UN Security Council Discussion

[Triyun]

"Meh, no that's stretching it.  

 

By that logic of a continuation argument to note that Alaska, and your Caribbean territories are equally illegal, as is Russia's territory in Canada.  Of course its the Empire's view that these actions are perfectly legitimate as is other actions in South America, no different then ones Athen's undertakes in Africa.  The differences between those and Dai-Tokoku's actions are unclear.  Tianxia flat out disagrees with Athens on this one, in hat we do not see the South Americans having any sort of special claim, nor is it at all clear to us that the South Americans are cooperative, only becoming so when their military defeats are assured.  To me that's not real cooperation. "

[Centurius]

"Meh, no that's stretching it.  

 

By that logic of a continuation argument to note that Alaska, and your Caribbean territories are equally illegal, as is Russia's territory in Canada.  Of course its the Empire's view that these actions are perfectly legitimate as is other actions in South America, no different then ones Athen's undertakes in Africa.  The differences between those and Dai-Tokoku's actions are unclear.  Tianxia flat out disagrees with Athens on this one, in hat we do not see the South Americans having any sort of special claim, nor is it at all clear to us that the South Americans are cooperative, only becoming so when their military defeats are assured.  To me that's not real cooperation. "

"Thank you for proving our point that ownership of territory in the past does not imply a claim in the present and thus defeating Dai Tohoku's argument the lands formerly owned by Argentina belong to Bolivia due to a war fought in the 19th century.

 

The South Americans have a special claim as any region has under the spirit of this charter. To set the course for its region and independence. The Republica is a state that has existed much longer than Dai Tohoku and has both the logistical capabilities and government to exercise control. Furthermore the Republica has opened a forum where regional powers are able to discuss matters in a peaceful environment. Something both Tianxia and Dai Tohoku have failed incredibly in with the latter and something Dai Tohoku cannot state with the former. As for the cooperativeness it would seem the two of us are connected to different diplomatic feeds as the South American states have shown nothing but a willingness to cooperate since the defeat of Bolivia"

Edited November 27, 2013 by Centurius

[Lord Zephyr]

It seems that Tianxia has decided to try and Escalate this conflict when it seemed like it was toning down. We ask that a Neutral party becomes involved to mediate the situation so that further escalation does not occur. 

[Triyun]

We entirely disagree with arguments under the spirit of the charter.  Republica has simply shown itself in our judgement hostile up until the point until it needs something, then it becomes cooperative.  This is not enough in our judgement to be considered truly cooperative.  Either honesty and true trustworthiness is needed, or they will be treated as such.  The Empire firmly asserts as a diplomatic principle that the measure of cooperation is determined by actions willingly given not under duress.  Paraguay too showed an extreme degree of hostility throughout the Bolivia thing, and their contrition seems offly convenient.  Further future attempts to push Tianxia out of the region or in anyways diminish power is an insult, and shall be taken as just that and nothing more.

[Lord Zephyr]

You keep saying that the Republica has been hostile to you very often. What examples do you have of our hostilities? I'm sure they are just misunderstandings at best.

[VigilantWatcher]

The Gran Colombia Representative Maria Parentes held up her hand. "We must all keep our heads. This could become a wider and more dangerous problem if we don't contain the situation now.There must be a solid diplomatic solution to these issues. Gran Colombia has no desire to see any needless conflict.

[lkfht]

"The Paraguayan government questions why the other UNSC members have been silent on such an important matter concerning the continent of South America."

- UN Ambassador Silandra Lopez

[Captain Enema]

"Legion finds it disconcerting that Bolivia was gobbled up in what appears to be the misguided guise of a new Co-prosperity sphere under the flag of the United Nations. The further actions in South America are equally concerning and the dignity and respect of the United Nations Security Council are becoming grossly weaker with every passing day."

