[cocomaan]

I just had an idea when looking through the wonder list. Since the CIA is a "hidden wonder", that is, no outside nation can see that you have one, why don't we do the same for the Hidden Silo wonder?

The only real problem I can foresee is that the nuke count would have to be "hidden" as well. I'm sure there's a workaround for that, though. Another tertiary problem that might arise would be that your first 5 nukes are hidden, so it'd look like you had no nukes at all. Then again, this might make for a cool game function.

I think the "hidden wonder" idea is a good one, and can definitely be applied here.

[EvenStar]

Approved for discussion

[Brinoceros]

Well that makes sense, if you can see it then it's not a hidden silo, it's just a silo...but of course you are gonna have to make the nukes obtained through the silos also hidden, right? If someone saw that you had 5 more nukes then they would know you have a hidden silo...

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Another tertiary problem that might arise would be that your first 5 nukes are hidden, so it'd look like you had no nukes at all.

Well in real life nations hide nukes from other nations *cough* *cough* Iran *cough* *cough* and act like they don't have anything so why not do that in the game? It would add a pretty cool twist.

[thedestro]

Semantics is not a basis for making the wonder hidden at all.

The reason the CIA was hidden was to preserve the secret spy count- which is a fair premise to make it hidden. I don't see one for this wonder.

This post has been edited by thedestro: 16 December 2008 - 02:07 PM

[The King of Town]

I really like this idea. Make the 5 unspyable nukes hidden so that only the ruler of the nation can see them. Take the persons nuke count and subtract 5 to the rest of the public (so if they have 25 nukes, everyone will only see 20). I think this is an awesome idea.

[fant0m]

Pretty decent idea, you'd have to make the nukes give no NS though as well obviously. Would be a nice little addition though and it makes sense as well.

[nc1701]

I like it a lot, makes sense and would be quite interesting and realistic. Nuclear warfare needs to be made more interesting.

[Lancer]

How would this affect the Alliance Nuke Count? Would the 5 hidden nukes be subtracted from the Alliance total?

[TheyCallMeJeezy]

Seems to me that you should only be able to tell how many nukes a nation has if you are at war with them. Until war is initiated you should only be able to see whether or not the nation is nuclear armed.

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This nation has a nuclear arsenal.

then if you declare you can see how many.

regardless though, the wonder should be hidden

This post has been edited by TheyCallMeJeezy: 16 December 2008 - 03:16 PM

[threefingeredguy]

I personally would prefer if the HNMS was hidden, the 5 nukes that it allowed were hidden (including not being shown in alliance nuke amounts) and didn't contribute to NS, and that you could choose to purchase a hidden nuclear weapon or a regular nuclear weapon. The reason it would be good to allow players to choose whether or not they're buying a hidden nuke is that any solution that automatically decides what nukes are hidden (first 5 nukes/last 5 nukes/etc) would still allow other nations to accurately estimate how many hidden nukes a nation can have based on how many non-hidden nukes they have. In order to balance out the benefit of having hidden nukes, they could cost more or require more upkeep.

That's just my opinion though. It's not a suggestion. I'm not saying "put this in or the game sucks". If you disagree with the idea I don't really care.

[Shayde]

I can see your point, but if they have the Manhattan Project already, you can assume they have nukes. It tells you that the person is nuke active anyway.

If you hide it with silos, then your count should not show the first five AND you should not be marked as nuclear active until you pass the threshold.

But if you don't go that far, then there's no reason to hide you have hidden silos.

Lancer, on Dec 16 2008, 08:52 PM, said:

How would this affect the Alliance Nuke Count? Would the 5 hidden nukes be subtracted from the Alliance total?

It shouldn't. You just have to guess who has those nukes

This post has been edited by Shayde: 16 December 2008 - 03:20 PM

[Lord Emares]

Also NS would be able to tell anyone pretty sharpish how many nukes a nation had (including hidden ones).

Instead of calling it a "Hidden Nuclear Missile Silo" why not call it a "Mobile Nuclear Missile Silo" but change nothing else if you are that worried about the name of the wonder having the word "Hidden" in it.

[mrcalkin]

The issue I see with this change is that it puts those who have already purchased the wonder at a disadvantage since undoubtedly people have logs of the nuke counts of all the nations out there. It might not be a big deal, but it will still kind of suck for those who have had the wonder for awhile unless there is some other change to negate that one.

[Iamrecognized]

Actually, it would be cool to make it so that if you have the HNMS, you could have nukes that people didn't know about. Alliances that have a nuke limit could secretly subvert their terms, which as a game mechanic, is a good idea.

[Drai]

I don't think it's really necessary.

I mean, I'm not against the idea, but there are other suggestions I would prefer to see implemented before this.

[Vladimir Stukov II]

If we did this we might as well hide all stats. It is called a Hidden Nuclear Missile Silo because you know the nation has nukes, but you don't know where they are so you can't destroy them.

[thor gold]

o/ This idea

This makes for much more interesting alliance warfare. Here's my opinion on the suggestion:

1. Wonder is hidden to all users except nation ruler
2. Wonder allows extra 5 nukes that DO NOT show up in nation nuke count (so 25 nukes would show up as 20)
3. Hidden nukes are spy immune
4. Hidden nukes show up in alliance statistics
5. Hidden nukes count for NS (if you're investigating a nation's nuke count by figuring out its NS equation, you DESERVE to know)
6. 5 nukes are hidden when the wonder is built, there is no specification between "buy regular/buy hidden" nuke.
7. Upkeep for hidden nukes is doubled

[Bad JuJu]

Absolutely awesome idea. I support it 100%

[schmutte693]

I am relatively certain that the Wonder already hides the +5 nukes. Either that or the member of my alliance who has one does not own any extra nukes.... which would be silly.


Anyway, this definitely has my support.

[Matthew PK]

No.

The current system of spy-proofing them is enough.

Nukes rightly increase NS. Hiding them without eliminating the NS boost would be trivially easy to circumvent.

One possible way to reconcile this suggestion would be to give anybody with *any* nukes a fixed amount of NS, considering almost nobody keeps 1 or 2 nukes around.
In that case, the nuke count would be changed to "has nukes"

This would, however, further limit the power of spies and they are difficult enough to use as it is....