Shokkou Posted July 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 We did not remove Shokkou for using a racial slur. We removed him for going rogue on three members of our alliance. This much is accurate. I left the alliance and went rogue by choice because I refused to put up with the things mentioned in my earlier post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Zigur Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 ""slur"" Spock is literally and openly racist I knew there's a reason he always bans me on their channel! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IYIyTh Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 (edited) Are you denying that you continued to post the racial slur you were asked to stop using? That you went rogue on the alliance after you continued using it despite the request because those subsequent posts were removed? You got upset when your following posts determined to challenge that request were removed (including aforementioned language,) and decided to hit MI6 in response. Because you had a disagreement with one individual. I don't really have anything invested in the event. I was happy to see you arrive at MI6. I'm disappointed that instead of just moving on or not repeating what you had been asked not to you decided to react (see: continue using racial slur,) and go rogue on the alliance as opposed to expressing your disagreement in other ways, but that was your choice. I'm not really sure what you're on about. I don't really care for your argument over it not being racist because you didn't mean it to be, it was a simple request to not use the word. Instead of being reasonable you decided it was some sort of orwellian plot to keep you down. Also, I'm not in government -- just an annoyed bystander who watched it all happen. But yeah, I'm not worried about MI6, or myself -- thanks for your concern. Edited July 15, 2015 by IYIyTh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shokkou Posted July 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 Are you denying that you continued to post the racial slur you were asked to stop using? You got upset when your following posts determined to challenge that request were removed (including aforementioned language,) and decided to hit MI6 in response. You decided to challenge a very simple request and in response a very simple determination was made to simply remove the offensive posts in question. In response you decided it was a conspiracy of folks out to get you. I don't really have anything invested in the event. I was happy to see you arrived at MI6. I'm disappointed that instead of just moving on you decided to react and leave the way you did, but that was your choice. I'm not really sure what you're on about. I don't really care for your argument over it not being racist because you didn't mean it to be, it was a simple request to not use the word. Instead of being reasonable you decided it was some sort of orwellian plot to keep you down. Also, I'm not in government -- just an annoyed bystander who watched it all happen. But yeah, I'm not worried about MI6, or myself -- thanks for your concern. This is false and yet another twisting of my words and the facts. I did not determine it was some sort of Orwellian conspiracy out to get me. I determined it was just a sad circlejerk of people who enjoyed their positions of power too much. As I have repeatedly stated, I reposted the slur once when the situation was not handled in good faith and again in a different context when it became obvious that this expectation of "respect" only went one way. I don't care what you think of my arguments because you have shown you are only interested in misrepresenting them to cover your own hide. I also notice you did not address the fact that non-gov members of the alliance negotiated peace with me in spite of your and TLs efforts to get me rolled. Perhaps you need more time to find your words? It's ok. I'll wait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vladimir Poutine Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 This is false and yet another twisting of my words and the facts. I did not determine it was some sort of Orwellian conspiracy out to get me. I determined it was just a sad circlejerk of people who enjoyed their positions of power too much. As I have repeatedly stated, I reposted the slur once when the situation was not handled in good faith and again in a different context when it became obvious that this expectation of "respect" only went one way. I don't care what you think of my arguments because you have shown you are only interested in misrepresenting them to cover your own hide. I also notice you did not address the fact that non-gov members of the alliance negotiated peace with me in spite of your and TLs efforts to get me rolled. Perhaps you need more time to find your words? It's ok. I'll wait Neither posting nor reposting any racial slur is okay in any context, be it your pursuit of the destruction of the "sad circlejerk" that is our gov, or just some general, good-faith trolling. While we may allow many things on our boards, outright racism and hate speech is entirely disallowed on the authority of our forum admin, so you'll have to take it up with him if you want that policy altered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IYIyTh Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 (edited) Are you denying that you continued to post the racial slur you were asked to stop using? That you went rogue on the alliance after you continued using it despite the request because those subsequent posts were removed? You're not disagreeing with the above, which is pretty much the only issue you raise. There's nothing to twist. I have nothing to hide. I don't know why you keep insinuating I do. My personal feelings on what should happen to a rogue after they go rogue are not relevant (You seem to think anyone who disagrees with your actions is out to get you and in some sort of place of power,) but you're correct that I didn't think you should have received peace so quickly, but that didn't have anything to do with your decision to go rogue. That's more or less because I wanted to give our lower tier a challenge. :war: Edited July 15, 2015 by IYIyTh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shokkou Posted July 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 Neither posting nor reposting any racial slur is okay in any context, be it your pursuit of the destruction of the "sad circlejerk" that is our gov, or just some general, good-faith trolling. While we may allow many things on our boards, outright racism and hate speech is entirely disallowed on the authority of our forum admin, so you'll have to take it up with him if you want that policy altered. Except that what I said was neither racist nor hate speech. Perhaps you need to learn the