Imperial Decree from the New Pacific Order

[Rush Sykes]

 

TOP are a civilized alliance, and it remains to be seen whether they stand with us this time. Doomsphere are truly barbarians. Or aliens, as they seem to prefer. That's actually pretty accurate. An alien invasion should unite us all in repelling it. We can hash out our political grudges later.

 

Regardless of what we should or shouldn't have done before, it's kind of silly to stand here and defend this war by saying it's the same mistake as last war.

 

Dajobo even offered us up to duel Pacifica, so you know this isn't about infra-hugging. If we have to get rolled, so be it. What I'm talking about is keeping all of us who aren't at 30k+ tech still in "the game."

 

Lets be honest.. the offer of 1v1 duels to settle grudges is older than the hills. It makes for good theater and decent narrative, but it is never ever practical, and will never ever happen as a mainstay. You also now sound like Tywin, civilized alliance and whatnot. You are better than that. This was brought on by FA failures by NpO and TOP both. You both exited the last war with the entire world at your feet, only to find that nobody would touch you going forward. You had no paths open to you. Why? Surely you get the why.

 

TOPs gov calling C&G expendable... closed off C&G. Sure there was some openness, but it really was DoA, in regards to a relationship.

 

Your coalition not standing up to allies who wanted to extract that extra pound of flesh from NPO for the horrific crime of leaving 29/74 +90K nations in PM the entire war (something literally EVERYONE does, just on a smaller scale since most AAs dont have 74 in that range) kinda made moving forward on that front impossible.

 

Continuing to snuggle Mi6 as they tried to walk across the world with the combined smugness of Umbrella, GOONS and MK rolled into one, despite having done NOTHING to earn that smug, literally rubbing EVERYONE the wrong way so that NOBODY wanted to be near enough to TOP-Polar for fear of the stench.

 

Lots of main bullet points, you can talk around and find a dozen more examples like what it is above , forming and shaping the various opinions of the entire planet outside of Platysphere. The only real difference is, for all his faults, Roquentin recognized it. Umb recognized it. And while I find it a tad classless , the speed in which they flopped, I can certainly see why, and if my personal chats with folks in Umb were honest, I can honestly see where they are coming from.

 

This is not about "civilized and uncivilized", you still have GOONS in your sphere. You are the alliance who invented the in-war backstab, in fact. This is about the political game that happens between great wars. You accepted a following of people who made moving forward impossible. The rest of the world didnt come together, they were forced together to avoid being part of the great sphere (sarcasm) that Polar and  TOP were erecting. 

Edited November 13, 2014 by Rush Sykes

[Garion]

Rush's post makes sense, what have you done Polar...

[Letum]

Polaris and Pacifica have had meaningful discussions that started mid the last war, the only issue ever raised by you was our allies.   In order to ''mend the bridge'' you required something that we were not prepared to do.  We are not friends with doomsphere, we will never be friends with doomsphere and unlike you we are not prepared to even pretend to like doomsphere.  Its goals and manner are not consistent with the best interests of Bob at any level .  We certainly will not drop our friends to appease you and we will certainly not do anything at all to comply with the objectives or will of doomsphere.

The main issue I raised was your relationship with my allies. You've alienated almost every single one of our allies (and in doing so, pushed them closer to doomsphere).

You have every right to not want to be friendly with them, of course. But if you aren't going to make up with them, what do you expect us to do? Drop them for your sake? We're obviously no more likely to do that than you are.

It's a glaringly obvious hole I pointed out many times. Each time I did, your alliance gave the impression that you were only interested in our individual relationship, not our allies.

And as you said, our treaties with our allies trump third parties.

[Krihelion]

You were upset about being rolled. Im upset that you are siding with the true enemy of civilization for revenge or a short term political gain.

you should go back and lead them to victory

[Rush Sykes]

Rush's post makes sense, what have you done Polar...

 

You shower this instant sir.

[The Zigur]

 

Lets be honest.. the offer of 1v1 duels to settle grudges is older than the hills. It makes for good theater and decent narrative, but it is never ever practical, and will never ever happen as a mainstay. You also now sound like Tywin, civilized alliance and whatnot. You are better than that. This was brought on by FA failures by NpO and TOP both. You both exited the last war with the entire world at your feet, only to find that nobody would touch you going forward. You had no paths open to you. Why? Surely you get the why.

 

TOPs gov calling C&G expendable... closed off C&G. Sure there was some openness, but it really was DoA, in regards to a relationship.

 

Your coalition not standing up to allies who wanted to extract that extra pound of flesh from NPO for the horrific crime of leaving 29/74 +90K nations in PM the entire war (something literally EVERYONE does, just on a smaller scale since most AAs dont have 74 in that range) kinda made moving forward on that front impossible.

 

Continuing to snuggle Mi6 as they tried to walk across the world with the combined smugness of Umbrella, GOONS and MK rolled into one, despite having done NOTHING to earn that smug, literally rubbing EVERYONE the wrong way so that NOBODY wanted to be near enough to TOP-Polar for fear of the stench.

