kingzog Posted December 1, 2016 Report Share Posted December 1, 2016 7 hours ago, Neo Uruk said: you could always tell one set of friends that !@#$ is unacceptable What, and deny Hegemony 3.0 the opportunity to have a pretend war against a pretend enemy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerschbs Posted December 1, 2016 Report Share Posted December 1, 2016 2 hours ago, kingzog said: What, and deny Hegemony 3.0 the opportunity to have a pretend war against a pretend enemy? I mean, you'll get rolled if someone feels like it either way. (Coming from a former MI6 member, not my current affiliation.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo Uruk Posted December 1, 2016 Report Share Posted December 1, 2016 3 hours ago, kingzog said: What, and deny Hegemony 3.0 the opportunity to have a pretend war against a pretend enemy? well, you'd think an alliance that's been in a slump since god-knows-when and used to cherish being the !@#$%^& martyrs would, y'know, be !@#$%^& and/or martyrs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingzog Posted December 1, 2016 Report Share Posted December 1, 2016 2 hours ago, kerschbs said: I mean, you'll get rolled if someone feels like it either way. (Coming from a former MI6 member, not my current affiliation.) Precisely. The current Brave New World is just like the old Brave New World. The only difference between this and previous iterations is the list of satellites who mistakenly believe they're at or near the center of power. 1 hour ago, Neo Uruk said: well, you'd think an alliance that's been in a slump since god-knows-when and used to cherish being the !@#$%^& martyrs would, y'know, be !@#$%^& and/or martyrs As a great believer in realpolitik, my expectations are usually low. This means that if I'm going to be surprised, it will usually be pleasantly so. In this case, it just wasn't a surprise at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvon Posted December 1, 2016 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2016 One thing you seem to forget of the Sith, is the Order is essentially the Emperor. We all make our decisions for different reasons; to debate who of us is more wrong or right than our predecessors and successors is like debating which is more round - a tennis ball or a bowling ball. Personally speaking, I would have (and had at the time in private and pretty much so here on the OWF) told Grata to go $%&@ themselves. That dead relationship would not have guided my decision towards the living Kashmir relationship. Joe's connections were opposite of mine; that's his circle and his thing. Kirsten's circles were different of mine and different of Joe's. Going further back, YouWish's circles were different than mine and different than Joes and different than Kirsten's; going even further back LintWad's circles were different than YWs which were different than mine which were different than Joe's which were different than Kirstens .. I could continue this trend right back to Ivan if you wish ... What you can expect from one Emperor, you can not necessarily expect from the next. The Order serves the Codex; the Codex serves the Emperor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabonnobar Posted December 2, 2016 Report Share Posted December 2, 2016 On 11/30/2016 at 7:29 AM, kingzog said: I certainly never believed NSO would do anything to support Kashmir, and said so repeatedly. Except for the aid bomb we promised, which I remember skeptical members of Kush saying "I'll believe it when I see it", and which we followed through on. It wasn't a massive aid drop because we are a small and not-Umbrella-efficiency alliance, but I mustered a more-than-fair number of slots of aid and even did a donation deal to make sure the majority of your open slots were filled. That aid continued until y'all told me that y'all were switching to tech deals and invited us to buy tech at favorable-to-seller rates, which we did. And I am personally still doing that, when I log in anyway, as my aid history shows. Was mere aid enough? I am not going to use the weasel word "probably." The answer is no, as I believed back then too. But as the person who organized the aid, to see Kushbros insinuate that we did nothing is frustrating. What, and deny Hegemony 3.0 the opportunity to have a pretend war against a pretend enemy? Us entering would not have denied Oculus any opportunity. It still would have been a curbstomp. I'm not sure who you think we would have brought in, but they would have made very little difference. That is not to say that we were right not to enter, of course. We should have entered regardless. The only difference between this and previous iterations is the list of satellites who mistakenly believe they're at or near the center of power. If this is referring to NSO: we are not under that delusion. If any of us had thoughts otherwise before y'all were noCB hit by Oculus (p sure few of us ever did), then that DoW evaporated them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Layton Posted December 2, 2016 Report Share Posted December 2, 2016 On 11/30/2016 at 0:15 PM, Lysergide said: Kashmir is better off without NSO as an ally or friend.They are more than happy to let allies burn for their cause, but find it hard pressed to lift a finger to help their allies. Lyser! Been a while! I missed you, you son of a !