difference between derogatory language and racism or hate speech from a source other than Tumblr or Jezebel. You're not disagreeing with the above, which is pretty much the only issue you raise. There's nothing to twist. I have nothing to hide. I don't know why you keep insinuating I do. My personal feelings on what should happen to a rogue after they go rogue are not relevant (You seem to think anyone who disagrees with your actions is out to get you and in some sort of place of power,) but you're correct that I didn't think you should have received peace so quickly. That's more or less because I wanted to give our lower tier a challenge, though. :war: In your mind, sure. "Make the lie big, make it simple, keep saying it, and eventually they will believe it." It's nice to see you're sticking to such tried and true tactics to defame me. It's nice to see you can do no wrong and any mishandling of the situation by gov is irrelevant. That's certainly a great way to approach the situation and a major factor in my decision to go rogue. The fact of the matter is that non-gov members negotiated this peace in spite of the wishes of those above them. You can try to play coy all you want but you can't wriggle out of that fact, nor can you fool anyone into thinking not having a government position means you have the same influence as any other member. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IYIyTh Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 Government didn't force you to go rogue on three members of MI6, it asked you stop posting racial slurs and removed your subsequent posts containing them. That you went rogue because they did so is your choice. That's really it. Take care, hope you find some fun elsewhere that's defensible and worth the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vladimir Poutine Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 (edited) Except that what I said was neither racist nor hate speech. Perhaps you need to learn the difference between derogatory language and racism or hate speech from a source other than Tumblr or Jezebel. In your mind, sure. "Make the lie big, make it simple, keep saying it, and eventually they will believe it." It's nice to see you're sticking to such tried and true tactics to defame me. It's nice to see you can do no wrong and any mishandling of the situation by gov is irrelevant. That's certainly a great way to approach the situation and a major factor in my decision to go rogue. The fact of the matter is that non-gov members negotiated this peace in spite of the wishes of those above them. You can try to play coy all you want but you can't wriggle out of that fact, nor can you fool anyone into thinking not having a government position means you have the same influence as any other member. Peace was negotiated on the authority of our 002, Voodoo Nova. Neither of our M's (as far as I know) expressed any opinion on the matter. There was no higher authority in this situation. Edited July 15, 2015 by Vladimir Poutine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shokkou Posted July 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 (edited) Government didn't force you to go rogue on three members of MI6, it asked you stop posting racial slurs and removed your subsequent posts containing them. That you went rogue because they did so is your choice. That's really it. Take care, hope you find some fun elsewhere that's defensible and worth the time. Nothing was "requested" so much as it was demanded in a hostile manner when I expressed my frustration at having my posts deleted without any effort to approach the situation in good faith. From people I've known for years, I expected a little more sensibility rather than knee-jerk offense. You keep trying to strip the situation of context as if it doesn't matter (as, indeed, you were attempting to do before I went rogue), so forgive me if I come to the conclusion that you are pursuing your own interest rather than the truth. Peace was negotiated on the authority of our 002, Voodoo Nova. Neither of our M's (as far as I know) expressed any opinion on the matter. There was no higher authority in this situation. Of course it was negotiated "on the authority" of a 00. It needed gov approval, but who suggested pursuing peace? Who pushed for it? Edited July 15, 2015 by Shokkou Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vladimir Poutine Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 (edited) Nothing was "requested" so much as it was demanded in a hostile manner when I expressed my frustration at having my posts deleted without any effort to approach the situation in good faith. From people I've known for years, I expected a little more sensibility rather than knee-jerk offense. You keep trying to strip the situation of context as if it doesn't matter (as, indeed, you were attempting to do before I went rogue), so forgive me if I come to the conclusion that you are pursuing your own interest rather than the truth. Of course it was negotiated "on the authority" of a 00. It needed gov approval, but who suggested pursuing peace. Our 002 suggested pursuing peace. You can imagine what the rest of the alliance wanted. Edited July 15, 2015 by Vladimir Poutine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IYIyTh Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 (edited) Nothing was "requested" so much as it was demanded in a hostile manner when I expressed my frustration at having my posts deleted without any effort to approach the situation in good faith. You were asked to stop repeating racial slurs, of course they were removed when you subsequently decided to continue posting them. I don't know why you think you're owed an explanation, the explanation was self-evident. Your decision to go rogue on MI6 as a result is indefensible. Whatever the case, so long and thanks for all the fish. Edited July 15, 2015 by IYIyTh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shokkou Posted July 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 I thought you were done posting. That's a joke. Whatever you said, I knew your ego wouldn't allow it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IYIyTh Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 (edited) You're right, I think we're done here. Edited July 15, 2015 by IYIyTh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shokkou Posted July 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 Our 002 suggested pursuing peace. You can imagine what the rest of the alliance wanted. The way I heard it made the situation sound more nuanced than that. I suppose barring proof it'll just have to be left to the deductive capabilities of the international community. