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Dark Templar Reparations

Goose

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I was asking for 30,000 in technology in reparations from any source DT could get it. Legacy agreed to accept 20,000 and 10,000 was to be sent to The Commonwealth. This was met with threats from DT for an expanded war. DT optionally entered into war with The Commonwealth and her allies. There are consequences for optionally going to war with people, and those consequences should be expected when you enter a war with no obligation to do so. Their great loyalty to LoSS had them come asking for peace with us after a week of war, with no consideration for whether LoSS got peace or not.

Throughout the peace process I've consistently lowered the amount and severity of the reparations demanded only to have DT lower their offer again and again. They've made a concerted effort to smear me and The Commonwealth to the world with half-truths and lies. They've sent messages to our membership urging them to revolt against the government. They've offered their ally's declaration on NPO (unasked for and unwanted by The Commonwealth) in return for peace. They've threatened us and our allies with escalation by allies that have agreed to not re-enter the conflict and those as yet uninvolved. They've been underhanded and dishonest throughout the entire peace process. This is why I am demanding reparations and will continue to do so.

I am done backing down. I am done being threatened. I am done negotiating. I am done being fair and reasonable to those that would not return the kindness. If you wish to escalate things, do it and watch your alliances burn to the ground. If you want to smear me, it has been done. If you want your allies to declare war on NPO, I don't care if they do or not. The Commonwealth stands.

The terms stand at 30,000 technology paid by DT nations paid to the combined nations of Legacy and The Commonwealth. During the period that DT is paying reparations they will not carry standing navies or nuclear arsenals. No more negotiating. No more middle-men. No more anything. Surrender or burn.



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perspective i guess, but then again your not the saint your trying to portray either. You have refused envoys and reasonable offers as well.

What envoys have I refused? Dark Templar has not tried to contact me since they offered us the chance to apologize.

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You have any evidence for these accusations?

At least you're standing up here and not just letting Penkala and GOD carry water for you I guess.

Carta = Supa, for those who didn't know.

<Carta> We attacked Legacy. So We'll pay legacy.

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> i figured as much

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> but if anything

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> we have a sort of starting point

<Carta> Well. If the talks hold on as long as they did last time.

<Carta> Then I'm sure more will be adding to this party.

<Carta> Which I'm sure no one really wants.

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> well unless they take place tonight i wont be there

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> but if im there id try my best to keep anyone from leaving

<Carta> I won't be on until like 12.

<Carta> lol

<Carta> But I'm sure Myworld and Titan will be

<Carta> Also Sarm.

<Carta> That clause about saying we are paying Legacy because if we are paying anyone reperations it will be legacy, etc etc.

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> yeah

<Carta> Then it's mute if we still pay CSN

<Carta> lol

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> well then we wouldnt accept

<Carta> Yeah exactly. So tell CSN to shut up before this front turns into a completely different war

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What envoys have I refused? Dark Templar has not tried to contact me since they offered us the chance to apologize.

So

I believe i tried 3 or 4 days ago with a very reasonable offer that was authorized by DT and you refused to even meet with anyone.

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some irrelevant logs

You posted some logs, but never backed up any of the accusations made by the OP.

"I've consistently lowered the amount and severity of the reparations demanded only to have DT lower their offer again and again."

"They've made a concerted effort to smear me and The Commonwealth to the world with half-truths and lies."

"They've sent messages to our membership urging them to revolt against the government."

"They've offered their ally's declaration on NPO (unasked for and unwanted by The Commonwealth) in return for peace."

"They've threatened us and our allies with escalation by allies that have agreed to not re-enter the conflict and those as yet uninvolved."

"They've been underhanded and dishonest throughout the entire peace process."

Here. care to try again?

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You posted some logs, but never backed up any of the accusations made by the OP.

"I've consistently lowered the amount and severity of the reparations demanded only to have DT lower their offer again and again."

