[ccjmk]

What i propose is kind of a radical change in the game's mechanic.

It will consist in a budget system, where money would be automatically spent (this costs added to the Bill Payment) on various areas that the player could choose from, like Education, Health Care, Production, Social Security, Infrastructure Unkeep, Research and Surplus. Each area would get a % of the total budget. (the 100% of the Budget would be the total Collection amount)

Each would work separately, and as explained below (all aspects, of course, are subject of heavy tweaking if required ^^)

Educacion: it would go from 5 to 30% of the total budget; it will have an "average point" at 15%, where (having all schools and universities) Literacy Rate would be of 100% (Altering Literacy Rate, causing it to affect the total income of citizens). The 30% max would give 80% Literacy Rate with no schools nor universities, and some further increase in Gross Income having all schools and Universities. The 5% min would give only 25% literacy rate with all schools and universities. (obviously, with this introduction, Tech would no longer affect Literacy Rate, just add happiness and affect war odds)

Health Care: it would go from 5 to 30% of the total budget; average point at 15% where, with full clinics and Hospital, it would "sustain" the population. Below that point, it would lower the total population of the country up to a 10 or 15% decreace. Above that point, it would increace the total pop by 5 or 10%. 30% budget will just sustain the population having no clinics nor hospital.

Production: it would go from 5 to 20% of total budget. No average point here. Production would be something like the "economic encoragement" of the government, in promotions and industrial and agricultural plans. It would replace the buying of Infrastructure, but still the buying of infrastructure should be available to be done manually, to allow the use of any surplus (or Aid) for that purpose. Having 5% would mean a +5 or +2% Infrastructure increase, whichever is higher (10 infra for new, small nations, and 2% for biiiig nations; a 4000 infra nation would get 80 infrastructure a day this way) while having 20% would mean a +20/+5% Infrastructure increase, again, whichever is higher (Following the example, a 4000 infra nation would get 200 infra a day -this values are ESTIMATED by me.. my nation does not have 4000 infra, and i can not foretell how much a 4000 infra nation can actually buy nowadays, but it should follow the same numbers ) So, appointing money on the Production Budget would mean the enlargement of the nations

Social Security: it would go from 5 to 15%, average point at 10%. At average point, it will "ensure the safety of the population". Below it, each % less would mean a -0.5 decreace in Happiness, and every % more would mean a +0.5 increace in Happiness; so it would give either -2.5 or +2.5 extremes.

Infrastructure Unkeep / Government Expendure: This will consume the mayor part of the budget. It will be the actual Daily Infrastructure Cost + Improvement unkeeps + Wonder unkeeps + Military mantainance costs. it would go form 30 to 50%, average at 40%. With average budget, it will sustain the infrastructure. Below that point, it will cause a slight daily decreace in the actual infrastructure of the nation, up to 5 Infrastructure a day or 2%, whichever is higher. Above that point it would produce a really slight increace in Gross Income, of up to $3 maybe. Actual improvements, wonders and resources that contribute to reduce the infra unkeep, would affect this average; so for example, Iron would reduce this budget in 10%, leaving the average in 36% of total budget.

Research: It would mean the expendure the nation does in technological development. The effect is somehow obvious, right? would go from 0 to 20%, no average. With 20% budget tech would increase by fixed values acording to a series of tiers i have not already thought of, just had the idea In this way, it could be structured that nations with low tech could get more tech at a time, but nations with great amounts of tech would still get enough tech to promote the expendure on the Research Budget, and still depende mostly on the tech deals.

Surplus: Finally, the rest of the unused budget would form the Surplus, this is, the money that the nation would save for any unforeseen expendures. This would include the money saved for Wonders and Improvement, the bought of military forces, and any extra infra/tech expendures. THIS MONEY WOULD NO BE INCLUDED IN THE FOLLOWING BUDGET CALCULATIONS, so it would be "saved" somehow.