[Justinian the Mighty]

Russia’s ambassador Prince Gallitzin stepped forward to speak, “Of all people I would have thought Athens would understand what is trying to be accomplished in Bolivia. When the Nordic Socialists reared their ugly heads in Europe, Russia prepared to meet that challenge. When that system finally collapsed Athens stepped in, against the wishes of Russia, asserted its influence in Eastern Europe and Africa. We see that same happening in Bolivia with the North Japanese. The only difference is that the Republica thinks it is owed something, but it is not.

[Captain Enema]

Russia’s ambassador Prince Gallitzin stepped forward to speak, “Of all people I would have thought Athens would understand what is trying to be accomplished in Bolivia. When the Nordic Socialists reared their ugly heads in Europe, Russia prepared to meet that challenge. When that system finally collapsed Athens stepped in, against the wishes of Russia, asserted its influence in Eastern Europe and Africa. We see that same happening in Bolivia with the North Japanese. The only difference is that the Republica thinks it is owed something, but it is not.

 

"Are the people of Bolivia owed the attention of neocolonial occupiers and the fetid foul stench of a revanchist Imperial Japanese Co-prosperity Sphere? I would say no and further I would say the Japanese and Tianxians ought to be contain themselves just enough to pull out of South America and allow a United Nations Protectorate to be put in place as none of the current governmental bodies in South America are inspiring much faith or trust in the eyes of Legion."

[lkfht]

"The Paraguayan government supports a United Nations protectorate in South America that would be overseen by ALL UNSC Members, not just Tianxia and Japan."

- UN Ambassador Silandra Lopez

[Yawoo]

"To ensure no further hostilities erupt, stability to return, and the will of the people to be shown, Prussia suggests a ten-year neutral United Nations peacekeeping mission that culminates in a referendum so that the native inhabitants can decide on their future. Let not territorial ambitions distract from a peaceful alternative to bloodshed - and for the will of the people to win over the force of arms."

[Triyun]

Russia’s ambassador Prince Gallitzin stepped forward to speak, “Of all people I would have thought Athens would understand what is trying to be accomplished in Bolivia. When the Nordic Socialists reared their ugly heads in Europe, Russia prepared to meet that challenge. When that system finally collapsed Athens stepped in, against the wishes of Russia, asserted its influence in Eastern Europe and Africa. We see that same happening in Bolivia with the North Japanese. The only difference is that the Republica thinks it is owed something, but it is not.

 

We agree at the same time we vote no on any resolution that hypocritically treats Dai Tokoku differently.  We also note that the Republica has absolutely zero position to date saying lands being disputed are in anyway Paraguays.  Republica's position is that its their sovereign territory that's what they've said several times.

Edited November 30, 2013 by Triyun

[Evangeline Anovilis]

 

"Are the people of Bolivia owed the attention of neocolonial occupiers and the fetid foul stench of a revanchist Imperial Japanese Co-prosperity Sphere? I would say no and further I would say the Japanese and Tianxians ought to be contain themselves just enough to pull out of South America and allow a United Nations Protectorate to be put in place as none of the current governmental bodies in South America are inspiring much faith or trust in the eyes of Legion."

"We find the notion of wanting to create a new Co-Prosperity Sphere frankly insulting. Legion's words are nought but slander of our intentions to rebuild Bolivia in the context of a greater Pacific brotherhood, which offers itself through the Empire. Our authorities have been very tolerant in handling locals and plans are being drawn up to implement a democratic and modern political culture, to surplant the old corrupt structures of United Bolivia. If Legion does not trust our country or the Empire with administering Bolivia, that is very saddening, but just as with the baseless claims of the Republica, we are determined to continue our efforts despite such critical voices.

 

Additionally, we would like to point out to the Paraguayan representatives that the country's name is Dai-Tōhoku Renpō, not Japan.

 

And we thank the Russian representatives for their understanding of the situation, which sadly is not too widespread, as the amount of critical voices shows."

