NADC-Atlas Announcement

[James Spanier]

We already control the senate so that obviously wasn't the goal was it? ...  Polaris has not had ''control'' of the senate for many years, if at all ever, and we are not seeking to control it now for any reason other than your conduct which we believe to be contrary to the best interests of blue.

 

Now this is some good stuff right here. Are you sure Polar's singular mantra here isn't the party contrary to the best interests of blue? I don't think Polar gets to be judge and jury, and obviously at least two alliances on Blue disagree. How far are you willing to push that 'holier than thou' line of force upon your fellow denizens?

[The Zigur]

I know this is difficult for you to understand, being that you are obsessed with your role as my greatest fanboy right now, but if LH was the offender why were there multiple sanctions placed?  I also note that no research was done before you sprouted the fact that there was no opposition, in fact even a cursory glance will see comments made against the sanction at the time by concerned members of the blue team.  Now the sanctions have been lifted and the war concluded, we are seeking clarification/justification, it is simple really. 
 
I am not sure what my influence at Polaris has to do with the argument?  I was horrified the whole time you were in Polaris, but it didn't seem to stop you arguing whatever it was that you have now backflipped on to Olympic standards.  Being an apologist for sanction thuggery seems a reach even for you but if this is who you are now, I trust you will be able to live with it.  It must be difficult to see the thousands of pages of drivel you posted now you have adopted the ''polar'' opposite views.

 
The sanctions were a measured response, indeed, you should be thankful for them since they helped to push Monsters Inc to surrender and become a Polar tech farm:
 

Just as an update, since MI has surrendered and is now out of this war, Doom Kingdom has let the various senators know that we are no longer requesting sanctions of MI, CA or LN.  Thank you to our allies and others who helped us with this matter.

 

You might be able to fool the newer nations by talking about "sanction thuggery" but we both come from a time when real thuggery was represented by things like forced disbandments and EZI, so let's not pretend a white surrender, nor sanctions which helped lead to a white surrender, was actual "thuggery." If those logs were never posted, sanctions would never have happened.

 

As to your influence, it is notable that a couple years ago Polar was a center of world power, alliances like CCC, NADC and SNX/MCXA were part of your power-sphere. The rapid degradation of relations between Polar and these former allies speaks volumes to your personal foreign affairs approach.

[Chunky Monkey]

 

We already control the senate so that obviously wasn't the goal was it?  I know you are not the sharpest tool, but Polaris has an issue with your actions and we will continue to inform members of the blue team of what we regard as highly dubious justifications for such a powerful tool.  We have been very happy with the conduct of the Senate since it was introduced until this very situation.  Polaris has not had ''control'' of the senate for many years, if at all ever, and we are not seeking to control it now for any reason other than your conduct which we believe to be contrary to the best interests of blue. 

 

I know you were never a member of any kind of Blue coalition, although you did get to meet one, but Polaris does not consider your actions to be in the interests of blue nations specifically and in genera.  You can feel free to have a different opinion of course, but we will campaign against your senator (CCC) until you make assurances that you will not sanction an alliance member during an alliance war.  You say yourself that it was an easy war, so why did you need to resort to such thuggery?  You seem to be fairly smug about it for someone so very clearly in the wrong and using the helpless pacifists as your puppet is disgraceful at best.

 

Once again, CCC is the alliance who holds the senate position, they are the ones responsible for their senators actions and they have yet to present any justification for their senators actions.  I am not really interested in your version of events as you are neither the senator in question nor a member of the alliance to whom the questions have been put.  You are little more than white noise at this stage.

 

Also, as an aside, please don't send messages to us which contain threats of consequences, there is only so much laughter in all the world. 

You are welcome to have whatever opinions you like regarding the actions we took and you are free to inform anyone you want of these perceived "indiscretions". We were presented with a legitimate sanction request (source cited above, thanks Tywin) and acted on it with our legitimately elected senator. You freely admit in your own post "your senator (CCC)", yet you contradict yourself later stating that they are not our senator at all. The fact that you chose to mount a campaign for your senators, which included messaging our own nations to try to get your three (out of five) senators elected so you can control the senate​​​ shows that you are acting with only your own alliance's best interests in mind.

 

I'm glad to have never been part of a blue coalition personally since I imagine all it amounts to "do what Polar says or find yourself on the outside looking in". It is also unfortunate that you are unwilling to listen to "my version of events" since that version is the only version of events. If you have further questions on why the sanctions were requested on these specific members, I suggest you take them up with the requesting alliance, Doom Kingdom.

