss of their numbers and pixels. If you remove their support structure, they WILL fall. Look to the past, and you will see what I say is true; they lost Great War One, as well as requiring heavy and constant flow of aid to battle against the nukes they took during the first Fan War, because they CAN NOT function on their own.

As it stands now, both Pacifica and 'RON have told me that if I am found, I will be destroyed, even if I make a new nation and a new identity. They have told me they will do everything in their power to find me, which if the past is used to show future actions, they will be stalking me by my IP across IRC and forums, as well as any other of their disgusting tactics. Their reason for this remains "because I was a Vox founder." This clearly is not the reason, as I have explained to them numerous times, I did not even have a nation when Vox was founded, therefore how could I have been a founder? Also, even if I were a founder, as Starfox listed me as in the foundation document, a number of the Vox founders whom were in Vox for much longer and actually played a vital role (as I was there for only 4 days, 4 days of mostly inactivity) have been released at this point. King Srqt, Rebel Virginia, Cheyenne, and Moridin have all been released, despite being Vox founders and being in Vox for longer than my four days. In attempts to discuss the real reason for my place on any banned nations from CN lists, I have constantly been rebuffed. When their allies have inquired about their reasoning, they have lied to them.

And so I find myself where I am today: in hiding, unable to reveal anything about my true self to anyone, solely because my name matches my original character in CN. CN as anything other than button clicks has been removed as an option for me; I can make no friends, I can do no alliance work that deals with other alliances, I can not come on IRC for fear that through their stalking they will find me. I asked Pacifica if they wanted an enemy, or if they wanted to let me free...they have made their decision, which has forced me into the decision I am making today. No more hiding, no more sulking around in the darkness, no more of any of that. The Truth must be known, and if they want me to tell it, I shall.

If you skipped to this part of the message hoping for a summary, you will be disappointed. The information contained within is far too important to not read, despite its length. I have bolded a few key pieces, however.

17 Comments


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JB, you have been a damn good friend over the past few years and I sincerely wish that you will one day see peace again. Until then, you can join me in the ever-growing numbers of people who don't play this damn game anymore.

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This blog entry was quite interesting to read. A lot of it is a blend of IC/OOC actions within the game and it seems that a lot of players can not separate the difference, especially if certain in game actions evoke a negative response from them. That said, it is my personal belief that no alliance should decide who does or does not get to play CyberNations. Only the CyberNations staff should decide that.

Allowing any player, new or old, to play this game is always a good thing.

Of course, there are always actions that would warrant a player from never returning such as truely OOC actions that are illegal (e.g. DDoS attacks). That should be assumed, though.

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I would truly like to hear your reasoning for taking Finster's comment as an RL death wish. Jonathan, this is a game that involves war. Soldiers. Tanks. Nukes. I'm not a hardcore gamer, but I've played a few games. People say things like "I want you dead" all the time in games that involve war/killing. I've never seen anyone -- not one single person -- other than you even claim to take such a comment as an RL death wish except when there's some sort of RL context. And if there was some context, why didn't you post it? If it's too personal to post, at least say "The conversation's context was about RL" or something.

I won't claim to know you extremely well. But I know you're not a moron. You know that this type of thing is said here and in every other war-related game out there, in an ingame context. That's why I'm forced to conclude that you deliberately tried to make it look like Finster wanted you dead in real life. Which disgusts me. If I'm wrong, please make your case. But I see no logical way that you could have taken that comment as an RL death wish.

-Bama

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I would truly like to hear your reasoning for taking Finster's comment as an RL death wish. Jonathan, this is a game that involves war. Soldiers. Tanks. Nukes. I'm not a hardcore gamer, but I've played a few games. People say things like "I want you dead" all the time in games that involve war/killing. I've never seen anyone -- not one single person -- other than you even claim to take such a comment as an RL death wish except when there's some sort of RL context. And if there was some context, why didn't you post it? If it's too personal to post, at least say "The conversation's context was about RL" or something.

I won't claim to know you extremely well. But I know you're not a moron. You know that this type of thing is said here and in every other war-related game out there, in an ingame context. That's why I'm forced to conclude that you deliberately tried to make it look like Finster wanted you dead in real life. Which disgusts me. If I'm wrong, please make your case. But I see no logical way that you could have taken that comment as an RL death wish.

-Bama

I have no problem responding to this here, I would have responded in your thread, but I'm not able to due to lack of nation. There are actually a number of things from your thread I would like to respond to, but I won't clutter my response to you with those.

