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Athens (and possibly \m/) take actions in support of Heft.


Haflinger

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athens_m_cat_land.png

The general lesson here is that aiding rogues is only bad when they're hitting Ragnarok.

I don't know what role LegendoftheSkies plays in \m/ - possibly he's government, don't know.

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If RED's protectors dont like it they should do something about it... Hell I feel like aiding catland too just so you can directly make this about ragnarok if you want! Oh the hypocracy! :awesome:

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honestly, if ya'll have such issues with it, how about aiding RED nations who are fighting Cat Land.

yeah i don't like the fact that Londo aided a rogue as it makes Athens look bad and as an ally of Athens, it upsets me that he did this. but guess what, the only thing it did was make me wish that i had a couple of slots open so i could send aid to RED nations fighting Cat land.

and ya'll seriously wonder why most of ya'll are considered faux moralists. most of ya'll just sit there and whine about it instead of doing something proactive about the situation. sheesh.

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honestly, if ya'll have such issues with it, how about aiding RED nations who are fighting Cat Land.

yeah i don't like the fact that Londo aided a rogue as it makes Athens look bad and as an ally of Athens, it upsets me that he did this. but guess what, the only thing it did was make me wish that i had a couple of slots open so i could send aid to RED nations fighting Cat land.

and ya'll seriously wonder why most of ya'll are considered faux moralists. most of ya'll just sit there and whine about it instead of doing something proactive about the situation. sheesh.

His slots are full from techdeals; I checked 4 hours ago. Darned game mechanics making me a faux. :smug:

Also: Interalliance Politics 101: Treaties enable. If you're actually pissed, you should lobby for a treaty cancellation. 3,000,000 to RED doesn't teach Athens anything.

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Really? How so? Just curious. I'm not around a lot so I miss a few things here and there. :(

If you are talking about Tyler, Athens did not aid him in any way shape or form while he was doing his thing and when he was done, applied for membership back into Athens and was accepted. We wubs our tyler.

Right. GOONS misses a stagger and alliances have to pay them $15,000,000 to accept the nations; AcTi misses a stagger on their rogue and Athens gets to remove sanctions on him and take him back open arms. I get it, I've been around this block before. Athens is in CnG and Tyler's cool, he gets to just nuke people whenever he wants and Londo's cool he just gets to aid rogues--DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT unghguingnunngggggg

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Right. GOONS misses a stagger and alliances have to pay them $15,000,000 to accept the nations; AcTi misses a stagger on their rogue and Athens gets to remove sanctions on him and take him back open arms. I get it, I've been around this block before. Athens is in CnG and Tyler's cool, he gets to just nuke people whenever he wants and Londo's cool he just gets to aid rogues--DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT unghguingnunngggggg

Nobody really told anyone to do something about it and in regards to Tyler, if the concerned party came to us and told us he was on their ZI list, we would of told Tyler to wait until his ZI sentence was finished or we would of gotten him off the ZI list before we accepted him back with open arms.

If he was in any danger of being PZIed and the concerned party had no intentions of letting him off that list, then it would of been an entirely different story and If I was in charge, he would of been accepted back immediately and then I would told the concerned party "do something about it".

In regards to Londo and others :ph34r: ,if RED has an issue with it, they can bring it up with us in private and we can deal with it.

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His slots are full from techdeals; I checked 4 hours ago. Darned game mechanics making me a faux. :smug:

Also: Interalliance Politics 101: Treaties enable. If you're actually pissed, you should lobby for a treaty cancellation. 3,000,000 to RED doesn't teach Athens anything.

well, out of most on this blog, you are one of the few i don't consider faux. if you want to teach Athens something, the only way to do it would be to attack Londo or something along that lines. otherwise, you aren't going to teach Athens anything.

the only one's who have a shot at teaching Athens anything would be Athens themselves or their allies. same with \m/.

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It does appear as if RED has a CB against both \m/ and Athens. This could get interesting.

the only one's who have a shot at teaching Athens anything would be Athens themselves or their allies. same with \m/.

We're cool on 'teaching Athens' a lesson. Thanks for the suggestion, though!

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Nobody really told anyone to do something about it and in regards to Tyler, if the concerned party came to us and told us he was on their ZI list, we would of told Tyler to wait until his ZI sentence was finished or we would of gotten him off the ZI list before we accepted him back with open arms.