 

As far as threats of consequences, all actions have consequences. I did not state, nor imply any threats in my post, yet it is you who threaten consequences for our actions.

[Chunky Monkey]

 

There isn't one and you are not bound in any way to adhere to what has always been considered common sense. You made your choices, we made ours and there really isn't anything more to it.

I would agree with you that both alliances made their choices and it is what it is. The problem is when members of your alliance come in and decide to tell us how to run ours.

[hadesflames]

If you could please, provide the document we signed that binds us to this? Take your time. I'll wait.

I know you guys are slow, and that's why it hasn't dawned on you yet, but that's precisely why we're now running a 3rd senator...

*facepalm*
 

The sanctions were placed for the reason that Lord Hitchcock released logs of a private conversation with a Doom Kingdom government official. It had nothing to do with the war and was enforced without controversy on every color sphere.

Obviously not, considering the blue team sanctions were lifted immediately, as much of the blue sphere protested NADC's and CCC's cowardly actions.
 

Please, I know Grub loves to shut down any discussion that contradicts his narrative, but don't solely rely on Grub's creative interpretation of events for decision-making. It's horrifying to see the amount of influence he has in Polaris.

I know this one will be hard for you to believe because you're so self absorbed that you think you're right about everything despite having absolutely 0 insight into anything. But, Grub is *not* a member of Polar government. His influence does *not* extend further than that of an advisor to the emperor and the council. Polar's actions do not reflect Grubs. Just because you sold out to the doom sphere and now want to us to do the same doesn't mean there's an evil mastermind holding us back. It just means we're not !@#$@#$ hypocrites like you are.
 

The sanctions were a measured response, indeed, you should be thankful for them since they helped to push Monsters Inc to surrender and become a Polar tech farm:

Further outlining just how little you know. Edited August 26, 2015 by hadesflames

[Chunky Monkey]

I know you guys are slow, and that's why it hasn't dawned on you yet, but that's precisely why we're not running a 3rd senator...

*facepalm*

 

The message your alliance sent our membership does not agree:

 

"The New Polar Order is backing three candidates this month: Willaim Kreiger of Germanic Empire, medic32 of Ecateca, and Almighty Grub of Union of Grub. We ask you to join us in voting these three nations into the Senate to ensure prosperity and stability on the Blue Team."

 

Unless you've decided between 2PM 8/25 and now to not run a third senator, in which case you have my sincere apologies.
​

Edited August 26, 2015 by Chunky Monkey

[AlmightyGrub]

 

Now this is some good stuff right here. Are you sure Polar's singular mantra here isn't the party contrary to the best interests of blue? I don't think Polar gets to be judge and jury, and obviously at least two alliances on Blue disagree. How far are you willing to push that 'holier than thou' line of force upon your fellow denizens?

 

Well I would have thought CCC would have been much holier than me?  I think as a member of Blue sphere I am entitled to an opinion on the conduct of the Senate, the long established standards have been apparently breached and NADC is clearly communicating that they don't consider them standards.  So I am guessing it is a matter for all blue nations to decide whether they consider NADC is willing to sanction anyone they feel like at the request of anyone they feel like during an alliance war where they are in opposition in any way shape or form.  I am asking questions, Polar in general is asking questions of our fellow Blue alliances and to date the answers received indicate a new attitude blowing through the senate.

 

Polaris is still very much of the view that alliance wars are not the place for sanctions, regardless of who places them or what ''justification'' is used to get there. That's why you have that declare war button and the big shiny nukes.  If DK was so aggrieved, let them declare war, not disable an alliance already at war.  Junka has attempted to convince me that all was fair and above board and unopposed on every other sphere, maybe that is so in your thinking.   The question is not whether the people requesting the sanction believe it was the best course of action for them but rather whether sanctioning an alliance member involved in an alliance war is the new ''black''

 

You can argue all you like about ethics and morality, but I am asking a question based on observation and asking whether this is the new way to do business on Blue.  If it is, then wonderful, we are forewarned.

[The Zigur]

 

The message your alliance sent our membership does not agree:

 

"The New Polar Order is backing three candidates this month: Willaim Kreiger of Germanic Empire, medic32 of Ecateca, and Almighty Grub of Union of Grub. We ask you to join us in voting these three nations into the Senate to ensure prosperity and stability on the Blue Team."

 

Unless you've decided between 2PM 8/25 and now to not run a third senator, in which case you have my sincere apologies.
​

 

Damn, knew I should have bet money on Grub installing himself as a senator.

