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Who would win?

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Gopherbashi

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21 {164} (-1) Nusantara Elite Warriors : 22.89 --> 22.89 (+0.00)

22 {161} (+0) Nordreich : 22.88 --> 22.79 (-0.09)

I've been watching these two for about a week now, because they've been going back and forth and are pretty similar across a whole pile of categories - only separated by a tenth of a point in score, three nations, 700 ANS, 70 nukes, 1600 tech, etc. And it makes me wonder who would win in a one-on-one battle between the two, with no treaties or outside help whatsoever.

Only a couple of major differences I will point out:

  • Activity - Nordreich is at 86% activity, while NEW is only at 71%. Would the attention that Nordreich pays to their nations on a regular basis put them over the top?
  • Infra - While their tech is practically equal, NEW has about 85k more infra than Nordreich (amounting to about 10%). To what extent would the "infra-heaviness" of the average NEW nation impact the final result?
  • Navy - Nordreich's standing navy is more than double that of NEW's. Would Nordreich be able to use this head-start to dominate the naval theatre, and would that make a difference in the end?
  • Specific Nations - Nordreich's top two nations are about 20k too strong to hit even the most powerful NEW nations. Nation-for-nation, NEW is numerically outmatched until they get below 65k NS or so. Would NEW be able to make up this ground through superior tactics or a pre-emptive strike?

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If we(NEW) drag this conflict long enough into an war of attrition, I say we have fair chance of winning.

Nor doesn't seem to be a bad military alliance though, and war with them sure seem to be a lot of fun.

Sometime in the future then perhaps ?

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No offense to NEW but Nordreich is a professional alliance with highly developed economic and military systems. While NEW might have the heart, NoR has the ruthless efficiency.

What, you mean that they can supply aid targets on time?

Without the intervention of allies, NEW wins, because of what Alterego said, and also because of better warchests....
Not to be contrary or anything, but NoR's warchest requirements are by far the highest I have ever seen in any alliance that I've belonged to.

I'd believe they're higher than Vox's were. ;)

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If we(NEW) drag this conflict long enough into an war of attrition, I say we have fair chance of winning. Nor doesn't seem to be a bad military alliance though, and war with them sure seem to be a lot of fun.Sometime in the future then perhaps ?

This is a very bad hypothetical. You should both instead fight together against SF or Fark :awesome:

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higher navy, lower infra = crappy warchest

Not necessarily; we don't exactly skimp on the war-chests. Higher infrastructure could just as easily mean nations are spending money on infrastructure more freely rather than saving it.

Honestly, the outcome would depend on the definition of "winning" you use. If winning means causing more damage to the opponent than one receives in a set period of time, I would bet on us, by virtue of having a more developed top-end, a slight nuclear superiority in the middle-lower ranges, and having a higher tech-to-infra ratio. (In war, infrastructure is far more perishable than technology.)

If, on the other hand, winning means making the other alliance "cry uncle" first, it really depends on who first points out the absurdity of our alliances being at war just because the OWF thought it would be fun to watch.

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People will say Nor will win. Its mainly b/c Nor is treatied to more vocal and more alliances period.

Pretty much this. Anyone treatied to MK will win a "Who is better" poll.

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frankly speaking, NEW warriors are bunch of crazy idiots who will fight till the end. and of course, if you compare with the treaties, i'm sure that NoR will win. but let's say 1-1, NEW has the chance to win also.

And pardon us if we annoyed you with our bad English, your English is far worse than some of us.. :P

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Voted Nord. If the majority of NoR's naval superiority is comprised of subs,that extra power for nukes could go a long way in getting a headstart.

Theoretically, such a headstart could mean that when the dust settles, NoR will be slightly better off than NEW. As others have mentioned, a 1v1 would destroy the two of them, though NoR is somewhat more active than NEW so their rebuilding capabilities would be much better.

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We indeed are horrible in activity, since most of us even collect on 20+ days :blink:

As navy things, that's why i semi-retired from raiding, small land is counter for nuke-support fleet, under 1k miles and navies will stay out from daily warfare. I'm enjoying this discussion because some way this gives us different point of views that we can use to build our system/organization better. Last, as some of my NEW fellows stated earlier, get lunch while clicking nuke button at update is the best thing CN :lol1:

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NoR because NEW can't use proper English and it's annoying.

Lol I agree with this one :D

Dunno bout the winner..but NEW won't lose

Cuz NEW Are sick ppl that love hurting themselves and burning pixels. Its the ideology they had. The one they called MAHOISM

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If it was 1 vs 1 NEW would win. They have no regard for their pixels and even their smallest nations are blooded early with the arts of war via constant raids.

Also NEW enjoys a nice comfortable afternoon update every day where as NoR with a lot of Euro or American members would have a lot of very late nights to stay on to counter the update attacks.

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Statistically NoR will WIN. I'm putting my 1000 tech on NoR.

Question is, what will determine who win and lose?

Let say 1 v 1 on last man standing battle system.

Then, I will said NEW.

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Voted NEW, just because in a 1-vs-1 fight they would not stop. They would drag both themselves and NoR down to an alliance wide ZI if thats what it came to.

Remember these are the guys that use causality count as a form of constant competition.

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If you had asked me this before the last war I would have said NoR. But ask any NPOer about NoR's performance in the last war, especially in the middle and lower tiers and they will let you know that the hype around NoR is precisely that. A hype. They have a good core of members and their larger members are pretty good at wrecking things but if it wasn't for NoR, NPO would have probably surrendered a month before they did simply due to the amount of loot NoR was dropping on NPO. It was kind of a running joke in NPO that if you needed aid, don't ask econ for it but pray for a member of NoR attack your nation. More than a few of us (around 30 if I remember correctly, there was a poll somewhere) were able to attack an NoR nation and fight off 3 GOONS simply due to the amount of loot we could get from NoR.

GOONS on the other hand were a great enemy, they cooperated perfectly and even though a large amount of their newer members who were recruited from SA solely to fight NPO lacked the proper improvements which resulted in large amounts of loot being "donated" to NPO, they were a great foe and certainly one of the better alliances in the last war in regards to their cooperation and ability to wage a war.

As for NEW, I have had the pleasure of a few conversations with them and I would love to see them in a decent fight just to see what they have in terms of fire-power. People may underestimate them due to them not having a public image like a few other alliances but I think that in a war between NoR and NEW, it might come down to NEW having the larger base from which to recruit as the community they are a part of has something like nearly 2 million members or something (similar to GOONS and SA). People may say that newer members make no impact on a war as upper tiers win but if anyone paid attention to the last war, GOONS' recruiting appeal on SA did have a noticeable effect on NPO's lower and middle tiers. NoR simply doesn't have that ability, unless we count stormfront that is. :awesome:

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If I understand correctly, nearly all NEW members live in the same time zone. Ignoring all other factors, this can be a tremendous advantage.In my experience, in even fights the winner is the one who strikes first. So it would depend....Called it a draw just be annoying.

That's an awesome advantage.

What timezone is it?

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I have had the joy and honour to have fought with NEW once upon a time(another life.) I have no doubt they would win from shear stuborness if nothing else.

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