"They've made a concerted effort to smear me and The Commonwealth to the world with half-truths and lies."

"They've sent messages to our membership urging them to revolt against the government."

"They've offered their ally's declaration on NPO (unasked for and unwanted by The Commonwealth) in return for peace."

"They've threatened us and our allies with escalation by allies that have agreed to not re-enter the conflict and those as yet uninvolved."

"They've been underhanded and dishonest throughout the entire peace process."

Ah, thought you were referring to the threat accusation. Sorry.

1. Reps started as 40k from 2k+ tech nations. Progress down to 30k from anywhere and 10k from DT (still 40k total, but this was also proposed from DT). Then it progressed down to 30k total (20k to Legacy, 10k to CSN). Also, the length of time required to fulfill the terms was raised from 3 months (if I recall that was it, I'm not 100% on that) to 6 months.

2. Go read any thread pertaining to this war. It is filled with half-truths pointing to make DT into saints.

3. We got a mass-message from some troll nation inciting rebellion. I've seen several posts here on the OWF talking to our members about how bad our Government is doing. Those OWF posts aren't out-right saying it, but they are definitely trying to insinuate because they believe our membership is in an uproar over this. Pro-tip: They're not.

I'm not going to waste my time going to get screen-shots of any of this because it's not really worth it to argue it. The message was sent to everyone in our alliance. We know it to be fact. If you want to try and tell us it didn't happen, we'll just keep laughing at you.

4. I wasn't involved in this conversation, but I was approached by a separate (uninvolved in this front) alliance where that came to us for that reason.

5. This point was in the "irrelevant logs" I posted, which you seem to have not read.

6. This looks like number two.

Edit: Also, way to try to make your post look tougher with your edit. Nice job. :)

Edit 2: Also, according to one of my members, one of the DT OWF constants messaged all the people he was fighting to revolt against the Government.

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Ah, thought you were referring to the threat accusation. Sorry.

1. Reps started as 40k from 2k+ tech nations. Progress down to 30k from anywhere and 10k from DT (still 40k total, but this was also proposed from DT). Then it progressed down to 30k total (20k to Legacy, 10k to CSN). Also, the length of time required to fulfill the terms was raised from 3 months (if I recall that was it, I'm not 100% on that) to 6 months.

Failure again. It went to 30k from any source and 10k purchased and sent from DT. No where was Legacy in the terms of getting tech until the latest offer we sent over via our allies since CSN hasn't come back to the table for talks.

Last offer set out were 3 offers:

First:

20k tech to Legacy, All peace out and go their way.

Second:

10k tech to CSN from any source, 10k to Legacy purchased and sent from DT and any source.

Third:

15k to Legacy from any source, 5k to CSN any source.

We have yet to hear a response out of either of those offers.

Now we're getting military decoms and reps? Sorry but that's not happening either there Goose.

2. Go read any thread pertaining to this war. It is filled with half-truths pointing to make DT into saints.

1/2 truths? We gave full logs out and have hidden nothing from anyone with regards to our talks or CSN stance.

3. We got a mass-message from some troll nation inciting rebellion. I've seen several posts here on the OWF talking to our members about how bad our Government is doing. Those OWF posts aren't out-right saying it, but they are definitely trying to insinuate because they believe our membership is in an uproar over this. Pro-tip: They're not.

I'm not going to waste my time going to get screen-shots of any of this because it's not really worth it to argue it. The message was sent to everyone in our alliance. We know it to be fact. If you want to try and tell us it didn't happen, we'll just keep laughing at you.

And this mass-messaged happened by who? If it was a DT member this would be addressed and taken care of. We're not unreasonable people to not want to police our membership of any wrong doing. So if it wasn't a DT member then don't hold it against DT for actions out of our control or knowledge of happening. Let alone the screenshots we had no knowledge of happening or even want to have happen to anyone. What happens within peoples forums should stay there, but it's unfortunate that there was someone with Mod access on your forums that created and sent out those screenshots.

