Let's get something straight

[Zoomzoomzoom]

Having a high aid slot usage does not necessarily mean an alliance is active. It usually means that an alliance typically has one overly dedicated person arranging everything for an alliance. Props to these active government members, however few in number they may be, but it does not mean that their alliance is spectacularly active.

Once these specific government members stop organizing everything the system slips or collapses. There are a couple of examples:

1. Roquentin - this man kept Umbrella consistently over 90% and since his departure Umbrella has slipped 20%-30% in their aid slot usage.

2. Global Order of Darkness - I'm sure quite a few of you will remember the dick waving this alliance was doing in regards to surpassing Umbrella's aid slot usage. Take a look at them now, though, and you'll see someone stopped there has stopped organizing the masses.

I am not suggesting these two alliances are inactive or terribly organized. Clearly they both have the means to achieve high rates of aid slot usage, but it is also clear that they have members who only use their aid slots when told to. I honestly cannot blame either of these two alliances for seeing a drop in their aid slot usage. Such work is thankless and awfully time consuming. It's a miracle simply finding a poor soul willing to do all the work in a tech department.

I just hate this shameless dick waving that alliances have been doing lately because they have one or two people running their tech departments. Can't you all just be like Olympus or MK - two alliances who maintain decent aid slot usage, but don't wave their hands and scream, "look at me!" I think we can all agree we don't need them to do that to realize they are decently organized, experienced, and active.

A truly active alliance has an active alliance forum and active irc chatter. In the end these are the things that are going to make your alliance great, even if it has active members who do jack diddly with their aid slots.


tl:dr stfu MCXA

[supercoolyellow]

I see this thread and I can't help but laugh. Rota's really getting to you isn't she?

As for your argument, its part culture, part activity, and part leadership. Its a more complicated matter than just having one factor. MCXA's slot efficiency has been really high for a while, but when we elected a new MOF who is very hard working it bounced up about %10-%15, before then it was simply based on members going out and finding their own deals. Part of the reason for our success has been little things, like not admitting anyone into the alliance until they know how to deal tech, offering an extra 3 mill on the completion of a noobs first deal, and just having a good balance of dealers and sellers.

Edit: If I say in before Rotavele, will that make me cool, or maybe even supercool? If that doesn't work how about I complain about Rota posting in a thread I mentioned him in as if I can't understand simple cause and effect? Maybe that would do the trick.

Edited May 28, 2012 by supercoolyellow

[Caustic]

[quote name='Zoomzoomzoom' timestamp='1338247482' post='2973732']



tl:dr stfu MCXA
[/quote]

nuff said

[Mogar]

this surely wont be a continuation of the multiple other threads that devolved into this subject.

[Zoomzoomzoom]

[quote name='supercoolyellow' timestamp='1338247957' post='2973735']
I see this thread and I can't help but laugh. Rota's really getting to you isn't [b]she[/b]?

As for your argument, its part culture, part activity, and part leadership. Its a more complicated matter than just having one factor. MCXA's slot efficiency has been really high for a while, but when we elected a new MOF who is very hard working it bounced up about %10-%15, before then it was simply based on members going out and finding their own deals. Part of the reason for our success has been little things, like not admitting anyone into the alliance until they know how to deal tech, offering an extra 3 mill on the completion of a noobs first deal, and just having a good balance of dealers and sellers.

Edit: If I say in before Rotavele, will that make me cool, or maybe even supercool? If that doesn't work how about I complain about Rota posting in a thread I mentioned [b]him [/b]in as if I can't understand simple cause and effect? Maybe that would do the trick.
[/quote]

There's just something about terrible posting filled with half-truths and outright !@#$%^&* that gets to me.

I'd just rather you stop dick waving over everything. It's like a culture within MCXA to over compensate one tiny thing to overshadow the mediocrity you folks have held for the last four years. Then again, I am talking to the self-proclaimed "best recruiter" in CN. Also, congrats on finally realizing that you should only admit people who know what they are doing. Now you've finally joined the rest of us.

Also is Rota a he, she, or it? Can you make up your mind?