ORLY?

Session Start: Wed Nov 10 22:12:22 2010

[22:16] <Batallion> Essentially a rogue by the name of tyler is seeking acceptance into Athens

[22:16] <Batallion> And i am pretty sure Athens will accept him and tell us to $%&@ off, just because it's Athens.

[22:17] <Batallion> I'm sure you already know about tyler and all the rogue stuff he's done on AcTi.

[22:17] <Schattenmann> Nope

[22:17] <Batallion> Well now you know. lol

[22:17] <Batallion> He just went rogue on AcTi a few days ago

[22:17] <Batallion> That's what led to the war against TKTB + Sirius

[22:18] <Batallion> After TKTB filled his slot purposely (as James Maximus later even admitted to, and btw James is quitting CN now cuz he failed)

[22:18] <Schattenmann> Ohhh that guy

[22:18] <Batallion> Yeah

[22:18] <Schattenmann> Ok so he's applying to Athens but going to keep attacking you?

[22:18] <Batallion> Tyler got his sanction lifted by Athens' senator

[22:18] <Batallion> For no reason

[22:18] <Batallion> No we're pursuing him

[22:18] <Batallion> He has to pay for his rogue actions

[22:19] <Batallion> But now he's seeking asylum in Athens.

[22:19] <Batallion> Or trying to.

[22:19] <Batallion> He's on the Athens Applicant AA

[22:19] <Schattenmann> What's his rulername?

[22:19] <Batallion> He was former Athens to begin with.

[22:19] <Batallion> http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=193618

[22:20] <Batallion> Our protectorate is keeping him in war mode

[22:20] <Batallion> We'll be hitting him tonight.

[22:20] <Schattenmann> Is anyone in AcTi in his range?

[22:20] <Batallion> Plenty

[22:20] <Batallion> =-/

[22:21] <Batallion> I bet you anything that Athens will give him asylum

[22:21] <Batallion> And accept him into their ranks

[22:22] <Schattenmann> Well, here's the problem

[22:22] <Schattenmann> If he's on their applicant AA, when you attack him, Athens is going to call it an attack on Athens

[22:22] <Batallion> He was already declared a rogue.

[22:22] <Schattenmann> And everyone is going to agree

[22:23] <Batallion> No they won't, he was a rogue on AcTi everyone knows.

[22:26] <Batallion> I'm talking to rsox right now

[22:26] <Batallion> Seeing what they say.

[22:26] <Schattenmann> That's the best route

[redacted]

[22:29] <Batallion> So essentially rogues can go nuking alliances and Athens will defend them and no one can do anything about it

[22:29] <Schattenmann> Someone bigger than Athens or allied to Athens can do something about it, or someone smaller than Athens but well-connected

[22:33] <Batallion> Hmm

[22:35] <Schattenmann> Is Sigrun on IRC?

[22:36] <Batallion> He's away

[22:37] <Schattenmann> Has Athens contacted [sigrun] about their attacks?

[22:37] <Batallion> I dunno

[22:37] <Batallion> Rsox told me they take it that AcTi peaced with tyler

[22:37] <Batallion> because we accepted his peace offer in-game, but i never told tyler he's off the hook and tyler knew that.

[22:38] <Schattenmann> Explain to him you were at full-blown war, which took priority, but that's he's not off the hook

[22:38] <Schattenmann> When did you guys take his peace offer?

[22:39] <Batallion> When Sirius peaced out

[22:39] <Schattenmann> alright

[22:39] <Schattenmann> Explain to him you were at full-blown war, which took priority, but that's he's not off the hook

[22:39] <Batallion> I am

[22:40] <Batallion> And let alone, Athens removed his sanction.

[22:40] <Batallion> Without Fark's discretion

[22:40] <Batallion> -_-

[22:40] <Batallion> He's bought more nukes now because of that.

The simple fact of the matter is that Athens accepted a nation at war, who was a known rogue, lifted the sanctions placed against it by Fark, and then told AcTi to sit on it.

If he was in any danger of being PZIed and the concerned party had no intentions of letting him off that list, then it would of been an entirely different story and If I was in charge, he would of been accepted back immediately and then I would told the concerned party "do something about it".