 

Lots of main bullet points, you can talk around and find a dozen more examples like what it is above , forming and shaping the various opinions of the entire planet outside of Platysphere. The only real difference is, for all his faults, Roquentin recognized it. Umb recognized it. And while I find it a tad classless , the speed in which they flopped, I can certainly see why, and if my personal chats with folks in Umb were honest, I can honestly see where they are coming from.

 

This is not about "civilized and uncivilized", you still have GOONS in your sphere. You are the alliance who invented the in-war backstab, in fact. This is about the political game that happens between great wars. You accepted a following of people who made moving forward impossible. The rest of the world didnt come together, they were forced together to avoid being part of the great sphere (sarcasm) that Polar and  TOP were erecting. 

 

It is possible for the uncivilized to civilize. I was once uncivilized myself, so bringing up GOONS is a cheap shot... they are a much different alliance than the old GOONS was. MI6 rubbing some people the wrong way (btw AFTER being attacked by Kaskus at the prodding of the lulzists) does not change the class dynamics taking place between the reactionaries choosing to support Doomsphere for whatever reason (*cough NPO *cough), and the forward-thinking alliances who desire to preserve their sovereignty in the face of a threat posed by a tyrant.

 

Were mistakes made? Certainly, I will admit that SNX moving into the brown team sphere was a mistake. It alienated several NPO allies and made progress difficult with them. NPO was certainly making an attempt to establish ties with Polar sphere for some time, but within the time frame available it couldn't happen. That doesn't excuse pulling a 180 and siding with the lulzists out of an arrogant belief NPO can somehow unilaterally re-establish Order while surrounded by chaotic influences. It just doesn't work that way, especially with DBDC exercising such totalitarian control over the top tier.

 

NPO is going to have a harsh wake up call when it finds itself even more of a second tier alliance following the war.

Edited November 13, 2014 by Tywin Lannister

[Ogaden]

Uh, having been in that coalition myself, I seem to recall the NPO terms being a line item that Umbrella was very interested in?

But hey let's just shove that down the memory hole.

Edited November 13, 2014 by Ogaden

[HeroofTime55]

What a goddamned joke this entire DoW is.  How far you have fallen, Pacifica.  Once a name that struck fear in the hearts of men, now you only strike laughter.

At least I have the satisfaction of knowing that my alliance will probably find itself on both sides of the war, as is tradition.

[HeroofTime55]

Uh, having been in that coalition myself, I seem to recall the NPO terms being a line item that Umbrella was very interested in?

But hey let's just shove that down the memory hole.

Remember when noble Pacifica screwed us all over a couple wars back?  And now they have the audacity to claim that they're the ones being backstabbed?

As I said, a goddamned joke.

[Canik]

TOP are a civilized alliance

 

top kek

I feel like some of you are judging books by the cover. What's inside is more similar than you might expect.

[Monster]

Uh, having been in that coalition myself, I seem to recall the NPO terms being a line item that Umbrella was very interested in?

But hey let's just shove that down the memory hole.

 

I believe this was addressed in the original post and in our treaty topic. I realize both are long, but attention to detail is important.

[Ogaden]

I believe this was addressed in the original post and in our treaty topic. I realize both are long, but attention to detail is important.

I'm sure many kumbayas were sung, and much hugging was involved

[wes the wise]

All this chit chat, and I still can't figure out what any of this has to do with AFT, or specifically Invicta and SNX...

[Sardonic]

 

 you still have GOONS in your sphere.

I'm going to leave aside the other issues, but I'm not really sure it's reasonable to say GOONS and NpO are in the same sphere.

[The Zigur]

All this chit chat, and I still can't figure out what any of this has to do with AFT, or specifically Invicta and SNX...

 

It doesn't, Pacifica takes its marching orders from the lulzists now. The Immortals of the God Emperor it would seem.

[Letum]

All this chit chat, and I still can't figure out what any of this has to do with AFT, or specifically Invicta and SNX...

Bad luck mostly.

[Rush Sykes]

I'm going to leave aside the other issues, but I'm not really sure it's reasonable to say GOONS and NpO are in the same sphere.

 

Just for clarification, I was not insinuating GOONS are uncivilized. Only in the context of the historical interpretations of those I was responding to. And prior to Umbrella doing this 180, you were pretty squarely in their sphere, and to say otherwise is to kid yourself.

[Longshadow]

I have popcorn and beer to watch the sparks fly and wait intently to see what happens next. If you want some just ask :)

 

Good luck to all involved and happy war hunting!

[Franz Ferdinand]

It doesn't, Pacifica takes its marching orders from the lulzists now. The Immortals of the God Emperor it would seem.

Does it not make sense now? I have finally managed to influence Pacifica from behind the scenes. You should probably just go out into the sunset and allow for me to continue ruling this world with an iron fist.

[Lord bagel]

Does it not make sense now? I have finally managed to influence Pacifica from behind the scenes. You should probably just go out into the sunset and allow for me to continue ruling this world with an iron fist.