[Krihelion]

rotavele makes mcxa worse

Edited May 28, 2012 by Unkajo

[Omniscient1]

[quote name='Zoomzoomzoom' timestamp='1338247482' post='2973732']
2. Global Order of Darkness - I'm sure quite a few of you will remember the dick waving this alliance was doing in regards to surpassing Umbrella's aid slot usage. Take a look at them now, though, and you'll see someone stopped there has stopped organizing the masses.
[/quote]

Stopped reading here because that never happened. It was Roquentin who made the big deal about it. GOD actually downplayed the entire thing saying that once VE stopped sending them aid it'd drop off, and it did.

[Monster]

[quote name='Omniscient1' timestamp='1338249133' post='2973743']
Stopped reading here because that never happened. It was Roquentin who made the big deal about it. GOD actually downplayed the entire thing saying that once VE stopped sending them aid it'd drop off, and it did.
[/quote]


Erm no, they did bring it up multiple times. I did point out they were beating Umbrella, but they didn't say it was just the VE aid since the VE aid took place immediately after the war and was gone by the time they were definitively beating Umbrella for a while. Now you're misrepresenting events since several GOD members were quite proud of it.

In fact, they said they'd keep it up even after the big building drive(not related to VE.)

Each time a decline in GOD's slot usage was pointed out in the ASR thread, they'd say it was due to their cycle resetting. It had nothing to do with VE at that point.

So if you're going to say "that never happened," you should get the events down accurately.

Edited May 29, 2012 by Roquentin

[Jaiar]

Aid slot usage is definitely not a good measure of alliance activity. In a 10 day span an alliance can recruit a bunch of new nations which probably won't have those slots full and cause a massive percentage drop in the aid slot use percentage.

IRC and forum are one way to measure activity and how great an alliance can be. However, I think the best way to measure how good an alliance's members are is if they actually back collect and improvement swap and grow their nation correctly with the right nation settings. A nation can be 3999 infra and never sell or buy tech and just back collect and improvement swap and sit around buying wonders on a monthly basis with like 300 tech and be in much better shape and ready for anything than someone who never takes the time to learn these basics. Too bad there isn't a way to audit the nations in each alliance to see what percent would be considered to be in line with the common sense settings we all recognize.

[Krihelion]

Everyone knows NG is more active then MCXA anyway

[Monster]

[quote name='Jaiar' timestamp='1338249453' post='2973745']
Aid slot usage is definitely not a good measure of alliance activity. In a 10 day span an alliance can recruit a bunch of new nations which probably won't have those slots full and cause a massive percentage drop in the aid slot use percentage.

IRC and forum are one way to measure activity and how great an alliance can be. However, I think the best way to measure how good an alliance's members are is if they actually back collect and improvement swap and grow their nation correctly with the right nation settings. A nation can be 3999 infra and never sell or buy tech and just back collect and improvement swap and sit around buying wonders on a monthly basis with like 300 tech and be in much better shape and ready for anything than someone who never takes the time to learn these basics. Too bad there isn't a way to audit the nations in each alliance to see what percent would be considered to be in line with the common sense settings we all recognize.
[/quote]


It's representative of a basic level of activity(taking orders from a central planner, be it an econ or mil person). In many cases, there are people who won't even do that and a lot of alliances retain dead weight as a result. It can also be people finding the deals on their own, but most people won't do that outside of the heavy actives.

IRC and forums are good judges too, but forums less so because it can just be the same group of people posting over and over again without being a significantly large portion of the alliance.

Edited May 29, 2012 by Roquentin

[WorldConqueror]

[quote name='Omniscient1' timestamp='1338249133' post='2973743']
Stopped reading here because that never happened. It was Roquentin who made the big deal about it. GOD actually downplayed the entire thing saying that once VE stopped sending them aid it'd drop off, and it did.
[/quote]
Balder's post history will prove otherwise.

[Monster]

[quote name='WorldConqueror' timestamp='1338249832' post='2973752']
Balder's post history will prove otherwise.
[/quote]

That's what I meant since he posted several times that GOD's slot usage was only going down due to the cycle restarting. Not sure where Omni got the idea that no one in GOD touted it as an achievement.

197 / 477
(41.30%)

welp

Edited May 29, 2012 by Roquentin

[Beauty]

ITT: Non Slota makes excuses for having 40% Aid Slot Efficiency.