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vladimir Poutine Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 The way I heard it made the situation sound more nuanced than that. I suppose barring proof it'll just have to be left to the deductive capabilities of the international community. The way you heard it was incorrect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shokkou Posted July 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 The way you heard it was incorrect. I hope, for your sake, that this is a bluff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van Hoo III Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 All the good drama occurs when I am not paying attention. :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Bad Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 The way I heard it made the situation sound more nuanced than that. I suppose barring proof it'll just have to be left to the deductive capabilities of the international community. You do not want that because so far the international community can only deduce that you are a hot headed idiot that enjoys racists jokes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles the Tyrant Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 (edited) Now then, peace was reached quickly thanks to the efforts of those with more level-heads and decency than IYIyTh or TheListener. They told me that there were others who felt that certain people within MI6 had become too heavy-handed in their "leadership" on the forums and that if we could reach a peaceful solution it would go a long way in proving that open discussion and good faith are better than harsh censorship and thick-headedness. This was my exact response word for word, and I'm certain the MI6er in question can verify it if they wish to join the discussion in this thread: As the person primarily involved in these peace talks I can confirm this much. Censorship matters aside, I didn't see much advantage in going to war in the lower tiers with a nation who was intent on nuking our sellers over an extended period of time for something as trivial as censorship. That was the primary factor in my motivations to seek peace. Just bad business. Edited July 15, 2015 by Charles the Tyrant Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IYIyTh Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 (edited) I'm glad you two were able to discuss in private the merits and demerits of going rogue over the inability to use racial slurs and agreed it wasn't worth fighting over. Glad that's solved. Edited July 15, 2015 by IYIyTh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shokkou Posted July 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 (edited) You do not want that because so far the international community can only deduce that you are a hot headed idiot that enjoys racists jokes. Perhaps you would benefit from some select pieces of my side of things as I've relayed it thus far: I, as I imagine everyone here does, speak differently depending on the situation. I do not use the same language when I am with old friends from high school that I do when I am with my parents and their friends, or even at work. I believed I was making a joke among friends, people I've known for a long time who could perhaps have the same faith in me that I would in them. That being that I had no malicious intent behind my words, just as I have not assumed any from them the countless times they've employed similarly derogatory terms. The response I was met with did not fit that assumption however. These are the reasons I left MI6 and went rogue against them. Not because I was told I couldn't use a given word... but because I was told I couldn't use a given word, one that my accusers are also guilty of using, once in an obviously joking context. Because when I expressed my concern and frustration at the lack of good faith exercised in the approach to the situation, I was laughed at and told my concerns were meaningless. Accusations were leveled at me by people who should have known them to be false. I had no desire to put up with that, so I left. As for language not being acceptable on this board, this board is more of a public place than our private alliance boards. Making such a joke here would be more the equivalent of doing so in a public library or the DMV. Making the joke on our own boards is, and this analogy certainly fits many people at MI6 specifically, more like making the joke while chilling at a frat house. You can try to pretend that they are the same, but you would be an idiot. Except that what I said was neither racist nor hate speech. Perhaps you need to learn the difference between derogatory language and racism or hate speech from a source other than Tumblr or Jezebel. I'm glad you two were able to discuss in private the merits and demerits of going rogue over censorship and agreed it wasn't worth fighting over. Glad that's solved. It seems you had a typo in there. I've fixed it, and would like to add that that isn't what happened. There was no agreement that censorship wasn't worth fighting over. Edited July 15, 2015 by Shokkou Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Enema Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 Well by all means if that is the case then the removal is fairly justified. Racism is something that is not welcome in any place. I'm the first to snap at someone being racist, or mainly ''joking'' in any I'll manor just ask about I'm sure you will find that out. However as I said in my previous post hearing both sides of the story is always interesting helps paint the picture. This just begs for Atlas to be rolled, rolled again, and rolled again. Take your SJW nancy boy nonsense elsewhere, I hear you'd be welcome with arms wide open by their skirt wringing wussies at Mi-6. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peonage Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 Read the title and got excited. Finished reading through page 4 and now I don't know what to think! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shokkou Posted July 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 This just begs for Atlas to be rolled, rolled again, and rolled again. Take your SJW nancy boy nonsense elsewhere, I hear you'd be welcome with arms wide open by their skirt wringing wussies at Mi-6. Couldn't have said it better myself. Read the title and got excited. Finished reading through page 4 and now I don't know what to think! Understandable. I was expecting things to get on this track sooner or later, but it's always interesting to see what lengths people will go to to push their narrative. If you're here for MGS references, I can give you a synopsis of my perspective on what's going on at MI6: Pride feeds their blackened hearts and the thirst must be quenched to fuel hypocrisy. Cleansing flames is the only way to repent. Renounce what made you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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