Instr Posted June 25, 2013 Report Share Posted June 25, 2013 (edited) Right now, I already have 3 generals at max / near-max econ bonuses, and it's only been 8 days into the round. It feels as though it is too easy to raid / game to get maxed-generals. IMO, both defensive and offensive attacks should grant XP, and the XP required to operate should be raised; 2x in the case of army and air force, and 1.5x in the case of intelligence. Navy feels fine as is. The point of this change is that raids grant far too much XP to the attacker; whereas in a real war, both sides are exchanging attacks, so a hard-fought battle between both sides should generate more XP than simply a raid or a curbstomp where the defender turtles. It is also possible to make it so that defenses generate twice the XP of attacks, but that may overly encourage turtling or encourage players to take it easy on the defender to prevent them from gaining too many levels. Edited June 25, 2013 by Instr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admin Posted June 25, 2013 Report Share Posted June 25, 2013 I will probably raise the XP requirements a bit for the next round, but not for this one. Given that this is tournament edition and the round only lasts 3 months I wanted to make generals pretty easily accessible so that the feature would get some use. I want this feature to award activity so defenders will not be gaining XP. The XP requirements in CN Standard will not be the same, nor will the benefits be the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazaraus45 Posted June 25, 2013 Report Share Posted June 25, 2013 it was worse before, the xp amounts required were doubled shortly before the first update, originally you could have gotten the max econ army general after first update because he only needed 6xp. Admin remains one step ahead of my planning :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Instr Posted June 26, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 26, 2013 (edited) I do have a problem with the raiding, though, because it encourages nation inequality (the supply of raidable nations is limited, and once that's been depleted, the only way to gain XP is to do a conventional war, which means that weak nations end up being forced to fight weak nations, leaving the weakest completely unviable and the rest of the round unplayable for them) and encourages run-away effects, where stacking bonuses or multipliers enable a certain group of players to get so far away from the pack that there's nothing that can be done to them. One other implementation I suggested in the other thread was to make Generals cost XP to recruit, instead of requiring but not using XP, and making it so that Generals can be assassinated (originally suggested by lYlyth). In that case, having Generals can translate into an advantage, but it's not an insurmountable advantage since it can be removed through the use of a rather expensive spy attack, and it forces players to economize on their use of XP points; do they get the most expensive general, who can be easily assassinated, or do they get a cheaper general, who can be replaced more easily? Edited June 26, 2013 by Instr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Instr Posted June 26, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 26, 2013 Also, just a note; but all 4 max econ generals translates to what my approximation says is ~25% additional income. Not sure if that's in the design doc, if it's too high (maybe create those stats in increments of .5 and have a max of 1.5 for effectively a 20% boost? Cap it at 1 for a 12.5% boost?), or if it's just right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clash Posted July 6, 2013 Report Share Posted July 6, 2013 My biggest complaint is the mass raiding that went on especially early in the round. We have 900+ nations right now when I last looked but around day 30-35 or so I'd bet we lose 200+ of them. That cannot be good for TE, imho. I have not raided in 10+ rounds, but I felt I had to this round, and I had dead nations in my war slots pretty quickly. I think a lot of people did. It used to be raids were tech raids, two grounds then peace. That doesn't do too much damage on a nation, really. However now raids are not tech raids, they are XP raids, which mean FULL ATTACKS. Grounds, air, spies and even navy, if you have it. When a nation who doesn't have enough friends to help protect itself (ie, the unaligned and smaller alliances) get those kinds of wars, and 2 or 3 of them, they are in a lot of trouble. They figure what's the point to this stupid game, they quit and they don't come back. If this continues we'll end up with a lot fewer alliances and almost no smaller ones, fewer wars, and fewer members. I'm not sure what to do about the problem, but I do think something needs to be done for next round. Save the n00bs and the little guys! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox Fire Posted July 6, 2013 Report Share Posted July 6, 2013 I do have a problem with the raiding, though, because it encourages nation inequality (the supply of raidable nations is limited, and once that's been depleted, the only way to gain XP is to do a conventional war, which means that weak nations end up being forced to fight weak nations, leaving the weakest completely unviable and the rest of the round unplayable for them) and encourages run-away effects, where stacking bonuses or multipliers enable a certain group of players to get so far away from the pack that there's nothing that can be done to them. One other implementation I suggested in the other thread was to make Generals cost XP to recruit, instead of requiring but not using XP, and making it so that Generals can be assassinated (originally suggested by lYlyth). In that case, having Generals can translate into an advantage, but it's not an insurmountable advantage since it can be removed through the use of a rather expensive spy attack, and it forces players to economize on their use of XP points; do they get the most expensive general, who can be easily assassinated, or do they get a cheaper general, who can be replaced more easily? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox Fire Posted July 6, 2013 Report Share Posted July 6, 2013 Sorry for double post, but yeah. I had to reroll and now I cant even find a raid target. It also makes me feel bad for the newer people who came here to test the new generals feature and found themselves raided to no end. I mean, the last few pages of AAs seem to be inactive "testers" who got wiped out as soon as they were made. Massive inequality here and Im willing to bet that the next people to go will be small AAs like my own. We havent even had a chance to get generals yet. I myself have but 1. I mean, I liked the idea at first, now Im having second thoughts.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kongland Posted September 5, 2013 Report Share Posted September 5, 2013 My biggest complaint is the mass raiding that went on especially early in the round. We have 900+ nations right now when I last looked but around day 30-35 or so I'd bet we lose 200+ of them. That cannot be good for TE, imho. I have not raided in 10+ rounds, but I felt I had to this round, and I had dead nations in my war slots pretty quickly. I think a lot of people did. It used to be raids were tech raids, two grounds then peace. That doesn't do too much damage on a nation, really. However now raids are not tech raids, they are XP raids, which mean FULL ATTACKS. Grounds, air, spies and even navy, if you have it. When a nation who doesn't have enough friends to help protect itself (ie, the unaligned and smaller alliances) get those kinds of wars, and 2 or 3 of them, they are in a lot of trouble. They figure what's the point to this stupid game, they quit and they don't come back. If this continues we'll end up with a lot fewer alliances and almost no smaller ones, fewer wars, and fewer members. I'm not sure what to do about the problem, but I do think something needs to be done for next round. Save the n00bs and the little guys! Wanted to post, that the Generals are making more experienced players to mass-raid the new comers and therefore put the numbers down, but saw that post. I agree. Most new comers are just leaving after a sudden barrage of attacks before they have time to look around. Kill the generals, before they kill the game! 580 players atm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hartfw Posted September 5, 2013 Report Share Posted September 5, 2013 Wanted to post, that the Generals are making more experienced players to mass-raid the new comers and therefore put the numbers down, but saw that post. I agree. Most new comers are just leaving after a sudden barrage of attacks before they have time to look around. Kill the generals, before they kill the game! 580 players atm Generals made this worse. But even without it the unaffiliated get slaughtered in the first week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul711 Posted September 15, 2013 Report Share Posted September 15, 2013 Death to the unaffiliated. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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