[MegaVolt]

Recently the NS gain per tech level has been changed from 20 to 5 and in addition tech can now be destroyed. This changes a lot for tech-heavy nations and is a radical game play change. People who invested time and money in purchasing technology now find that their original investment based on the previous game mechanics is now rendered useless. Let’s fact it organizing tech deals take a lot more time and effort than pressing a button to buy infra. Tech inflation was a problem, but making tech all but useless isn't the solution.

For the sake of balance and for the sake of additional fairness I suggest another change:

Raise the 300 military effectively cap (or better: remove it).

Right now, 1 infra gives 3 NS and does not only increase your income and improvement slots but also your military capabilities.
Over 300, one level of tech gives 5 NS and does nearly nothing. Once the 10% infra upkeep reduction has been reached it does exactly nothing for you nation.
The 5 NS per tech are very justified, should the 300 military cap be removed.

There are several advantages:

1. With the recent change, tech over has basically become useless. This way it would have use again.
2. With the recent change, small tech heavy alliances have lost greatly. Big nations could use tech to make sure smaller nations would be out of their range (so that no 3999 infra nation could destroy the expensive infra of a 7999 infra nation with nuclear weapons). With the recent change, those big nations have a great disadvantage and can now be attacked by much smaller nations. Give them a better chance to defend themselves!
3. With the recent tech change, "VietFAN" tactics have become impossible. While staying in nuclear range to re-buy nukes is still possible with 5 NS per tech level it becomes almost impossible with destroyable tech. A removed cap would compensate for the loss of this war strategy.
4. With the recent change, small tech selling nations are screwed. Nobody will want to buy tech now, meaning that small nations lose their best and fastest way to grow. With the cap removed small nations would once again be able to sell tech (probably even for a higher price) which has always been a great addition to the game (rewarding those that put effort into it).
5. Reward those that put effort into their nation! Not only is it good for small tech sellers to be rewarded with faster growth, big nations also have to spend time optimizing their aid slot usage to be effective tech buyers. This work should be rewarded with a more efficient nation - which it is not right now because the effect of tech after 300 is (and was before the recent change) way too low.

This post has been edited by MegaVolt: 02 November 2007 - 05:23 AM

[RossGarner]

Voted yes, though this problem probably needs to be addressed by adding something different for tech to do than simply affecting troop kills, something different, maybe the tech improvements noted before, or a different idea entirely.

[adhambek]

Voted Yes. The NS changes where needed. But it does need to have some balance, people who have spent time and effort and are organized enough to buy tech should not be penalized. At the moment no one has any real motivation to buy tech. And large nations are now within range of many small nations who can do 100’s of millions in damage to them, while even if they ZI them they will lose maybe 30-40million at most.

Tech increasing military efficient will at least make the numbers have meaning and give some advantage to someone who has a bigger nation, and who has spent time and effort getting where he has. Having more of something should have its advantages.

[lastr0ce]

I'd rather suggest The admin gets rid of the "random results" that happen now and then, heck, the happen all the time.

Then, he could remove the cap.

Implement the "War veteral level" which would give the nations with actually war practice a FAIR ADVANTAGE, which is as normal as Jesus himself.
Then, he could remove the cap.

no?

[Steelrat]

diskord, on Nov 2 2007, 03:19 AM, said:

You do realize the formula is:

Normal Number of Kills * (Technology Purchased * 10%)

that means that it caps out at normal kill rate * 30.

Without this cap I would have a kill rate of 270.

Thats 9 times what I currently have. Since I can anarchy someone with full military in 3-4 attacks, this turns EVERY battle in the upper ranges to insta-anarchy.... whats the point of that?

We need a new formula BEFORE we remove the cap, I am all for removing the cap, but re-write the formula FIRST.

Something like Kills * ((Attackers Technology-Defenders Technology) * 10%). Something like that... a simple change but it doesn't completely break combat at the high NS levels.

^^ from Gameplay discussion, another option would be to compare any Technology difference betweeen 2 opponents into Soldiers/Tank effectivness.
So with more Technology your Soldiers (Barracks/Guerilla camps) are more efffective. This would be easy to implement too, like every 100 tech you get 1% more effective Soldiers thus 1k tech is equal an extra Barrack.

The advantage of tech taken into effectiveness of Soldiers, it´s easier to implement and it won´t complicated the battle system as effectivenss is already implemented. Everyone can see the advantage of tech in Numbers of his Soldiers. This can be expand to Soldiers/Tanks and even Air planes so tech won´t only affect the Soldier vs Soldier battle it will effect your whole Army

Suggestion for Soldiers effectiveness:
0.1tech = 0.001% more effective Soldier
1tech = 0.01%
10tech = 0.1%
100tech = 1%
1000tech = 10% (equals another barrack)

same or adjusted numbers for Tanks and AirPlanes

This post has been edited by Steelrat: 02 November 2007 - 06:28 AM

[lastr0ce]

pff..

