[Renolds]

http://news.bbc.co.u...cas/8076253.stm

shot and killed inside a church, do these people actually think god will praise them for that? no better than the Taliban in my opinion.

[Eagare the Alenthin]

What he did was disgusting, but he did not deserve death. And it's not like the Taliban since it's not like Christians have a coordinated movement to kill dissenters.

[Lamuella]

I get a feeling that the "christian taliban" was a response to the ACLU being called the "American Taliban" by one of our court jesters.

[Eagare the Alenthin]

Yeah, I thought that as well. We seem to get a wave of them every once in awhile.

[DogeWilliam]

Religious nuts strike again. Gunning someone down in a church over abortion. An almost epic level of craziness.

[Aeternos Astramora]

Irony much? Killing someone in a church for sinning.

[Hydro]

^ you'd think that might've occured to him beforehand, but apparently not...

[Count da Silva]

Blood for blood.

[mastab]

Count da Silva, on May 31 2009, 01:03 PM, said:

Blood for blood.

!@#$%^&*.

• What earns humans the right to life is their sapience, not their existence. Because of this the mentally retarded and the people in vegetative states are given fewer rights than a fully functional human and most people agree that hypothetical intelligent aliens should be given the same rights as humans or sapient monkeys given more rights than normal monkeys. Zygotes are not sapient.
  
• Banning abortion has the same flaw as prohibition. Whether it's legal or not, people will get what they want. The difference is that when you make safe abortions illegal people will get dangerous illegal ones or attempt to do it themselves. The zygote dies either way, but one way the mother risks infection or other dangers of illegal operations.
  
• You have no right to force others to follow what you believe can and can't be killed. It's their body, not yours. Feel free to abstain from abortions if you want (although you're a man - funny how so many men oppose giving this right to women), but you have no right to tell any pregnant woman what to do with her body.
  
• Unconscious Violinist. "You wake up in the morning and find yourself back to back in bed with an unconscious violinist. A famous unconscious violinist. He has been found to have a fatal kidney ailment, and the Society of Music Lovers has canvassed all the available medical records and found that you alone have the right blood type to help. They have therefore kidnapped you, and last night the violinist's circulatory system was plugged into yours, so that your kidneys can be used to extract poisons from his blood as well as your own. [If he is unplugged from you now, he will die; but] in nine months he will have recovered from his ailment, and can safely be unplugged from you." Obviously, you have no obligation to keep this violinist alive. So even if a zygote were a sapient being, it would have no right to inconvenience you or damage your body.

[Emperor Mudd]

You will notice that all the mainstream anti-abortion movements strongly oppose violence to acheive their goals.

Christian Taliban? Hardly.

One crazy whackjob who doesn't represent even a tiny fraction of the movement? Absolutely.

[Randleman]

That is just disgusting on so many levels.

[Aparte]

Another religiously motivated terrorist attack.

I have to agree that the murder is contrary to Christian teachings on several levels, though. If the perpetrator had read his Bible, he'd realise that his god has no problems with abortion.

[Paxis]

mastab, on May 31 2009, 08:15 PM, said:

!@#$%^&*.

• What earns humans the right to life is their sapience, not their existence. Because of this the mentally retarded and the people in vegetative states are given fewer rights than a fully functional human and most people agree that hypothetical intelligent aliens should be given the same rights as humans or sapient monkeys given more rights than normal monkeys. Zygotes are not sapient.
  
• Banning abortion has the same flaw as prohibition. Whether it's legal or not, people will get what they want. The difference is that when you make safe abortions illegal people will get dangerous illegal ones or attempt to do it themselves. The zygote dies either way, but one way the mother risks infection or other dangers of illegal operations.
  
• You have no right to force others to follow what you believe can and can't be killed. It's their body, not yours. Feel free to abstain from abortions if you want (although you're a man - funny how so many men oppose giving this right to women), but you have no right to tell any pregnant woman what to do with her body.
  