I read all of this and I dont get it, Umbrella and GOD lowered their aid slot efficiency... this is supposed to mean NG isnt lazy and high aid slot usage isnt a good thing?

So to wrap this thread up, NG makes excuses for their laziness and incompentant alliance.


[quote]A truly active alliance has an active alliance forum and active irc chatter.[/quote]

Those dont win wars, but we have those too.

Edited May 29, 2012 by Rotavele

[Omniscient1]

[quote name='Roquentin' timestamp='1338249317' post='2973744']
Erm no, they did bring it up multiple times. I did point out they were beating Umbrella, but they didn't say it was just the VE aid since the VE aid took place immediately after the war and was gone by the time they were definitively beating Umbrella for a while. Now you're misrepresenting events since several GOD members were quite proud of it.[/quote]

Talking with them on irc they always downplayed it. I didn't even know their slot usage was up high until your blog, but I don't follow that !@#$. So maybe I'm wrong. Either way GOD percentage wise is one of the most active alliances in CN. You really can't deny that.

With the exception of MCXA, it's usually outside parties who comment on aid slot usage. Same with Umbrella.

[IYIyTh]

I agree. All of my enemies should stop caring about their aid slot effeciency immediately.

[Monster]

[quote name='Omniscient1' timestamp='1338250276' post='2973759']
Talking with them on irc they always downplayed it. I didn't even know their slot usage was up high until your blog, but I don't follow that !@#$. So maybe I'm wrong. Either way GOD percentage wise is one of the most active alliances in CN. You really can't deny that.

With the exception of MCXA, it's usually outside parties who comment on aid slot usage. Same with Umbrella.
[/quote]

It was mostly covered in the Amazing Sanction Race, where I got the stats from since it illustrated the point zoom makes in the op of an alliance declining in usage when there's no one willing to herd the cats.

[Instr]

itt alliances with a poor logistics department claim that that has no relevance towards their activity

slots rates don't matter, anyways.

It's the raw tech income per active military nation that matters.

MCXA, for all their apparent activity, can only muster between 50 and 60 tech per nation per 10 days due to the fact that they sell 3m/50s internally.

===

Oh, and how did GOD get past Umb anyways? GOD never exceeded Umb's net tech rates, they were between 70-80 per nation while Umb was at least 100 tech per nation per 10 days.

[Jaiar]

[quote name='Rotavele' timestamp='1338250074' post='2973755']
ITT: Non Grata makes excuses for having 40% Aid Slot Efficiency.


I read all of this and I dont get it, Umbrella and GOD lowered their aid slot efficiency... this is supposed to mean NG isnt lazy and high aid slot usage isnt a good thing?

So to wrap this thread up, NG makes excuses for their laziness and incompentant alliance.
[/quote]
I would bet many alliances would want to be as incompetent as Non Grata sitting second only to IRON. (Sorry GPA, you're neutral and don't count).

Alliance Strength: 13,672,344
Average Nation Strength: 51,789
Score: 51.79
Infrastructure: 1,875,975
Technology: 1,030,805
Nukes: 4,377

If those numbers are a result of incompetence, then where do I sign up?

Edited May 29, 2012 by Jaiar

[Schattenmann]

[quote name='Zoomzoomzoom' timestamp='1338247482' post='2973732']
Having a high aid slot usage does not necessarily mean an alliance is active. It usually means that an alliance typically has one overly dedicated person arranging everything for an alliance. Props to these active government members, however few in number they may be, but it does not mean that their alliance is spectacularly active.
[/quote]
I may be talking out of my butt, but I feel like a couple years ago there was a change in mentality that alliances are supposed to do everything for their members. I was dumbfounded when I realized how many alliances were adopting "trade czars" and no one took care of their own circles a few years ago. Natural progression is aid slots next.

CoJ is entirely hands-off and our usage stat is abysmal, so there's definitely something to be said for a well-run economics dept, but going overboard is also the wrong way, as you've pointed out.

[quote name='Jaiar' timestamp='1338249453' post='2973745']
Aid slot usage is definitely not a good measure of alliance activity. In a 10 day span an alliance can recruit a bunch of new nations which probably won't have those slots full and cause a massive percentage drop in the aid slot use percentage.
[/quote]
Indicating that they don't know what to do with new recruits. It's not everything, but it's a solid metric.

