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Lack of leaders

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R3nowned

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Here I am, looking at the list of gov members for various alliances on the CN wiki, as well as thinking about various gov members I've met over the years. It occured to me that most of these are people are nothing more than active alliance members doing a duty or performing a service. Most of them aren't leaders.

Looking around Planet Bob today, the number of leaders still around is really saddening. There are so few real leaders around that it is not surprising there's no real drama going on anymore. Most of the quality leaders have left or retired, disgusted with the way we have become, or just bothered to kick a dead horse anymore.

Where are the Moldavis? P_Cs? Archons or Denzins of this generation? In all honesty, I don't see any. Players have become soft, and leading an alliance has become more about activity than it has about being an actual leader.

Here are some people that are still around(even if they're retired) that I think are "leaders"s (as in, more than just an active member). I'm trying to not be biased here, and I'm naming them as I think of them.

Xiphosis

Van Hoo III

grahamkeately

Ivan Moldavi

joracy

AlmightyGrub

Crymson

Dilber

ClashCityRocker

BamaBuc

KillJoy

mhawk

JBones

Twisted

Cortath

TheNeverender

Impero

MikeTheFirst

There's probably more, but I'm having trouble thinking of anyone outstanding. If you have suggestions, please let me know, and I'll consider it. It'll more likely than not be rejected though :P

The sad thing is, all of those leaders are from before the Karma war era. I have serious trouble thinking of even a single significant person after that war.

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What seems to happen a lot of the time is even those who lack leadership qualities try driving their leaders away thinking they would rather have someone else fill the position, so then they do whatever they can to try couping the leader or make being in the same alliance with them unpleasant enough until the leader gives up and decides the alliance isn't worth leading anymore. Then what the alliance is left with after is often times a leadership vacuum, where either incompetent people take over or someone who is just willing to fill the position because somebody has to, but don't have any direction on where they want to take the alliance beyond just continuing to exist, and aren't interesting in anything beyond self preservation.

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During my stint as Nordreich's Kaiser I attempted and largely succeeded in running our alliance in a way people hadn't seen before. This has been largely continued by my worthy successor. Because this style of leadership tends to bring much more praise than controversy, it probably doesn't belong on a list of this sort.

With respect to Electron Sponge, he is around. If some cannot see him, that is their fault, not his.

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Needs more Roquentin, Janax, Londo and any list lacking a single person from FAN...c'mon now...

Holding together an alliance in PM for 2 years is an feat no "really active member" could manage.

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MikeTheFirst probably qualifies as a leader. Impero... undecided about that guy. He does !@#$ that leaders shouldn't do, but he CAN lead... Meh, I'll throw him in anyway. OsRavan... Cool guy, but no.

Impero has to be on the list, and by initially leaving me off it would have me question your judgement on any other name there. Impero doesn't just lead an alliance that NpO's 2nd in command considers at the fore front of CN politics, he has led or played a large part in leading the victorious coalitions in Karma, BiPolar, and everything in between.

For further commentary, you have people on that list who just don't scream leadership.

First off, I mean no disrespect to either, but you have grahamkeatley and BamaBuc, both from TOOL. TOOL, especially now, doesn't really do a whole lot, and their leaders don't seem to have the requisite charisma and activity to be on the list. To have one I think would be too many, having two has to be out of the question.

You have mhawk and JBone of TPF as well. TPF hasn't really done a whole lot lately, just like TOOL. I will, however completely accept mhawk in this discussion, I just think with someone like that already representing an alliance, that you can't have a 2nd. That he is seemingly more active again will at least accomplish TPF being more relevant, and the game being more interesting, which is what should be both requisite characteristics of a leader.

I also don't see Twisted around much, although I love watching the man fight.

I think my list would be tiered, with the people that are there now, and the people who could break through into the top tier.

Top tier, who have made their mark on the game and can continue to do so:

Roq

Xiph

Hoo

Impero

Grub

Moldavi

Archon

Londo

Tulak

Delta

Sardonic

Tyga

Mhawk

Almost top tier, who have the opportunities soon to make their marks on the game or who have come close in the past:

Arexes/kriekfreak

Derwood

Janax

Cortath

Centurius

Jorost

OsRavan

Strictly my opinion, but my list doesn't have 5 members of 3 white team alliances (one of them not being Tyga for some reason) :P

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They certainly have a higher profile than most leaders around, but they are most definitely not the only leaders.