Athens: Crusaders against PZI, no rogue too sullied.

Limitations apply, no enemies over 3m NS, no enemies with MADPs, see gov for further details.

In regards to Londo and others :ph34r: ,if RED has an issue with it, they can bring it up with us in private and we can deal with it.

I love patterns. Athens breaks the rules consistently, and then it's up to people in far weaker positions to come hat in hand and ask for recompense at which time Athens will exercise its ability to tell them to get bent. Stellar way to run things. At least it's transparent.

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I just don't get why AcTi didn't just declare on us for harboring a rogue :rolleyes:

I just don't get why Athens doesn't grow a manhood and for once pick a fight with an alliance that poses a risk. :rolleyes:

"Oooooh, we're so edgy! We're mass raiding Knights of Ni! Eeeeewwwww, check this out, brohams, we're aiding rogues on RED!" Impress Surprise me: pick on IRON.

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It does appear as if RED has a CB against both \m/ and Athens. This could get interesting.

Yes, Athens committing random acts of war against 14-man alliances is certain to lead to something interesting.

I just don't get why AcTi didn't just declare on us for harboring a rogue :rolleyes:

Because you're bigger. Duh.

His slots are full from techdeals; I checked 4 hours ago. Darned game mechanics making me a faux. :smug:

Actually, most of that is freebie aid. I aid out to Invicta quite a lot.

Also: Interalliance Politics 101: Treaties enable. If you're actually pissed, you should lobby for a treaty cancellation. 3,000,000 to RED doesn't teach Athens anything.

It's funny that this still needs to be said.

I don't think RED has a protector.

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I just don't get why AcTi didn't just declare on us for harboring a rogue

Because you're bigger. Duh.

I think it was a genuine comment Haf. This guy is a little off the pace for a MoFA.

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ORLY?

The simple fact of the matter is that Athens accepted a nation at war, who was a known rogue, lifted the sanctions placed against it by Fark, and then told AcTi to sit on it.

No, Batallion peaced Tyler out, at which point the war was over, at which point Tyler applied to Athens and I later removed his sanction, as the war was over. Newsflash: If you want to keep attacking someone you don't peace them out. And no, Tyler was not peaced out until the war with Sirius ENDED. AcTi lost any reasonable claim to keep attacking Tyler when Batallion peaced him out along with the rest of the Sirius combatants. I also had a discussion with the other 2 senators at the time, and they agreed that lifting sanctions after a rogue has been peaced out is reasonable, because it implies the conflict is over. And AcTi did not come to me at any time to talk about anything.

I love patterns. Athens breaks the rules consistently, and then it's up to people in far weaker positions to come hat in hand and ask for recompense at which time Athens will exercise its ability to tell them to get bent. Stellar way to run things. At least it's transparent.

Yeah it's not like Athens fought NPO (twice) or TOP or anyone before. As far as how we behave, I am just doing my part to encourage conflict and save the world before we all delete out of boredom. :awesome: It pleased me to send dongs in the service of encouraging war, especially to a so recently former Athenian, and so I did it. Admin wills it.

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No, Batallion peaced Tyler out, at which point the war was over, at which point Tyler applied to Athens and I later removed his sanction, as the war was over. Newsflash: If you want to keep attacking someone you don't peace them out. And no, Tyler was not peaced out until the war with Sirius ENDED. AcTi lost any reasonable claim to keep attacking Tyler when Batallion peaced him out along with the rest of the Sirius combatants. I also had a discussion with the other 2 senators at the time, and they agreed that lifting sanctions after a rogue has been peaced out is reasonable, because it implies the conflict is over. And AcTi did not come to me at any time to talk about anything.

AcTi was at war. It is reasonable to assume that a message was sent out to peace out. Perhaps Tyler was peaced out accidentally. Perhaps he was given peace to allow his attacker to recover because of the war and a new attacker that is more intact was going to be sent at Tyler. Either way, no he was not released from war just because he was peaced out in game.

The time AcTi would go to you to talk about anything such as lifting the sanctions against Tyler would be when he was actually released from war. Otherwise, they should have no reason to talk to you. How another alliance manages it's wars and when they declare and when they peace out a rogue is no business of Athens.