I'm starting to think the admin will have to completely change this war system.

[BigLou]

Voted yes.

[Enrique Barrentos]

Voted yes.

[Kroknia]

Yes. I think the idea behind it was a good one but now tech is almost pointless and top tier nations/alliances are not 1/2 as effective as they used to be while low level nations have a huge advantage when it comes to doing hundreds of millions in damage while hardly losing anything in comparison.

[uaciaut]

Voted yes.
How does casualties having an exact influence over the outcome of a battle sound?

[admin]

This is a good suggestion. Look for it to be implemented soon.

[Seerow]

Bah@People posting the same topic I posted but posting after me and admin noticing theirs first

Also: http://forums.cybern...?showtopic=6433

[jstep]

Seerow, on Nov 2 2007, 01:09 PM, said:

Bah@People posting the same topic I posted but posting after me and admin noticing theirs first

Also: http://forums.cybern...?showtopic=6433

relax if its gonna be added, goal acoomplished :jihad:

[idriveavw]

voted yes, under the condition that the formula for how tech affects the battle is tweaked. see Steelrat's post above

[Bob Janova]

I think tech should affect the quality of your planes, CMs and possibly even nukes too. A technologically advanced nation recovers from a missile strike considerably faster than a less advanced one.

[MegaVolt]

Seerow, on Nov 2 2007, 02:09 PM, said:

Bah@People posting the same topic I posted but posting after me and admin noticing theirs first

Also: http://forums.cybern...?showtopic=6433

Sorry, didn't see yours. Yours does not have a poll so this one is better

Bob Janova, on Nov 2 2007, 02:27 PM, said:

I think tech should affect the quality of your planes, CMs and possibly even nukes too. A technologically advanced nation recovers from a missile strike considerably faster than a less advanced one.

I agree here. Tech should influence performance for all military strikes, it's simply realistic.

In addition I want to add something to my initial suggestion: The "kill rate" way the formula works would have to be slightly changed. The kill rate increase should not only depend on the attackers tech (because then every attack would be instant-anarchy) but on the difference of attackers and defenders tech.
Example:

Attacker has 2000 tech, defender has 3000 tech.
2000 / 3000 = 0.67
All of the attackers attacks make only 67% damage.

Attacker has 3000 tech, defender has 2000 tech
3000 / 2000 = 1.33
All of the attackers attacks make 133% damage.

What do you think of that?

[idriveavw]

the defender's tech definitely needs to be taken into account

i like the (Attacking tech)/(Defending tech) formula. seems pretty fair

This post has been edited by idriveavw: 02 November 2007 - 07:41 AM

[Bob Janova]

That would be mad if you were attacking a 0 tech nation :lol:. But I think it's fair, after all you would roll your high tech tanks straight into the streets of Lagos crushing all resistance.

[Seerow]

idriveavw, on Nov 2 2007, 09:40 AM, said:

the defender's tech definitely needs to be taken into account

i like the (Attacking tech)/(Defending tech) formula. seems pretty fair

The defender gets their own efficiency applied to their defending soldiers, no need for the ratio.

[Ruddyyy]

MegaVolt, on Nov 2 2007, 01:38 PM, said:

Attacker has 2000 tech, defender has 3000 tech.
2000 / 3000 = 0.67
All of the attackers attacks make only 67% damage.

Attacker has 3000 tech, defender has 2000 tech
3000 / 2000 = 1.33
All of the attackers attacks make 133% damage.

What do you think of that?

I think that may be a little extreme, technology would be too useful in this case. Right now, tech is far too expensive to buy from your own country, so it does make sense, but tech is also very easy to get from new nations. I like the way tech is used in ground battles now, I just think it should have an effect past 300, because I already have 200 tech from raids, and I can see that it will be worth very little at the current moment. However, if you were to remove the cap, it would kill riculous amounts of soldiers in the higher level. Maybe past 300 tech it should begin to effect another part of the game. Perhaps at 300 tech the amount of soldiers that are killed should begin to be reduced aswell. Kinda like, once you get past 300 tech levels, your military begins to start researching body armour and such, and the amount of soldiers you kill per tech level is only increased by 50% for every level after 300 tech. This should keep it in check on ground attacks, the amount of soldiers killed in ground attacks in check, while also giving tech an advantage over less tech heavy nations.