The reason why I took it as such is because I have been contacting the leadership of these alliances as a player, not as a character. There is no one by the name of "Jonathan Brookbank" in the game of Cyber Nations that he could have been referring to wanting dead. Therefore, logically, in my opinion, I assumed him to be talking about me, the player, as that was who was talking to him. If I had a nation at the time and had been coming to him as a character in the game, I wouldn't have thought twice about any possible RL connotations, because I've heard things like that before, sure. You can ask any number of people, I was extremely upset at the comment and didn't even think of it as having in game connotations with regards to that particular conversation. I was on the verge of just shutting down and uninstalling IRC and deleting my TE nation and any contacts from CN so that I could forget about what this game has become. Mrcalkin has already attested to this, and I could give you a list of other people whom would also confirm it. I've not one who typically is hated by many people, so to have someone come at me with a comment like that was a bit shocking, considering I still have absolutely no idea what I've done to harm IRON, as they refuse to tell me.

If, in the end, it was a misunderstanding, I suppose that's all it was. But in the context of the situation, I honestly don't see how I could have interpreted it any other way. This wasn't just me twisting it for some sort of political gain, it was legitimate concern that an attitude like that could be in CN, or any game, for that matter. The absolutely crass behavior and way of speaking some of IRON/NPO have had towards me is, quite frankly, ridiculous in a web browser game, whether it's IC or OOC, especially considering I have still yet to be informed of my crimes.

Sorry about going off on a bit of a tangent, but I hope that you at least get out of this what I'm trying to say about why I took it the way I did.

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Even if it wasn't about your particular character, even if he was saying that he wanted any future characters of ours dead... You guys were still talking about CN, right? I still don't see how you got RL from that... I guess I can see how you might have taken it that way at the moment. I mean, we all flip out and say things sometimes, but after you calmed down, I don't know how you looked back and didn't at least consider that he didn't mean it that way. You accused him of being a very sick man... Of wanting a fellow human being dead over a video game. I still believe you were wrong to make that accusation on that one quote. But having heard your side of the story, I don't think you actively lied about this to make Finster look bad. But again, what you accused him of is not an accusation to be made lightly. And I think you made it all too lightly.

-Bama

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Even if it wasn't about your particular character, even if he was saying that he wanted any future characters of ours dead... You guys were still talking about CN, right? I still don't see how you got RL from that... I guess I can see how you might have taken it that way at the moment. I mean, we all flip out and say things sometimes, but after you calmed down, I don't know how you looked back and didn't at least consider that he didn't mean it that way. You accused him of being a very sick man... Of wanting a fellow human being dead over a video game. I still believe you were wrong to make that accusation on that one quote. But having heard your side of the story, I don't think you actively lied about this to make Finster look bad. But again, what you accused him of is not an accusation to be made lightly. And I think you made it all too lightly.

-Bama

EDIT: I assume you meant "characters of yours," so the rest of this is written in response to that assumption. We were talking about my ability to play the game, "my" meaning Jonathan Brookbank the player, not the character, as there was no existing character of mine in game.

Considering the history of the game, and the things I have heard said, you saying I made it too lightly is something I still don't understand. I HAVE heard people wish for other people to die before, I HAVE heard people bring up real life illnesses of players and spread them among the player base, I HAVE heard other real life information spread for nefarious reasons. One of the major points of my piece is that I thought this kind of behavior was removed from the game, and how it is unfortunate that those whom pushed certain alliances out are now the ones guilty of the same such actions and words. As I said, it is possible it was a misunderstanding, but given the circumstances, I don't really see how I could have taken it any other way.

Also, the piece was written not long after this conversation took place, so there was a lot of emotion put into it as a whole, but I did think about my accusations before I made them. I am not one to just say something without putting thought into it, at least when it comes to writing.

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You know Jonathan looking at the logs its clear to anyone reading them that rather than truly trying to remedy your situation your true intention is to elicit responses that you can use to cast IRON in a negative light on the forum when you dump the logs. And this is not the first time you have posted such logs where its clear that your intent is not further your stated goal in the IRC conversation but rather to simply play a game of IRC gotcha. Perhaps you would be best served being a little bit more honest and a little less underhanded in your methods. Because for starters your little IRC games are plainly obvious to whom ever you are attempting to con into making a damning statement. Its no surprise to me in the least that those whom you have played these little games with absolutely despise you.