[hadesflames]

The message your alliance sent our membership does not agree:
 
"The New Polar Order is backing three candidates this month: Willaim Kreiger of Germanic Empire, medic32 of Ecateca, and Almighty Grub of Union of Grub. We ask you to join us in voting these three nations into the Senate to ensure prosperity and stability on the Blue Team."
 
Unless you've decided between 2PM 8/25 and now to not run a third senator, in which case you have my sincere apologies.
​

Typo. Read my edit, but for your convenience, "that's precisely why we're now running a 3rd senator."
 

Damn, knew I should have bet money on Grub installing himself as a senator.

You're so stupid...What in your pea sized brain is possessing you to believe that he's winning the election by forcing votes?... Edited August 26, 2015 by hadesflames

[The Zigur]

I know this one will be hard for you to believe because you're so self absorbed that you think you're right about everything despite having absolutely 0 insight into anything. But, Grub is *not* a member of Polar government. His influence does *not* extend further than that of an advisor to the emperor and the council. Polar's actions do not reflect Grubs. Just because you sold out to the doom sphere and now want to us to do the same doesn't mean there's an evil mastermind holding us back. It just means we're not !@#$@#$ hypocrites like you are.

 

Please hadesflames, let's not pretend that titles mean that much, I remember you were one of the people complaining about how much I was advising SNX as a Polar diplomat.

Edited August 26, 2015 by Immortan Junka

[AlmightyGrub]

Typo. Read my edit, but for your convenience, "that's precisely why we're now running a 3rd senator."
 

You're so stupid...What in your pea sized brain is possessing you to believe that he's winning the election by forcing votes?...

 

I am quite the vote magnet hades. 

[Chunky Monkey]

 

Well I would have thought CCC would have been much holier than me?  I think as a member of Blue sphere I am entitled to an opinion on the conduct of the Senate, the long established standards have been apparently breached and NADC is clearly communicating that they don't consider them standards.  So I am guessing it is a matter for all blue nations to decide whether they consider NADC is willing to sanction anyone they feel like at the request of anyone they feel like during an alliance war where they are in opposition in any way shape or form.  I am asking questions, Polar in general is asking questions of our fellow Blue alliances and to date the answers received indicate a new attitude blowing through the senate.

 

Polaris is still very much of the view that alliance wars are not the place for sanctions, regardless of who places them or what ''justification'' is used to get there. That's why you have that declare war button and the big shiny nukes.  If DK was so aggrieved, let them declare war, not disable an alliance already at war.  Junka has attempted to convince me that all was fair and above board and unopposed on every other sphere, maybe that is so in your thinking.   The question is not whether the people requesting the sanction believe it was the best course of action for them but rather whether sanctioning an alliance member involved in an alliance war is the new ''black''

 

You can argue all you like about ethics and morality, but I am asking a question based on observation and asking whether this is the new way to do business on Blue.  If it is, then wonderful, we are forewarned.

 

I'll lay it out for you as simply as possible.

 

DK requested us to sanction several nations in relation to the leaks, as they had of alliances on every other sphere (my previous comments relating to it being because of the war were misinformed).

We requested our senator act on the sanctions as requested, and as alliances on other spheres had already completed.

 

Would it have been perfectly acceptable if say, NATO's senator had acted on the sanctions instead? According to your logic, it seems like it would have. If that is the case, then I don't see the problem here. The nations would have ended up just as sanctioned.

 

As an aside, if you consider telling someone that they've "never had an original thought in their life", calling them "white noise", and calling their alliance "little" and "loose" asking questions based on observation, then I'd hate to see what vile content you post when you're actively trying to put someone down.

[hadesflames]

Please hadesflames, let's not pretend that titles mean that much, I remember you were one of the people complaining about how much I was advising SNX as a Polar diplomat.

Stop pretending like you have even an inkling of what you're on about.

I am quite the vote magnet hades.

Nah, you clearly tracked down my address and threatened both my life and the lives of my family to earn my vote, you're the worst!

I'll lay it out for you as simply as possible.
 
DK requested us to sanction several nations in relation to the leaks, as they had of alliances on every other sphere (my previous comments relating to it being because of the war were misinformed).
We requested our senator act on the sanctions as requested, and as alliances on other spheres had already completed.
 
Would it have been perfectly acceptable if say, NATO's senator had acted on the sanctions instead? According to your logic, it seems like it would have. If that is the case, then I don't see the problem here. The nations would have ended up just as sanctioned.
 
As an aside, if you consider telling someone that they've "never had an original thought in their life", calling them "white noise", and calling their alliance "little" and "loose" asking questions based on observation, then I'd hate to see what vile content you post when you're actively trying to put someone down.