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Ah, thought you were referring to the threat accusation. Sorry.

1. Reps started as 40k from 2k+ tech nations. Progress down to 30k from anywhere and 10k from DT (still 40k total, but this was also proposed from DT). Then it progressed down to 30k total (20k to Legacy, 10k to CSN). Also, the length of time required to fulfill the terms was raised from 3 months (if I recall that was it, I'm not 100% on that) to 6 months.

2. Go read any thread pertaining to this war. It is filled with half-truths pointing to make DT into saints.

3. We got a mass-message from some troll nation inciting rebellion. I've seen several posts here on the OWF talking to our members about how bad our Government is doing. Those OWF posts aren't out-right saying it, but they are definitely trying to insinuate because they believe our membership is in an uproar over this. Pro-tip: They're not.

I'm not going to waste my time going to get screen-shots of any of this because it's not really worth it to argue it. The message was sent to everyone in our alliance. We know it to be fact. If you want to try and tell us it didn't happen, we'll just keep laughing at you.

4. I wasn't involved in this conversation, but I was approached by a separate (uninvolved in this front) alliance where that came to us for that reason.

5. This point was in the "irrelevant logs" I posted, which you seem to have not read.

6. This looks like number two.

Edit: Also, way to try to make your post look tougher with your edit. Nice job. :)

Edit 2: Also, according to one of my members, one of the DT OWF constants messaged all the people he was fighting to revolt against the Government.

1. As of last night Liz was still demanding tech from DT nations with over 2k tech.

2. I was wondering if you would name a specific lie, but i guess that would be too easy to refute.

3. "some troll nation" got it. Obviously sanctioned by DT gov.

4. So DT DIDN'T make that offer. Interesting.

5. So a log between Legacy and DT that references no other DT allies the source of DT making threats about DT allies breaking terms to hit CSN?

6. Third parties calling you out on wild accusations and your own lies and half truths is another example of DT being underhanded and dishonest?

Addendum 1: My edit was to quote box Goose's text.

Addendum 2: Oh Noes, a nation messaged the nations he was warring!! :o

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Failure again. It went to 30k from any source and 10k purchased and sent from DT. No where was Legacy in the terms of getting tech until the latest offer we sent over via our allies since CSN hasn't come back to the table for talks.

Last offer set out were 2 offers:

First:

20k tech to Legacy, All peace out and go their way.

Second:

10k tech to CSN from any source, 10k to Legacy purchased and sent from DT and any source.

We have yet to hear a response out of either of those offers.

Right, the first 40k split offer was all to us. Then you guys asked Sarm for the 20k to Legacy deal, in which he responded (with Goose's agreement) with 20k to Legacy, 10k to CSN. It's all right here:

<TitaN> hi

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> oh hai

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> so about the thing we talked about yesterda

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> thats yesterday with a y on the end of it

<TitaN> lol

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> legacy would be willing to go forward with it, as long as it was made perfectly clear by DT that they'd rather give us the tech then csn and that we had resisted reps and we only do so to end the war

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> which i didnt think would be much of an issue on yoru end

<TitaN> yeah

<TitaN> did you mention it to goose just to see how he felt about it?

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> thats my next part

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> HOWEVER

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> goose moose says that you guys have only lost 10k tech

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> and csn should get 10k tech

<TitaN> it's 12.5k tech

<TitaN> i remember

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> well too be fair that is closer to 10k then it is 20k

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> but as of right now, Legacy gets 20k tech, and CSN gets 10k

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> and you guys explain why we are getting it blah blah

<TitaN> I think we can wait till it's 20k to you

<TitaN> Should be another week or so

<TitaN> :)

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> well do you a counter?

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> maybe meet them half way at 5k?