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You know Jonathan looking at the logs its clear to anyone reading them that rather than truly trying to remedy your situation your true intention is to elicit responses that you can use to cast IRON in a negative light on the forum when you dump the logs. And this is not the first time you have posted such logs where its clear that your intent is not further your stated goal in the IRC conversation but rather to simply play a game of IRC gotcha. Perhaps you would be best served being a little bit more honest and a little less underhanded in your methods. Because for starters your little IRC games are plainly obvious to whom ever you are attempting to con into making a damning statement. Its no surprise to me in the least that those whom you have played these little games with absolutely despise you.
Wow, so just because some people don't like some of the stuff he's done, he's banned from playing the game permanently? How sad. I can understand that log dumps annoy people, but there are answers to solve this problem better than keeping him from the game completely, a) don't engage in lengthy IRC conversations with him, b) don't say anything incriminating if you must talk to him. Two easy to understand ways of stopping it from happening again. Either these people who get caught in the log-dumps are doing it willingly to create a legitimate reason to keep him on ZI, or they're just unable to learn from history and how leaders have been embarrassed in the past when they say dumb stuff to JB.All that said, to keep JB on ZI for something so minor is indicative of how petty some of these guys are and how they're quick to take offence of the smallest of slights and quick to hold a grudge over the same.
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You know Jonathan looking at the logs its clear to anyone reading them that rather than truly trying to remedy your situation your true intention is to elicit responses that you can use to cast IRON in a negative light on the forum when you dump the logs. And this is not the first time you have posted such logs where its clear that your intent is not further your stated goal in the IRC conversation but rather to simply play a game of IRC gotcha. Perhaps you would be best served being a little bit more honest and a little less underhanded in your methods. Because for starters your little IRC games are plainly obvious to whom ever you are attempting to con into making a damning statement. Its no surprise to me in the least that those whom you have played these little games with absolutely despise you.

I had no intention at all to dump these logs while talking to the people contained, so your assumption is false. Neither this time nor the last time I posted logs were my intentions to dump them while talking to the people contained within.

That basically makes the rest of your comment irrelevant and unintelligent sounding.

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EDIT: I assume you meant "characters of yours," so the rest of this is written in response to that assumption. We were talking about my ability to play the game, "my" meaning Jonathan Brookbank the player, not the character, as there was no existing character of mine in game.

Considering the history of the game, and the things I have heard said, you saying I made it too lightly is something I still don't understand. I HAVE heard people wish for other people to die before, I HAVE heard people bring up real life illnesses of players and spread them among the player base, I HAVE heard other real life information spread for nefarious reasons. One of the major points of my piece is that I thought this kind of behavior was removed from the game, and how it is unfortunate that those whom pushed certain alliances out are now the ones guilty of the same such actions and words. As I said, it is possible it was a misunderstanding, but given the circumstances, I don't really see how I could have taken it any other way.

Also, the piece was written not long after this conversation took place, so there was a lot of emotion put into it as a whole, but I did think about my accusations before I made them. I am not one to just say something without putting thought into it, at least when it comes to writing.

Even if the discussion was about you as a player... It was still about Cyber Nations. Not real life. So even if he did mean that he wanted any character you ever create to end up dead (which some might consider OOC), he's still talking about "Cyber Nations dead". The convo was about CN, not RL, so I still don't see where you got "RL dead" from.

Assuming you're talking mainly about the end-of-UJW incident, I think it was pretty clear that those people meant RL and not CN. In my experience, the type of people who want others to die in RL usually make it very clear. I mean, I can tell you without a doubt that FinsterBaby does not want the man behind your computer to die. I've known him for a long time, and I know that that's not how he rolls. But if the conversation had been about RL, I would see how it would be easy for someone who doesn't know him to take it that way. But, IC or not, the conversation was about CN. So I still don't completely understand why you jumped to the RL conclusion.

That's understandable. I put a little too much emotion into my thread as well... I saw a friend being wronged OOC, and I got angry. I stand by my opinion that taking that as an RL death wish was illogical, but I did get emotional.

-Bama

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And to those whom have wronged me, Derek Jones, ironchef, tearowe, BearerofTruth, ALdbeign, Emperor Lester II...I apologize to you for allowing my bullheadedness to make my decisions for me. I should never have resigned from Triumvir to Elder Statesman prior to you betraying me.

Please refresh my memory...How was it exactly that I "betrayed" you? Also let me apologize now for anything you felt I had done to wrong you in the past. That being said, It was 2 years ago Jonathan. You need to let it go... It's a game kiddo.

You say you want to come back to CN. But it seems to me that all you want to do is cause more problems for yourself. You need to be surrounded by drama at all times...Its like you feed off of it. And I dont understand it. You dont need to continue to stir the pot to get people to pay attention to you Jonathan.

What was it you intended to accomplish with this log novel of yours? I see no point in all of this log dumping... Everyone already knows how you feel about Pacifica and your theories about the way things are. And I'm so very tired of hearing about it. Everything that happened to you was your own fault. No one forced you to do anything...So stop blaming everyone else for your problems.

I had no intention at all to dump these logs while talking to the people contained, so your assumption is false. Neither this time nor the last time I posted logs were my intentions to dump them while talking to the people contained within.