And we've already stated your actions were garbage and cowardly. If it had come from NATO, WTF, or anyone else, we would have reacted in the same way. We aren't going to sit back and let crap like this happen in the blue sphere, we couldn't care less how legitimate you find the reason to be. It had nothing to do with the blue sphere, and the blue sphere isn't a place where we'll allow people to get sanctioned for simply being involved in an alliance war. Not so long as we're capable of having a say in it.

Feel free to respond as you wish to our actions.

[Dubh Caireallain]

...The sanctions seemed justified considering the ridiculous CB Monsters Inc. used...

 

This is a joke right? If this is the metric we should use to judge whether someone deserves a sanction, we should have all begun sanctioning each other during alliance wars a loooong time ago.

[Chunky Monkey]

 

This is a joke right? If this is the metric we should use to judge whether someone deserves a sanction, we should have all begun sanctioning each other during alliance wars a loooong time ago.

I do apologize, but my statement there was misinformed, as I admitted a couple posts up. The reason for the sanction was not related to the war, but to the leaks.

[Chunky Monkey]

And we've already stated your actions were garbage and cowardly. If it had come from NATO, WTF, or anyone else, we would have reacted in the same way. We aren't going to sit back and let crap like this happen in the blue sphere, we couldn't care less how legitimate you find the reason to be. It had nothing to do with the blue sphere, and the blue sphere isn't a place where we'll allow people to get sanctioned for simply being involved in an alliance war. Not so long as we're capable of having a say in it.

Feel free to respond as you wish to our actions.

 

And your actions to control the senate and do what you want with the blue sphere is self-serving and dictatorial, but those qualities are not new to Polaris are they? Also, as I've previously stated, I was misinformed as to the reason for the sanctions, they were relating to the leaks not the war. I would suggest you consider the fact that these sanctions were carried out on other spheres with no issue, and take a look at your response. I would say if you looked hard enough you would see you are overreacting, but who am I kidding, you're Polaris, you'll never see things any other way.

 

We will respond in an appropriate and proportioned manner to whatever actions you decide to take.

[James Spanier]

And we've already stated your actions were garbage and cowardly. If it had come from NATO, WTF, or anyone else, we would have reacted in the same way. We aren't going to sit back and let crap like this happen in the blue sphere, we couldn't care less how legitimate you find the reason to be. It had nothing to do with the blue sphere, and the blue sphere isn't a place where we'll allow people to get sanctioned for simply being involved in an alliance war. Not so long as we're capable of having a say in it.

Feel free to respond as you wish to our actions.

 

 

Is it Blue Sphere or Polar Sphere?

[Alexio15]

Stop pretending like you have even an inkling of what you're on about.


Nah, you clearly tracked down my address and threatened both my life and the lives of my family to earn my vote, you're the worst!


And we've already stated your actions were garbage and cowardly. If it had come from NATO, WTF, or anyone else, we would have reacted in the same way. We aren't going to sit back and let crap like this happen in the blue sphere, we couldn't care less how legitimate you find the reason to be. It had nothing to do with the blue sphere, and the blue sphere isn't a place where we'll allow people to get sanctioned for simply being involved in an alliance war. Not so long as we're capable of having a say in it.

Feel free to respond as you wish to our actions.

As stated by everyone including dk officials this was nothing to dk with the war. Although it had everything to do with lh and is very good initial response to leak virtually everything that lands at his door. Kinds to not be the kind of thing that anyone in this world looks at kindly. Now I'm going to try the classic polar trick right here. Or is it something that polar thinks is a non issue subject. As that is pretty much what you're saying. Did I do it right guys?

[AlmightyGrub]

 

And your actions to control the senate and do what you want with the blue sphere is self-serving and dictatorial, but those qualities are not new to Polaris are they? Also, as I've previously stated, I was misinformed as to the reason for the sanctions, they were relating to the leaks not the war. I would suggest you consider the fact that these sanctions were carried out on other spheres with no issue, and take a look at your response. I would say if you looked hard enough you would see you are overreacting, but who am I kidding, you're Polaris, you'll never see things any other way.

 

We will respond in an appropriate and proportioned manner to whatever actions you decide to take.

 

I agree, we control the senate as of now because we can, you still have your seat via CCC and NATO has their seat.  If you want to run a candidate, you need merely send out the instructions to your alliance that you sent to ours.  If you get sufficient votes then you can form a little bloc with CCC and NATO to control the senate I guess.   I am happy to be overreacting if the result is someone addressing the actual issue, if you think that trying to avoid the situation by insulting me will work, you will find I couldn't care less how good you think you are, a simple answer will be sufficient.

