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CNRP Reform Discussion


Centurius

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I really don't think we need to change squadron multipliers.  As I've seen it, aircraft numbers have never been an issue.  Also, the rule has pretty much been that if you are into categories, you stick with the lower one.  We should keep it that way. Plus, the only reason we had naval multipliers was to give a more realistic ratio of capital ships to support ships, so you may want to specify that cruisers, battleships, and carriers are excluded from those multipliers.

Edited by KaiserMelech Mikhail
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I really don't think we need to change squadron multipliers.  As I've seen it, aircraft numbers have never been an issue.  Also, the rule has pretty much been that if you are into categories, you stick with the lower one.  We should keep it that way. Plus, the only reason we had naval multipliers was to give a more realistic ratio of capital ships to support ships, so you may want to specify that cruisers, battleships, and carriers are excluded from those multipliers.

There are already squadron multipliers, as well as fighter generation substitution rules.

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Lowering the multiplier thresholds seems fair enough to me.  Also, a question.  Do multipliers apply to substituted assets as well?  Like say I substituted 10,000 troops for the 5 squadrons do I get 60 aircraft or 180 aircraft (due to the x3 aircraft multiplier I get). This isn't addressed by the published rules as far as I can see.

Edited by MostGloriousLeader
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Lowering the multiplier thresholds seems fair enough to me.  Also, a question.  Do multipliers apply to substituted assets as well?  Like say I substituted 10,000 troops for the 5 squadrons do I get 60 aircraft or 180 aircraft (due to the x3 aircraft multiplier I get). This isn't addressed by the published rules as far as I can see.

Multipliers have always been applied prior to substitutions. You get 60 aircraft in your example.

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I don't mind that thresholds are being lowered, I just think that they're being lowered to a stupidly low level.  Reaching the highest stage of something really should still be an achievement to work for, not something that everyone will get after a while.  Like we said, this isn't about making everyone equal, it's just about letting the smallest people have a slightly easier time.

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Lowering the multiplier thresholds seems fair enough to me.  Also, a question.  Do multipliers apply to substituted assets as well?  Like say I substituted 10,000 troops for the 5 squadrons do I get 60 aircraft or 180 aircraft (due to the x3 aircraft multiplier I get). This isn't addressed by the published rules as far as I can see.

 

As voodoo said that's multipliers of squadrons, not the multiplier for squadrons.

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As voodoo said that's multipliers of squadrons, not the multiplier for squadrons.

As far as I know, the aircraft formula is:

 

a = aig*x*y

 

a... Number of aircraft

aig...Number of potential ingame aircraft

x...Modifier, dependent on technology (6 if <500 tech; 12 if >500 tech)

y...Modifier, dependent on infrastructure and technology (in the proposal, 2 if >5,000 infra/1,000 tech; 3 if 5,000-6,000 infra/1,000-2,000 tech and 4 if >6,000 infra/2,000 tech)

 

So, a nation freshly created is at

 

50*6*2=600 aircraft

 

A nation at most gets

 

(50+25+20+10)*12*4=5,040 aircraft

 

Note that substitution multipliers come thereafter (for example 2 F-15s for 1 F-22).

 

In general on substitution, a nation first has to calculate the assets it is to have without substitutions. It then substitutes assets according to the substitution rules.

 

So, for example GLs current nation gives him, according to current rules:

  • 917,736 soldiers
  • 9,177 tanks
  • 3,780 aircraft
  • 45 corvettes
  • 35 frigates
  • 35 destroyers
  • 7 cruisers
  • 9 landing ships
  • 8 battleships
  • 6 carriers
  • 30 submarines

(As a note, I went with an assumption of what the fleet looks like, based on the ship number and nation built. He'd have to buy more ships ingame to have more ships ICly)

 

Let's assume he wants to swap 10,000 soldiers for aircraft. He gets 5 squadrons for that, which are 5x12=60 aircraft. Normal multipliers have already been applied before to calculate the forces he had prior to substitution, so he no further multiplier applies.

 

Except, if he were to use the generation substitution multiplier, which allows switching of 2 older generation aircraft for one newer generation. He could field 5th gen fighters, so if he decides, he rather uses F-15s, then he can use 120 F-15s. If he was to utilise something even older, like the F-4, it would end up as 240. The generation substitution multiplier is the sole multiplier that is applicable after substitution of assets.

 

For example, would he swap 9,800 soldiers for a Flight III Arleigh Burke-class destroyer, he'd be getting exactly one ship. Not 5, given there already was a standard x8 multiplier applied to calculate the soldier count. On the other hand, if he wants to exchange ships to soldiers, he can utilise all 35 destroyers to transform into soldiers, not just 7. These soldiers however also don't get multiplied (which would have been by 10, given the logic of citizens x8 is citizens x0.8 (maximum soldier count) x 10, but this is getting very theoretical).

 

To restate substitution ratios:

 

Force substitution:

 

10,000 soldiers = 10,000 metric tons of shipping = 500 tanks = 5 squadrons of aircraft

 

Generation substitution:

 

1 xth generation fighter = 2(x-1)th generation fighter

 

This only goes downwards. You can not get 1 F-35 for 2 F-15s, if you can't already build F-35s.

 

[hr]

 

Any further questions?

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First question will now be on lowering the ultipliers, second question will be to make it 12 aircraft per squadron flat. Any additions?

 

And my equation mostly is there as an explanation. It's not rule text. All rules I listed were either already in existence or suggested by Voodoo already in a different format.

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