Edited May 29, 2012 by Schattenmann

[Omniscient1]

[quote name='Roquentin' timestamp='1338250356' post='2973761']
It was mostly covered in the Amazing Sanction Race, where I got the stats from since it illustrated the point zoom makes in the op of an alliance declining in usage when there's no one willing to herd the cats.
[/quote]

I honestly don't care any, but it seems people try to make their enemies look incompetent or inactive when it hold no water at all. I get it helps you politically, but it's retarded.

[arch3004]

[quote name='Rotavele' timestamp='1338250074' post='2973755']
ITT: Non Slota makes excuses for having 40% Aid Slot Efficiency.


I read all of this and I dont get it, Umbrella and GOD lowered their aid slot efficiency... this is supposed to mean NG isnt lazy and high aid slot usage isnt a good thing?

So to wrap this thread up, NG makes excuses for their laziness and incompentant alliance.




Those dont win wars, but we have those too.
[/quote]

Trying to find these "excuses" or where the OP mentions NG at all for that matter.

[Beauty]

[quote name='Jaiar' timestamp='1338250489' post='2973763']
I would bet many alliances would want to be as incompetent as Non Grata sitting second only to IRON. (Sorry GPA, you're neutral and don't count).

Alliance Strength: 13,672,344
Average Nation Strength: 51,789
Score: 51.79
Infrastructure: 1,875,975
Technology: 1,030,805
Nukes: 4,377

If those numbers are a result of incompetence, then where do I sign up?
[/quote]

Those stats are simple that, Stats. When inactive friends on NG remain inactive (FOK, Hydra, etc) they merge into NG. Once you pick up so many inactive alliances, your stats will start to show it. NG remained at 8 million NS for awhile after the war, while alliances such as MCXA doubled their NS... Eventually FOK (Inactives, even if I do love them) merged into NG to put them at 13million NS. Its the former active and compentant alliances who have built up the stats. If NG was ever rolled (God let us pray they do), they'd either lay there or start to actually function and do good in the world. I do not know for a fact, but im betting a merge 3% of NG's nations actually applied to be there, rather then merged into it.


[quote name='arch3004' timestamp='1338251046' post='2973768']
Trying to find these "excuses" or where the OP mentions NG at all for that matter.
[/quote]

If this thread isnt about Non Grata or their excuses to why their slot efficiency isnt up... Then please sir.. tell me what is the topic of discussion.

Edited May 29, 2012 by Rotavele

[Krihelion]

FOK members are very active on our forums. We currently have these people on:

Elite Xiphosis Spy Unkajo, Comrade Lenin, Google, Natas, Velocity111111111111111111, SuperRoidRage, Comrade Trotsky, Scandalous Rumour, Kethean, Jaddels, Kzoppistan, IAMWalrus, Sunny Side King, jgator, Warmaster Jacapo, fiercesob, Ricus, DarthCyfe6, zoom, ncc, Caustic

Only 4 of those arent members. I'd like to see how many members MCXA has online?

[Beauty]

[quote name='Unkajo' timestamp='1338251494' post='2973770']
FOK members are very active on our forums. We currently have these people on:

Elite Xiphosis Spy Unkajo, Comrade Lenin, Google, Natas, Velocity111111111111111111, SuperRoidRage, Comrade Trotsky, Scandalous Rumour, Kethean, Jaddels, Kzoppistan, IAMWalrus, Sunny Side King, jgator, Warmaster Jacapo, fiercesob, Ricus, DarthCyfe6, zoom, ncc, Caustic

Only 4 of those arent members. I'd like to see how many members MCXA has online?
[/quote]


Rotavele, DookieOnDrumsLogo, supercheeseLogo, AgentChaosLogo, OliLogo, Google, Mr HavokLogo, monty_koLogo, jrkeeLogo, osbornmLogo, Roo Blu II//Logo, 14dwright, Unkajo, YosodogLogo, Wintersky, LemacLogo

14 members and you.

You have 17, we have 14.

17/260 members and 14/130 members.

NG has 6.5% of their members on, MCXA has 11.5%. You can see this as your online in our forums.... Congratulations on looking stupid.

EDIT: Ooh we have almost double members online, and double aid sl.... Nvm thats just too ironic.

Edited May 29, 2012 by Rotavele