@#$%*! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackatron Posted December 2, 2016 Report Share Posted December 2, 2016 I don't really want to interject again here, because this isn't my debate, but there seems to be the attitude that NSO could have actually changed anything. Now I'm not saying it is right to ignore an ally in need, if a friend requests help you should be there for them, but to pretend that their efforts would have any statistical effects on Kashmir is disingenuous, not only is NSO smaller than NG/NpO, and already against a much larger group of alliances, the Oculus side of the war still had NPO, IRON and VE to call in as back up, not to mention R&R, NATO, TLR, GATO, ODN, Atlas, MHA, Legion, DBDC and probably a couple of others. In other words like ~120 million NS not even involved in the war. You would have burned for at least as hard for at least as long (if not harder and longer should Oculus want to grind down NSO) if they entered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingzog Posted December 2, 2016 Report Share Posted December 2, 2016 12 hours ago, rabonnobar said: Except for the aid bomb we promised, which I remember skeptical members of Kush saying "I'll believe it when I see it", and which we followed through on. It wasn't a massive aid drop because we are a small and not-Umbrella-efficiency alliance, but I mustered a more-than-fair number of slots of aid and even did a donation deal to make sure the majority of your open slots were filled. That aid continued until y'all told me that y'all were switching to tech deals and invited us to buy tech at favorable-to-seller rates, which we did. And I am personally still doing that, when I log in anyway, as my aid history shows. Was mere aid enough? I am not going to use the weasel word "probably." The answer is no, as I believed back then too. But as the person who organized the aid, to see Kushbros insinuate that we did nothing is frustrating. Us entering would not have denied Oculus any opportunity. It still would have been a curbstomp. I'm not sure who you think we would have brought in, but they would have made very little difference. That is not to say that we were right not to enter, of course. We should have entered regardless. If this is referring to NSO: we are not under that delusion. If any of us had thoughts otherwise before y'all were noCB hit by Oculus (p sure few of us ever did), then that DoW evaporated them. *sigh* You've read far, far too much into what I said. I'm not upset at all. I'm not pointing fingers. Yes, I understand what happened. It just wasn't a surprise to me. Realpolitik. It's a thing. And everybody gets to be on the pointy end of it sometimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartacus1082 Posted December 3, 2016 Report Share Posted December 3, 2016 On Thursday, December 01, 2016 at 1:45 AM, Neo Uruk said: you could always tell one set of friends that !@#$ is unacceptable but maybe i'm just a more forward person when it comes to friends, who knows! Maybe we did and they didn't listen? Who knows? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lysergide Posted December 3, 2016 Report Share Posted December 3, 2016 (edited) 20 hours ago, Jack Layton said: Lyser! Been a while! I missed you, you son of a !@#$%*! Ah, my old old friend. Don't sour yourself over the loss of my appearance. You are on your own noble quest that you must attend to, you have learned all that you needed to and you don't need my humor anymore. Edited December 3, 2016 by Lysergide Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo Uruk Posted December 4, 2016 Report Share Posted December 4, 2016 On 12/2/2016 at 8:39 PM, Spartacus1082 said: Maybe we did and they didn't listen? Who knows? and...you didn't drop them? Or are you genuinely saying "who knows" because that seems like a thing your alliance should in fact know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvon Posted December 4, 2016 Author Report Share Posted December 4, 2016 6 hours ago, Neo Uruk said: and...you didn't drop them? Or are you genuinely saying "who knows" because that seems like a thing your alliance should in fact know Maybe you need to stick that medal where it doesnt shine. I said whats done is done. This thread provided information of cessation. Go live in the past all your lonesome. We are moving forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Hakai Posted December 4, 2016 Report Share Posted December 4, 2016 I think neo urk is an automated response bot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingzog Posted December 5, 2016 Report Share Posted December 5, 2016 15 hours ago, Master Hakai said: I think neo urk is an automated response bot I think all of us are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartacus1082 Posted December 5, 2016 Report Share Posted December 5, 2016 Hell, I'm sill trying to figure out why I decided to grace you all with my presence...... But I agree Neo must be a bot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattski133 Posted December 6, 2016 Report Share