Yeah it's not like Athens fought NPO (twice) or TOP or anyone before. As far as how we behave, I am just doing my part to encourage conflict and save the world before we all delete out of boredom. :awesome: It pleased me to send dongs in the service of encouraging war, especially to a so recently former Athenian, and so I did it. Admin wills it.

I recall a spreadsheet on Karma and how Athens' offensive war slots were in use at extremely lower percentages compared to its allies. You didn't fight NPO, your allies did.

Schatt is right. Athens only picks on those it can muscle.

Londo, I'm sure you recall what happened to Rush and you when you came to me with some stuff ;)

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The only problem here is that everyone involved is content to play the parts that were written years ago, they've just decided to switch roles. If NPO or GGA or whomever would have done this, oh, 3 or so years ago, the responses would be exactly the same, it's just everyone's roles have been reversed.

2 questions then. 1) does this petty little squabble even matter? and 2) who !@#$@#$ cares?

Start following a new script.

In other words, if your best course of action is to simply moan about things happening that you have no control over, or don't want to have control over because acting is infinitely harder than re-acting, then you're just playing the part of, say, legion in early 2007. You want a different outcome? Don't keep doing what alliances/individuals did back then when they thought the NPO and their friends were running wild.

And if any of you say that the legion actually tried to change things, or everyone against the top dogs back then tried to change things, remember that in every single war, the NPO and their friends were the AGGRESSORS. You ain't changing !@#$ if you're simply re-acting, unless the aggressors colossally $%&@ up.

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I just don't get why Athens doesn't grow a manhood and for once pick a fight with an alliance that poses a risk. :rolleyes:

"Oooooh, we're so edgy! We're mass raiding Knights of Ni! Eeeeewwwww, check this out, brohams, we're aiding rogues on RED!" Impress Surprise me: pick on IRON.

Selective memory at its greatest right here. However, I'll defer to Londo's post.

Yes, I think so too. Thus the inclusion of the word "duh" in my post.

It seems I am officially deserving of my position.

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I believe that RED cancelled their protectorate agreement with INT.

Note that RED cancelled it, not the other way around. Claims of their competency are sure on a rocky foundation now if they weren't already.

RED wanted to... graduate is the best word I can think of, from protectorate status and sign an MDoAP. We (INT) didn't think they were ready, and said that we'd consider keeping the protectorate, or signing an ODP. So they decided to cancel the protectorate and strike out on their own.

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Well, I have looked. Long and hard, to find any active treaties that RED holds. I haven't found any. A quick check of their forums, was able to find no posts in their "spam" section since Oct. 25th. My point is, Londo could not be guilty of aiding someone roguing an alliance, if the alliance being hit, does not constitute an alliance as per Athens' guidelines. So, if anyone out there actually holds a military level treaty with RED, and they want to come talk to me, I will work it out in a satisfactory manner for them. If, however, as I seem to have found, they hold no military level treaties, and as they clearly sit at less than 15 members, then SWAT, is simply not viewed by Athens as a rogue. We, in that case, do not recognize RED as an alliance(as they fall within our raid guidelines... others may recognize them, and kudos to them, but we do not). Hence, it is simply Londo aiding a friend at war. The standard of treaties and X number of members to be an alliance, is not a standard that Athens started, it is a community established standard(varying from AA to AA), and we have no problems playing by such a standard. So, as I said, I would gladly work this out with RED, or a protector, should they seek me out, but as it stands now, I can find no treaties of military level for RED, and they are less than 15 members. Carry on.

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I'm guessing this will happen if the INT still protects them: "Pay reps" "No!... Ok then". The end.

INT does not protect them. But, I can assure you, if INT did, it wouldn't go down like that. We rather love those commies.

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Yes, Athens committing random acts of war against 14-man alliances is certain to lead to something interesting.

I'm glad to see that you understand the concept of sarcasm. I'm disappointed that you cannot recognize its implementation.

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I just don't get why Athens doesn't grow a manhood and for once pick a fight with an alliance that poses a risk. :rolleyes:

"Oooooh, we're so edgy! We're mass raiding Knights of Ni! Eeeeewwwww, check this out, brohams, we're aiding rogues on RED!" Impress Surprise me: pick on IRON.

You do realize that Athens was about to declare war on GOD a few months ago, right?

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