-Katsura Kaede, permanent representative of the Dai-Tōhoku Renpō

[Centurius]

Russia’s ambassador Prince Gallitzin stepped forward to speak, “Of all people I would have thought Athens would understand what is trying to be accomplished in Bolivia. When the Nordic Socialists reared their ugly heads in Europe, Russia prepared to meet that challenge. When that system finally collapsed Athens stepped in, against the wishes of Russia, asserted its influence in Eastern Europe and Africa. We see that same happening in Bolivia with the North Japanese. The only difference is that the Republica thinks it is owed something, but it is not.

 

"To compare the two situations is quite frankly absurd, for one the Athenian Federation was part of the European and African continents already and bordered the regions affected. Furthermore the lands belonging to the Germanic Empire showed itself much more open to an ally than to a hostile state who was just about ready to bomb them. Even then the Russian government was consulted on several occasions about developments in the protectorate and a significant part of Eastern Europe was handed over. Likewise a policy of cooperation has been maintained in the African continent and only when a clear violation of fundamental freedoms occurred was force used. In moderation at that. Dai Tohoku and Tianxia are completely foreign powers who have maintained a policy of provocation and aggression towards regional South American powers. Your argument is quite frankly absurd and we would have expected better reasoning from Russia." The Athenian ambassador Athena Dellis responded.

"To ensure no further hostilities erupt, stability to return, and the will of the people to be shown, Prussia suggests a ten-year neutral United Nations peacekeeping mission that culminates in a referendum so that the native inhabitants can decide on their future. Let not territorial ambitions distract from a peaceful alternative to bloodshed - and for the will of the people to win over the force of arms."

"The Athenian Federation supports this initiative"

[Zoot Zoot]

The Norse Kingdom supports the proposal by Prussia.

[lkfht]

We agree at the same time we vote no on any resolution that hypocritically treats Dai Tokoku differently.  We also note that the Republica has absolutely zero position to date saying lands being disputed are in anyway Paraguays.  Republica's position is that its their sovereign territory that's what they've said several times.

 "Paraguay has never, at this very time, claimed any land outside of our natural borders. We are simply concerned for the South American continent becuase it just so happens to be where we live. We support the proposal by Prussia one-hundred percent!"

 

- UN Ambassador Silandra Lopez

[iamthey]

Austria supports its Athenian allies, and the prussian initiative. It is time that we place our trust in the re-newed international framework.

[Triyun]

 "Paraguay has never, at this very time, claimed any land outside of our natural borders. We are simply concerned for the South American continent becuase it just so happens to be where we live. We support the proposal by Prussia one-hundred percent!"

 

- UN Ambassador Silandra Lopez

 

Has never?  Surely you remember we save statements and newspapers.  You have in fact very much stated you wanted territory in Bolivia.  The only thing that stopped you was not being able to seize it.  Beyond that you miss our point entirely, which is that it is Republica whose made unilateral claims to the whole of South America, save for pretty much Paraguay.  These claims were referred to as Republica Territory, not joint territory in anyway.  You're not objecting there, its a hypocritical position.  

 

Tianxia's point here and why we vetoed this resolution is that these policies are being unfairly singled out.  Other massive expansions of protectorate claims and even land expansions have been made in the past to 0 complain, most recently the addition of South Africa as Athenian.  yes on the tip top other end of Africa they have territory, but that has little in common with South Africa.  The Eastern European moves were down with great discomfort of Russia, and to say consultation is frankly putting it kindly as it was known that Russia had large objections to it but all parties involved there, especially Athens.

 

However, these disputes were handled with delicacy and care that Athens is not currently affording others, and is in fact throwing around bombastic and rude language to those its commited to being cordial with, which is totally out of line with the current situation and the current history of the South American Continent which is to say that there has undeniably been rhetoric and actions that are provocative by Republica and Paraguay in the past.

 

These rhetorical flare ups are followed by apologies, however, they seem to show those two nations true feelings.  As such we find this entire faux moral outrage ridiculous and based on self serving hypocrisy of individual nations rather than a consistent message and political action applied across policy realm.

 

The exception to this may be Prussia who has not made many statements or actions in the international arena, and as such we acknowledge we simply have a difference of view on. 