• Unconscious Violinist. "You wake up in the morning and find yourself back to back in bed with an unconscious violinist. A famous unconscious violinist. He has been found to have a fatal kidney ailment, and the Society of Music Lovers has canvassed all the available medical records and found that you alone have the right blood type to help. They have therefore kidnapped you, and last night the violinist's circulatory system was plugged into yours, so that your kidneys can be used to extract poisons from his blood as well as your own. [If he is unplugged from you now, he will die; but] in nine months he will have recovered from his ailment, and can safely be unplugged from you." Obviously, you have no obligation to keep this violinist alive. So even if a zygote were a sapient being, it would have no right to inconvenience you or damage your body.

This basicly.

Just wrong on soo many levels like Randleman said.

[bojje]

This is very sad for that mans family.
I also don't think this is the time or the thread for an abortion debate, it is just tasteless (this was not aimed at Mastab, props too you )

[Quiziotle]

Evidently Jesus died so civil rights could be repressed and those who support them be killed.

This is disgusting.

[Sunake]

mastab, on May 31 2009, 08:15 PM, said:

[*] Unconscious Violinist. "You wake up in the morning and find yourself back to back in bed with an unconscious violinist. A famous unconscious violinist. He has been found to have a fatal kidney ailment, and the Society of Music Lovers has canvassed all the available medical records and found that you alone have the right blood type to help. They have therefore kidnapped you, and last night the violinist's circulatory system was plugged into yours, so that your kidneys can be used to extract poisons from his blood as well as your own. [If he is unplugged from you now, he will die; but] in nine months he will have recovered from his ailment, and can safely be unplugged from you." Obviously, you have no obligation to keep this violinist alive. So even if a zygote were a sapient being, it would have no right to inconvenience you or damage your body.
[/list]

Only thing I take concern with. A baby results from a conscious, more-often-than-not consentual decision to perform the act which results in a baby without proper measures in place to prevent the necessary functions of either cells involved (I'm toning it down for the kids on the board). Being kidnapped and hooked up to a violinist is not your decision and not with your consent (and why can't they just ask for your kidney?). I don't think anyone would blame you for disconnecting yourself from the violinist and escaping, as what has been done to you is criminal. The only comparison in the act of conception is raep (intentionally misspelled). Only then would I consider abortions appropriate. get drunk and hook up with a stranger? Your fault. Condom break? Should have either used fresher condoms or been on the pill also. Pill not work? Should have used a condom also. Got pregnant from a pool? Well that I'd also consider appropriate cause for an abortion.

Other than that, this is a terrible crime and I hope the perpetrator is caught and put to justice. I would also like to see his or her pastor/priest, bishop, and archbishop personally slap him or her in the face. Be nice if God smacked him or her but he doesn't come around too much anymore.

Edit: And I'd also argue that the zygote is a part of the woman's body as it is made from at least half her own genes but this isn't quite the topic for an abortion debate.

This post has been edited by Sunake: 31 May 2009 - 02:56 PM

[Prince Imrahil]

Assuming this was religiously motivated, it's another example of someone doing something in the name of Christ of which Christ himself would be incapable (to paraphrase "Kingdom of Heaven"). Instead of just asking "what would Jesus do," maybe people should actually do it.

[LeVentNoir]

Just another reason religion is harmful. I remember it saying somewhere, 'Thou shalt not kill'

Hypocritical much?

[Simon De Montfort]

LeVentNoir, on May 31 2009, 04:04 PM, said:

Just another reason religion is harmful. I remember it saying somewhere, 'Thou shalt not kill'

Hypocritical much?

Another bigot.

[Sunake]

LeVentNoir, on May 31 2009, 09:04 PM, said:

Just another reason religion is harmful. I remember it saying somewhere, 'Thou shalt not kill'

Hypocritical much?

No, they don't seem to have a low amount of being critical, as this man seems to have been murdered for his profession.