I'm sure you're right, but I just got back to CN from a 4+ year hiatus. Those were the only two I recognized.

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You say there's a lack of 'leaders', yet you come up with 18 names, most of which have a lot of influence in this world or left their mark on it. And then you still forgot about a whole lot of other people.

I disagree, we have more then enough 'leaders' around here.

Also, what are your criteria to make it on that list? It seems weird that you mention GK for example, what has he done more then someone like a Roquentin, a Chefjoe or a Moo-cows, to name a few?

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but knights of ni obviously invalidates everything else ever.

sorry, londo.

You aren't a leader! Leaders have ruined the planet, killed off their own environment! Their time is over. It is the towels' turn now.

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I'd say LiquidMercury was a good leader of men. During Karma/TPF/BiPolar people flocked to him.

I'd put Crymson and Feanor up there as well

Also Ramirus, crazy son of a !@#$%*

I'm sure there are plenty of others that were before my time or I just never met

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Top tier, who have made their mark on the game and can continue to do so:

Roq

Xiph

Hoo

Impero

Grub

Moldavi

Archon

Londo

Tulak

Delta

Sardonic

Tyga

Mhawk

Almost top tier, who have the opportunities soon to make their marks on the game or who have come close in the past:

Arexes/kriekfreak

Derwood

Janax

Cortath

Centurius

Jorost

OsRavan

Strictly my opinion, but my list doesn't have 5 members of 3 white team alliances (one of them not being Tyga for some reason) :P

I agree with your statement there, and certainly think the list could be tiered. It was rather late at night when I made this list so I was just naming people off the top of my head that had leadership qualities - even if their time time in leadership was a while ago. It was a "as long as they're still around" kind of thing.

I think your list is better though, but I just can't be bothered editing now haha

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You say there's a lack of 'leaders', yet you come up with 18 names, most of which have a lot of influence in this world or left their mark on it. And then you still forgot about a whole lot of other people.

I disagree, we have more then enough 'leaders' around here.

Also, what are your criteria to make it on that list? It seems weird that you mention GK for example, what has he done more then someone like a Roquentin, a Chefjoe or a Moo-cows, to name a few?

It's worth mentioning that everyone on that list is from before the Karma war.

Where's the new generation of leaders?

I certainly don't consider myself as one of them.

Also, people like GK, who has built a successful alliance (complete with haters. Hi MK :D) out of scratch while pretty much losing every single war is impressive, no matter how you spin it. If you know of others who did that, they deserve a mention as well.

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I'd say LiquidMercury was a good leader of men. During Karma/TPF/BiPolar people flocked to him.

I'd put Crymson and Feanor up there as well

Also Ramirus, crazy son of a !@#$%*

I'm sure there are plenty of others that were before my time or I just never met

Crymson is right there under AlmightyGrub.

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It's worth mentioning that everyone on that list is from before the Karma war.

Where's the new generation of leaders?

Well, there aren't a whole lot of alliances founded after the Karma war that were succesful, and given the fact that most leaders never leave their spot in government it is tough for new people to show what they're worth.

I'd mention Sardonic as someone who is quite influential and capable, but yeah I'll admit that I can't think of someone beside him right now. :P

I certainly don't consider myself as one of them.

Well, if you're going to make this list with tiers, why not?

I think some leaders are truly exceptional, take Ivan or Archon for example. Most all of us will never reach that level.

But holding together your own alliance is tough enough, and any leader who is able to do that deserves at the very least to be mentioned as capable.

Also, people like GK, who has built a successful alliance (complete with haters. Hi MK :D) out of scratch while pretty much losing every single war is impressive, no matter how you spin it. If you know of others who did that, they deserve a mention as well.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't have TOOL a whole lot of problems just a month or two ago? The TOOL of today isn't much of a powerhouse, at least that's how I see it.

Anyway, the point was that I thought that should GK be mentioned, other people would have to be as well.

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