Oh god, you guys have IRON too? What am i supposed to do now? :(

[rileyaddaff]

TOP are a civilized alliance, and it remains to be seen whether they stand with us this time. Doomsphere are truly barbarians. Or aliens, as they seem to prefer. That's actually pretty accurate. An alien invasion should unite us all in repelling it. We can hash out our political grudges later.
 
Regardless of what we should or shouldn't have done before, it's kind of silly to stand here and defend this war by saying it's the same mistake as last war.
 
Dajobo even offered us up to duel Pacifica, so you know this isn't about infra-hugging. If we have to get rolled, so be it. What I'm talking about is keeping all of us who aren't at 30k+ tech still in "the game."

This post should read "Help us in fighting DBDC/Doomsphere NPO and then we can duel out our differences later."

Do you honestly think NPO doesn't remember EQ and how it led to the disorder war?

[Azaghul]

And I thought Tywin's essays were long.   :psyduck:

[Monster]

 

Just for clarification, I was not insinuating GOONS are uncivilized. Only in the context of the historical interpretations of those I was responding to. And prior to Umbrella doing this 180, you were pretty squarely in their sphere, and to say otherwise is to kid yourself.

 

I would strongly suggest taking a look at the treaties of Umbrella and VE, GOONS' two oldest allies when saying this.   To assume that we had signed onto all future projects/wars of our previous coalition partners, especially when they came into conflict with a particular trajectory(our ties to a certain bloc) we had planned since the end of Equilibrium would be a big mistake. 

Edited November 13, 2014 by Monster

[Prodigal Moon]

 

Lets be honest.. the offer of 1v1 duels to settle grudges is older than the hills. It makes for good theater and decent narrative, but it is never ever practical, and will never ever happen as a mainstay. You also now sound like Tywin, civilized alliance and whatnot. You are better than that. This was brought on by FA failures by NpO and TOP both. You both exited the last war with the entire world at your feet, only to find that nobody would touch you going forward. You had no paths open to you. Why? Surely you get the why.

 

TOPs gov calling C&G expendable... closed off C&G. Sure there was some openness, but it really was DoA, in regards to a relationship.

 

Your coalition not standing up to allies who wanted to extract that extra pound of flesh from NPO for the horrific crime of leaving 29/74 +90K nations in PM the entire war (something literally EVERYONE does, just on a smaller scale since most AAs dont have 74 in that range) kinda made moving forward on that front impossible.

 

Continuing to snuggle Mi6 as they tried to walk across the world with the combined smugness of Umbrella, GOONS and MK rolled into one, despite having done NOTHING to earn that smug, literally rubbing EVERYONE the wrong way so that NOBODY wanted to be near enough to TOP-Polar for fear of the stench.

 

Lots of main bullet points, you can talk around and find a dozen more examples like what it is above , forming and shaping the various opinions of the entire planet outside of Platysphere. The only real difference is, for all his faults, Roquentin recognized it. Umb recognized it. And while I find it a tad classless , the speed in which they flopped, I can certainly see why, and if my personal chats with folks in Umb were honest, I can honestly see where they are coming from.

 

This is not about "civilized and uncivilized", you still have GOONS in your sphere. You are the alliance who invented the in-war backstab, in fact. This is about the political game that happens between great wars. You accepted a following of people who made moving forward impossible. The rest of the world didnt come together, they were forced together to avoid being part of the great sphere (sarcasm) that Polar and  TOP were erecting. 

 

Long story short: you guys keep focusing on justifying your grudges and feelings. I'm talking about that "material reality" that NPO claims it's all about. What are you going to say when you're dominated by Doomsphere after this? "Well, it's just that MI6 was so smug, I'm glad we went after them instead"? You're lucky I'm not Schatt or I would write an essay about friendship vs. military treaties.

 

If you can't justify this war based on actual threat assessment, or a coherent vision of how things play out afterwards ("build a new order from the ashes" doesn't count), then I think you've conceded the point.

[Rush Sykes]

 

Long story short: you guys keep focusing on justifying your grudges and feelings. I'm talking about that "material reality" that NPO claims it's all about. What are you going to say when you're dominated by Doomsphere after this? "Well, it's just that MI6 was so smug, I'm glad we went after them instead"? You're lucky I'm not Schatt or I would write an essay about friendship vs. military treaties.

 

If you can't justify this war based on actual threat assessment, or a coherent vision of how things play out afterwards ("build a new order from the ashes" doesn't count), then I think you've conceded the point.

 

For me, personally, that is EXACTLY what I would say. I look at folks who make up DBDC and Doom Squad... and you know what? I see MK, MK, MK, MK, MK. I am content with playing a role within that, I did it for years. This is not about building a new order, not for me. This is about watching people who thought they were excedingly important on the world stage, with all these grand visions, fall flat on their face and fail in their designs after casting my alliance and its allies aside for "greener" pastures. No hatchet burying, no reconciliation, not from me. Pure unadulterated joy at watching certain people fail so miserably because of things that THEY themselves said, that they suddenly think everyone should conveniently forget. When relationships fail, words matter, your "friends" chose their breakup words very poorly.

Edited November 13, 2014 by Rush Sykes