 

What I have worked out so far from your rambling is that you consider sanctioning alliance members at war to be okay, that you are entitled to do whatever you like because you vote as a bloc with CCC and that you believe that you can threaten us and that we wont laugh.

 

Perhaps you need to actually state your position clearly so I can stop overreacting to your attempts to be cute/smug/half-smart and if we agree that you are not setting a precedent that Polaris considers dangerous we can all move on... or not.

[AlmightyGrub]

 

 

Is it Blue Sphere or Polar Sphere?

 

Blue, but we live here too?

[Alexio15]

 
I agree, we control the senate as of now because we can, you still have your seat via CCC and NATO has their seat.  If you want to run a candidate, you need merely send out the instructions to your alliance that you sent to ours.  If you get sufficient votes then you can form a little bloc with CCC and NATO to control the senate I guess.   I am happy to be overreacting if the result is someone addressing the actual issue, if you think that trying to avoid the situation by insulting me will work, you will find I couldn't care less how good you think you are, a simple answer will be sufficient.
 
What I have worked out so far from your rambling is that you consider sanctioning alliance members at war to be okay, that you are entitled to do whatever you like because you vote as a bloc with CCC and that you believe that you can threaten us and that we wont laugh.
 
Perhaps you need to actually state your position clearly so I can stop overreacting to your attempts to be cute/smug/half-smart and if we agree that you are not setting a precedent that Polaris considers dangerous we can all move on... or not.

I'm actually pretty sure they have claimed that this isn't a precedent... or at least everyone involved from any sphere has claimed this isn't.

[The Zigur]

You're so stupid...What in your pea sized brain is possessing you to believe that he's winning the election by forcing votes?...

 

It's really not hard to deduct that Grub would get himself appointed as third official Polar candidate after dealing with his unrestrained egoism over the last several months.

[Chunky Monkey]

 

I agree, we control the senate as of now because we can, you still have your seat via CCC and NATO has their seat.  If you want to run a candidate, you need merely send out the instructions to your alliance that you sent to ours.  If you get sufficient votes then you can form a little bloc with CCC and NATO to control the senate I guess.   I am happy to be overreacting if the result is someone addressing the actual issue, if you think that trying to avoid the situation by insulting me will work, you will find I couldn't care less how good you think you are, a simple answer will be sufficient.

 

What I have worked out so far from your rambling is that you consider sanctioning alliance members at war to be okay, that you are entitled to do whatever you like because you vote as a bloc with CCC and that you believe that you can threaten us and that we wont laugh.

 

Perhaps you need to actually state your position clearly so I can stop overreacting to your attempts to be cute/smug/half-smart and if we agree that you are not setting a precedent that Polaris considers dangerous we can all move on... or not.

I don't even know what to say to this. You say that I'm avoiding things by insulting you, by quoting a post directed at someone else, after you spent your first 4 replies to me hurling insults like they were going out of style. I would really like to see the world that you live it, it must be a sight to behold.

 

As far as my position, let me make it as clear as I can:

 

We will take actions that we deem necessary to ensure that the Blue team senate is not controlled by one single alliance, so that all Blue nations may continue to enjoy the prosperity granted by having a diverse senate.

We will direct our senator to act in a way that is in line with our alliance principles, and take actions we choose regardless of the meddling of outside parties.​

We will take actions that are proportional and appropriate to threats directed at our alliance and our allies.

We will take any action necessary to ensure we maintain the sovereignty of our alliance, and that of our allies.

[Sigrun Vapneir]

As much as I hate to agree with Grub, he's absolutely right about this.

 

Sanctioning my alliance, on the excuse of LH dumping a few lines from a log that everyone had already seen multiple times anyway, was utter nonsense from beginning to end and everyone who was vaguely associated with that act should be ashamed of themselves.

 

This has absolutely nothing to do with 'maintaining the sovereignty' of your alliance which we never threatened or offended in any way.

 

But mindlessly sanctioning anyone that an ally requests sanctioning? Now that is a threat to your sovereignty, if not a revelation you have none.
 

[Dajobo]

It's really not hard to deduct that Grub would get himself appointed as the third official Polar candidate after dealing with his unrestrained egoism over the last several months.

Tywin you're wrong on this one. They asked me to but I had to decline (OOC I'm back in hospital).
I know the battle between you and Grub all too well but you should walk from this one.