[lkfht]

Has never?  Surely you remember we save statements and newspapers.  You have in fact very much stated you wanted territory in Bolivia.  The only thing that stopped you was not being able to seize it.  Beyond that you miss our point entirely, which is that it is Republica whose made unilateral claims to the whole of South America, save for pretty much Paraguay.  These claims were referred to as Republica Territory, not joint territory in anyway.  You're not objecting there, its a hypocritical position. 

 

Tianxia's point here and why we vetoed this resolution is that these policies are being unfairly singled out.  Other massive expansions of protectorate claims and even land expansions have been made in the past to 0 complain, most recently the addition of South Africa as Athenian.  yes on the tip top other end of Africa they have territory, but that has little in common with South Africa.  The Eastern European moves were down with great discomfort of Russia, and to say consultation is frankly putting it kindly as it was known that Russia had large objections to it but all parties involved there, especially Athens.

 

However, these disputes were handled with delicacy and care that Athens is not currently affording others, and is in fact throwing around bombastic and rude language to those its commited to being cordial with, which is totally out of line with the current situation and the current history of the South American Continent which is to say that there has undeniably been rhetoric and actions that are provocative by Republica and Paraguay in the past.

 

These rhetorical flare ups are followed by apologies, however, they seem to show those two nations true feelings.  As such we find this entire faux moral outrage ridiculous and based on self serving hypocrisy of individual nations rather than a consistent message and political action applied across policy realm.

 

The exception to this may be Prussia who has not made many statements or actions in the international arena, and as such we acknowledge we simply have a difference of view on.

 

"Excuse me for my frankness, but are you blind?! I stated: Paraguay has never, at this very time" And to say that Athens is not being fair is absolutely absurd. At least they care about the people in South America, and not not using military power to get what they want in South America."

 

- UN Ambassador Silandra Lopez

[lkfht]

"To ensure no further hostilities erupt, stability to return, and the will of the people to be shown, Prussia suggests a ten-year neutral United Nations peacekeeping mission that culminates in a referendum so that the native inhabitants can decide on their future. Let not territorial ambitions distract from a peaceful alternative to bloodshed - and for the will of the people to win over the force of arms."

Paraguay again supports this resolution and urges UNSC members to bring a formal resolution to the table and to vote on it immediately.

[Scofield]

"Great Britain supports the initiative proposed by Prussia. It is prudent that all sides work together in reaching a fair and peaceful solution to the situation, and in a way that takes into consideration the will of the South American peoples and ensures lasting peace in the South American continent."

[Centurius]

"The Exarchate of Africa is in fact not Athenian territory. It is the governing institution of the entire protectorate and the primary authority responsible for maintaining peace and order in the area. In this it acts independently from the Athenian Federation. As for Eastern Europe, not a single inch of territory was granted independence in the area without the Russian government signing off on it first. The same policy has been in effect over all of Europe for that matter. As for the cordiality, we are not alone in breaking the obligations under treaty in that field

 

Now it is time to go beyond the disputes and bring it in a binary form."

 

UN SC Resolution #3: On the Administration of South America

 

Preamble: The United Nations Security Council, acting under its obligations by the Charter, seeking to preserve international peace and seeking to establish the best possible situation for the people of South America.

 

Article I:

To guarantee the welfare and freedoms of the South American people and to preserve their right to develop a system of good government independently from outside forces a peacekeeping force is established to preserve law, order and the territorial integrity.

 

Article II: 

The peacekeeping force shall be composed of all willing members of the United Nations.

 

Article III:

Members of the peacekeeping force shall not be allowed to directly involve themselves in the politics of the region unless such intervention is required to preserve the fundamental rights and freedoms of the people.

 

Article IV:

The United Nations will guide the citizens of the area to decide on their own future in the form of a referendum in ten years or before for certain areas if so ordered by the Security Council

 

 

[Evangeline Anovilis]

"We vote against this measure."

-Katsura Kaede, permanent representative of the Dai-Tōhoku Renpō

[Triyun]

We vote against and therefore veto the measure.