Posted December 6, 2016 (edited) Post thread about a political relationship that died a year ago and a friendship that died somewhere in between. Get inflamed when it goes the only way it could. Suggest you are moving forward. Here we are, somehow. Edited December 6, 2016 by mattski133 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvon Posted December 6, 2016 Author Report Share Posted December 6, 2016 (edited) Not all of us have those feelings towards you, so yeah I am personally a little unwilling to entertain that line of discussion and would like the thread to end with little more. I was putting the information out there since the request only just came to make it official and clearing the air for third-parties. Edited December 6, 2016 by Rayvon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YOLO SWAG Posted December 10, 2016 Report Share Posted December 10, 2016 I will always feel immense love toward Rayvon and the New Sith Order. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartacus1082 Posted December 13, 2016 Report Share Posted December 13, 2016 On Saturday, December 10, 2016 at 3:36 PM, YOLO SWAG said: I will always feel immense love toward Rayvon and the New Sith Order. That feeling is mutual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Stupid Posted December 23, 2016 Report Share Posted December 23, 2016 (edited) Interesting topic. I made the call to not defend Kashmir and I would make that call time and time again. That's the risk you take when you go paperless and I see Kashmir has since stopped being paperless, which is a step in the right direction. Truth be told it was a lose-lose situation for NSO. NSO's entrance into this war would have drug the war out and more than likely been our demise. The way the world is these days I don't think many alliances can take a sustained beating without disbanding in these harsh times. As Emperor one must protect his own alliance before protecting allies. Most of those times they correlate and i'd gladly throw myself and the alliance into the fire for another ally. However NSO's entrance into this war would have changed absolutely nothing. We did deliver lots of aid post war but i guess that simply isn't enough. Edited December 23, 2016 by Joe Stupid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirWilliam Posted December 23, 2016 Report Share Posted December 23, 2016 1 hour ago, Joe Stupid said: That's the risk you take when you go paperless and I see Kashmir has since stopped being paperless, which is a step in the right direction. For the sake of clarity, although Kashmir is no longer completely paperless we still have non-formal relationships with alliances like LC and PPO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lysergide Posted December 25, 2016 Report Share Posted December 25, 2016 On 12/22/2016 at 7:25 PM, Joe Stupid said: Interesting topic. I made the call to not defend Kashmir and I would make that call time and time again. That's the risk you take when you go paperless and I see Kashmir has since stopped being paperless, which is a step in the right direction. Truth be told it was a lose-lose situation for NSO. NSO's entrance into this war would have drug the war out and more than likely been our demise. The way the world is these days I don't think many alliances can take a sustained beating without disbanding in these harsh times. As Emperor one must protect his own alliance before protecting allies. Most of those times they correlate and i'd gladly throw myself and the alliance into the fire for another ally. However NSO's entrance into this war would have changed absolutely nothing. We did deliver lots of aid post war but i guess that simply isn't enough. Kashmir has rebuilt from their beat down as well as numerous beat downs in the past. Their alliance has also actually been increasing in strength, not stagnating like yours is. Let us not forget the fact that Kashmir had spent a vast majority of its time before getting stomped engaged in anti-terrorist actions, so the fact that they are able to recover from that is a strong indication of their strength versus yours. You put Infra before your Friends. In a world as small as this, friends aren't something you push away anymore. I remember a time when NSO would burn for any of their allies. I guess those times have gone, and NSO is more concerned with holding onto what little strength they have left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebel Virginia Posted December 25, 2016 Report Share Posted December 25, 2016 36 minutes ago, Lysergide said: NSO is more concerned with holding onto what little strength they have left. You give us too much credit. I know I'm not concerned with that. I simply do not care anymore. I believe in nothing, not even hate. I used to be so full of hate, but now I'm just so empty inside. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Stupid Posted December 25, 2016 Report Share Posted December 25, 2016 16 hours ago, Lysergide said: I remember a time when NSO would burn for any of their allies. The perils of being paperless is that you aren't an ally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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