<TitaN> The issue here is us paying reps to them lol

<TitaN> We declared war on you

<TitaN> Therefore we have no issue sending reps to YOU

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> yah i figured that much

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> but iddnt know if meeting half way was possible or not

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> either way ill relay to csn

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> and if they come up with something ill be back

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> id love to get this sorted tonight before i go poof

<TitaN> That's nto going to happen unless it's the 20k to you only

<TitaN> and i'd have to talk that over with mw and supa

<Sarmatian[Legacy]> easy enough

<TitaN> i want to make it clear

<TitaN> 20k from ANYONE

Now we're getting military decoms and reps? Sorry but that's not happening either there Goose.

1/2 truths? We gave full logs out and have hidden nothing from anyone with regards to our talks or CSN stance.

You gave out logs and hid nothing, but you presented it falsely.

And this mass-messaged happened by who? If it was a DT member this would be addressed and taken care of. We're not unreasonable people to not want to police our membership of any wrong doing. So if it wasn't a DT member then don't hold it against DT for actions out of our control or knowledge of happening. Let alone the screenshots we had no knowledge of happening or even want to have happen to anyone. What happens within peoples forums should stay there, but it's unfortunate that there was someone with Mod access on your forums that created and sent out those screenshots.

It was a random ghost nation. We don't know, it could've been a multi of one of yours, or someone you know. Don't know, don't care. Our members were messaged to revolt against our Government, that's a fact.

Why bring up the screen-shots? :tinfoil:

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@Myworld

The problem with the terms you offer, is that we simply don't believe these offers are genuine. We accepted terms proposed by DT, and DT withdrew the terms. We have no real reason to accept any offer DT makes at this point.

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1. As of last night Liz was still demanding tech from DT nations with over 2k tech.

2. I was wondering if you would name a specific lie, but i guess that would be too easy to refute.

3. "some troll nation" got it. Obviously sanctioned by DT gov.

4. So DT DIDN'T make that offer. Interesting.

5. So a log between Legacy and DT that references no other DT allies the source of DT making threats about DT allies breaking terms to hit CSN?

6. Third parties calling you out on wild accusations and your own lies and half truths is another example of DT being underhanded and dishonest?

Addendum 1: My edit was to quote box Goose's text.

Addendum 2: Oh Noes, a nation messaged the nations he was warring!! :o

1. Uh. No. Get your facts straight genius.

2. Well, DT claimed to come to us with LoSS for peace. That's a lie. They came to us themselves, to peace out separately from LoSS, because their coordination sucked.

3. Who knows? I don't. I just know we got messaged, and it pissed a lot of our people off. It's just interesting that it's the same thing DT has been insinuating.

4. Nope, but it was threatened.

5. Are you dense?

<Carta> Then I'm sure more will be adding to this party.

-snip-

<Carta> Yeah exactly. So tell CSN to shut up before this front turns into a completely different war

That means calling in allies to expand the war.

6. No. DT bending the truths in their opening (and continued) posts being underhanded and dishonest.

Addendum 1: That, and to add "Here. Care to try again? to the post. I'm not worried about it, just found it to be funny.

Addendum 2: It is an "oh no" when anyone messages an alliance about couping leadership.

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DT optionally entered into war with The Commonwealth and her allies. There are consequences for optionally going to war with people, and those consequences should be expected when you enter a war with no obligation to do so.

We optionally came in against Legacy, not you. You declared war on us.

Now, on to my next point.

Your treaty with Legacy has a non-chaining clause. So, you came in on an OPTIONAL treaty that you did not have to honor. Way to be hypocritical here, goose.

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@Myworld

The problem with the terms you offer, is that we simply don't believe these offers are genuine. We accepted terms proposed by DT, and DT withdrew the terms. We have no real reason to accept any offer DT makes at this point.

DT didn't withdraw anything, the offer we sent was denied by your government and took off the table when they walked out on talks. They gave us no idea that they were planning on discussing the terms so they were agreeing to an offer that no longer existed as it was already taken off the table.

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