Military, Improvement and Wonder unkeeps would be calculated first, and the REST of the money available would go through the Budget System. So for example, Nation A collects 10 million a day and has military/improvement/wonder expendures for 2 million. He collects taxes, and gets only 8 millon (collection minus expendures) + past surplus. This 10 million would be splited into the different budget percentages when paying bills, and would give the effects corresponding to the percentajes used for the rest of the day. After the daily update occurs, the effects of the budget would go on until the next bill payment (so for example, if u had full budget on social security, the +2.5 happiness would go on until you pay bills again. If you pay again full budget, the effect would go on. If you instead change the budget to minimun during the day, the minimun budget effect would take effect instantly. This is to disencorage the use of the budget strategically with the time of the daily update.) In the case of infrastructure increases/decreaces and tech fluctuations, the increase/decrease would happen right after the moment of paying bills.


Well.. in general terms, that would be my idea open for sugestions of all kinds ^^

[EvenStar]

Approved for discussion

[SpiderJerusalem]

ccjmk, on Dec 13 2008, 07:59 PM, said:

a 4000 infra nation would get 80 infrastructure a day this way)

That is a lot... More than a lot...

This way, a 15k infra nation would get 300 infra a day. Do you have any idea how much 300 infra is worth at that level?

[(DAC)Syzygy]

If the system has "instant effects" on anything, people would simply exploit it like all other systems (DEFCON/Threat Level/Improvements).

So, if you go for it, create a system of 'longterm effects' which would reach full strength after 30 days of being in action. Every nation has 100 points to spent (one percent each) and 5 choices to make what to fund.

Also, the effects should be HIDDEN. The game is way to calculatable and predictable.

[SilverHawk]

More choices and hidden effects are what I suggest like DAC put forth.

[HHAYD]

I like the idea, but it needs improvements.

1. Make the budget change limit to every 30 days.

OR

Make the new changes take full effect in 30 days (gradual change from day 1 to day 30).

2. Make the infra and tech gain lower, and make the infra gain slightly lower as the nation gets larger.

[ccjmk]

holy sh**!!
i wrote this drunk! and it sounds terrific xD but need really hard tweaking

about the tech, i saw i wrote something about tier levels for Research's tech increase; the same could be done for Production, isn't it?

(i find it really hilarious to discuss things that were unknown to my on the original topic xD)

About what syzygy said, the system could be set to achieve full "efficiency" on the 20th day of the change. Lowering some budget suddenly one day would affect the average significantly, to avoid people having 3 days a high budget, 1 day a 0 or minimun budget, other 2 days of full budget, 1 day of minimun budget and other 2 days of full budget to obtain the results.

If you change your budget before the 10th server update after the budgeting adjust, two things could happen:

1) if u set a higher budget for something, its effect would occur after the server update on the 20th day after the change.

2) if u set a lower budget for something, its effect would occur inmediatelly (to avoid the situation explained above)

so, if u lower production budget and increace tech budget, the effects on the production of infra would occur inmediately, but you would have to wait for the effects on tech. On the given case that u just lower a budget and leave the rest as surplus, the increase in the funds would occur instantly.


Actually, this idea is WAY to complex to be used on CN, on the best case, a separate game (as CN tournament) could be set using this budgeting system, instead of the actual collect/pay bills/spend money formulae.. but such a radical change is unable to be done

This post has been edited by ccjmk: 03 January 2009 - 10:02 PM

[zzzptm]

Things like infra upkeep and military upkeep should be non-negotiable. They are mandatory spending.

This suggestion introduces the idea of discretionary spending, and I like that. It should be, as DAC says, a long-term effect. It should also produce effects that offer a truly even trade-off, not "Oh, max out this area because the benefits you get from it will allow you to pretty much have the benefits of the other choices."

As for complexity, no, it needn't be that way. Set a slider and stick with it for 30 days. Admin can lock in the positions, like the wonder cycle.

[ccjmk]

yes.. the implementation is hard, but not imposible (many new coding has to be done, remember ALWAYS that); but the WAY CyberNations is played would change radically, something that the admin is not likely to wish.