I'm going to call BS on this one. You might be able to convince people that dont know you, that you didnt intend to log dump. I for one know differently. While reading the logs it was perfectly clear to me that you were doing some serious fishing with both ironchef and Iamthey. I am disappointed that ironchef couldnt see that it was a setup...She should have known better than to think that you had honest intentions with your interests in what was going on. Also I've read thru the logs you've posted here and I've also read thru the logs that ironchef has on her PC... And there are a number of differences. Things added, things removed...You flat out lied when you said that these logs are "unaltered".

The sooner you figure out that doing crap like this isnt going to get you back in the buddy club, the better. You say that you dont understand why youre still on any Pzi lists and others arent...Its because of stuff like this. Why would anyone want to make the effort to let someone come back to the game when said person feels the need to cause so many problems and spew lies and slander...and all of this is being done while not playing the game. Ever think that we all see what you are capable of doing when you dont have a nation or alliance. And letting you come back just seems like a bad bad idea.

Now on a lighter note....Jonathan you know I've always liked you as a person. RL you are a great guy and I've always enjoyed our interactions...CN related or not. But IC you are a little trouble making !@#$. You need to let go of the past, and forget about all your plans for revenge. Otherwise youre never actually going to enjoy playing the game again...and I doubt youre going to get a chance to play again until you pull your head out of your butt.

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Please refresh my memory...How was it exactly that I "betrayed" you? Also let me apologize now for anything you felt I had done to wrong you in the past. That being said, It was 2 years ago Jonathan. You need to let it go... It's a game kiddo.

You say you want to come back to CN. But it seems to me that all you want to do is cause more problems for yourself. You need to be surrounded by drama at all times...Its like you feed off of it. And I dont understand it. You dont need to continue to stir the pot to get people to pay attention to you Jonathan.

What was it you intended to accomplish with this log novel of yours? I see no point in all of this log dumping... Everyone already knows how you feel about Pacifica and your theories about the way things are. And I'm so very tired of hearing about it. Everything that happened to you was your own fault. No one forced you to do anything...So stop blaming everyone else for your problems.

I'm going to call BS on this one. You might be able to convince people that dont know you, that you didnt intend to log dump. I for one know differently. While reading the logs it was perfectly clear to me that you were doing some serious fishing with both ironchef and Iamthey. I am disappointed that ironchef couldnt see that it was a setup...She should have known better than to think that you had honest intentions with your interests in what was going on. Also I've read thru the logs you've posted here and I've also read thru the logs that ironchef has on her PC... And there are a number of differences. Things added, things removed...You flat out lied when you said that these logs are "unaltered".

The sooner you figure out that doing crap like this isnt going to get you back in the buddy club, the better. You say that you dont understand why youre still on any Pzi lists and others arent...Its because of stuff like this. Why would anyone want to make the effort to let someone come back to the game when said person feels the need to cause so many problems and spew lies and slander...and all of this is being done while not playing the game. Ever think that we all see what you are capable of doing when you dont have a nation or alliance. And letting you come back just seems like a bad bad idea.

Now on a lighter note....Jonathan you know I've always liked you as a person. RL you are a great guy and I've always enjoyed our interactions...CN related or not. But IC you are a little trouble making !@#$. You need to let go of the past, and forget about all your plans for revenge. Otherwise youre never actually going to enjoy playing the game again...and I doubt youre going to get a chance to play again until you pull your head out of your butt.

I'll handle this piece by piece.

According to ironchef, you turned over logs and claimed I tried to recruit you. So either she's lying or you're lying. I'm well aware it's a game, that's the whole point of this post. I want to play the game of CN, but IRON and NPO are not allowing me to.

I am not after drama, I just want freedom. The drama comes about because they refuse to give me freedom.

"No one forced you to do anything..." What exactly was it I did again? No one seems to be able to answer that all important question.

Call BS all you want, these conversations were not going to be dumped until ironchef betrayed the GGA and Finster told me he wished I would die. It was at that point that I decided the world needed to know what was happening.

These logs are unaltered in any way other than to remove conversational pieces that had outside information or information not relevant to the CN conversation. They come from the two or three days prior to ironchef being recalled to the GGA at the NPO's behest.

Yes, I admitted to removing things prior to the logs in the post. Would you have preferred I left the stuff about your RL relationship in the logs? I have not added anything to them, nor have I removed anything relevant to the conversation. The screenshots of the conversation have been turned over to the relevant parties and ironchef has admitted to the validity of the logs, so trying to say I made up part of the logs just shows you can't be trusted to speak the truth. You're ruining your own position here.

I don't want to be in the "buddy" club. I've been there, and it let me to where I am now. I don't want to be any of the hegemony member's friend. I just want to be free. I was gone from CN for 7 months and they decided that not only was that not long enough to get off, despite letting other longer members from Vox free in the meantime, that all I warranted was rude conversations and death wishes.

I have no plans for revenge, as I have told Moo for a long time. I just want freedom. That's all it comes down to.

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