no nonsense land taking - the discussion

[Hereno]

This is my idea for what's better than the 2 week/7 posts rule we have now.

You must make 3 posts for each region, and cannot make a second post until 72 hours has passed from the first. Thereafter, you have 2 more posts to make in at least 4 days of time. After a week, the land is yours on the map, unless it has been contested. This counts for protectorates and for annexations; although protectorates will never be on the map, they cannot be completely controlled without the same series of posts.

All rules not in conflict would continue to be enforced, including having to number them (and post them in the map thread, if you're annexing).

[Beauty]

I am amazed the people I claimed were land grabbers began land grabbing. I guess I still need proof though :/

 

Also I agree with your suggestion. I just wanted to throw a little immature "hue hue i was right" along with it.

[Voodoo Nova]

This is my idea for what's better than the 2 week/7 posts rule we have now.

You must make 3 posts for each region, and cannot make a second post until 72 hours has passed from the first. Thereafter, you have 2 more posts to make in at least 4 days of time. After a week, the land is yours on the map, unless it has been contested. This counts for protectorates and for annexations; although protectorates will never be on the map, they cannot be completely controlled without the same series of posts.

All rules not in conflict would continue to be enforced, including having to number them (and post them in the map thread, if you're annexing).

 

I'm perfectly happy with the 7 posts/2 week timeframe and don't think there should be a change in the system. In the interest of playing around with the idea, I've made some suggestions to it.

 

If a change has to be made, I don't feel there should be a time frame before you can make a 2nd post. If you wanted to go with a timeline like that, it should be something like this:

 

Post 1: Day 1

Post 2: Counted after 72 hours from Post 1.

Post 3: Counted after another 72 hours from Post 2.

 

This way, people can RP what they want, but posts won't "count" until they have been made after the minimum time has passed. It'll take a minimum of a week to complete this and should be done for all territory grabs.

[Maelstrom Vortex]

If I am a "land grabber" it is because I have been forced to be one. I didn't want India and still do not really want India. I would prefer Coloradia still be there. If I were really a "land grabber" I'd have just worked to try to claim all of India. That said, I have said in the map thread.. that while not a protectorate; I'm open to successor governments of the regions I have claimed to step forward so long as they work with me in the rp and I don't consider them a threat.

Edited July 30, 2014 by Maelstrom Vortex

[Mogar]

I don't really care for half of my claims as well, but since others are expanding I am forced to as well or else lose strategic positoning.

[Evangeline Anovilis]

If I am a "land grabber" it is because I have been forced to be one. I didn't want India and still do not really want India. I would prefer Coloradia still be there.

I know, that empty white space is too scary to just leave it there. Like, if you look too long at this big piece of void you may get existential fears.

 

I'm not going to complain about it much what you do in asia, but I really wonder what "forced" you.

[Maelstrom Vortex]

In RP, treaty obligations to the people of India, security concerns about such a large population on my border being unpredictable. Concerns about other powers operating in the region snatching up islands and land. As I've said.. anyone wants india, they need merely consult me.

[Kevin Kingswell]

I am a land grabber but I am a conqueror so what more can you expect?

[Hereno]

I'm perfectly happy with the 7 posts/2 week timeframe and don't think there should be a change in the system. In the interest of playing around with the idea, I've made some suggestions to it.
 
If a change has to be made, I don't feel there should be a time frame before you can make a 2nd post. If you wanted to go with a timeline like that, it should be something like this:
 
Post 1: Day 1
Post 2: Counted after 72 hours from Post 1.
Post 3: Counted after another 72 hours from Post 2.
 
This way, people can RP what they want, but posts won't "count" until they have been made after the minimum time has passed. It'll take a minimum of a week to complete this and should be done for all territory grabs.

The idea behind this rule is to make it so people can challenge land grabs IC even if they aren't here every single day ready to write. The delay is to be reasonable about that rather than letting someone really quickly move an entire army into an entire region or country overnight.

[PresidentDavid]

I am happy with the way it is.

[Maelstrom Vortex]

I personally think the current system works well.

[Kevin Kingswell]

I feel that I should have more land.

[Centurius]

While I dislike the system we have now this proposal is inferior. So I'll join the status quo group.

[Evangeline Anovilis]

In RP, treaty obligations to the people of India, security concerns about such a large population on my border being unpredictable. Concerns about other powers operating in the region snatching up islands and land. As I've said.. anyone wants india, they need merely consult me.

Establish a protectorate. Be done with it. Don't say you were "forced" to take it up, if all the force originates from you going down this route of RP.

[Maelstrom Vortex]

The reason I think a protectorate is inappropriate is the following.. and it's all reasoning based in RP.

 

The population ratio of India to my own is very large.

 

Without the indians helping provide the manpower base, it'd be difficult to realistically maintain such a protectorate due to both the cost and scope of population I need to manage. It's also why I divided it with the Persians. So in the RP I'm actually drawing manpower from the Indian Armed forces to help with the protectorate rather than magicking my 950,000 troops out of a smaller population base.  I'll accept criticism for being too concerend about the realism of my rp, but I won't accept "blame" for merely doing what I think is appropriate in the context of good rp.

 

Yes, RP factors.. and trying to be realistic about protecting india FORCED.. me to occupy it.. until someone else wants to raise a government there.

 

Given DruK Yul and India had good relations it makes sense the remaining military there would want to work with me given the Raj's apparent either assasination or kidnapping and the mysterious circumstances that would surround such a situation. This has turned into little more than ooc whining about my attempts at making sure my rp met higher standards than required.. so I depart this thread due to its nonsensical nature. I reserve the right to respond to further stupidity if needed.

Edited July 30, 2014 by Maelstrom Vortex

[Kevin Kingswell]

You could always give your part of India to the Russian Empire. 

[Evangeline Anovilis]

The reason I think a protectorate is inappropriate is the following.. and it's all reasoning based in RP.

 

The population ratio of India to my own is very large.

 

Without the indians helping provide the manpower base, it'd be difficult to realistically maintain such a protectorate due to both the cost and scope of population I need to manage. It's also why I divided it with the Persians. So in the RP I'm actually drawing manpower from the Indian Armed forces to help with the protectorate rather than magicking my 950,000 troops out of a smaller population base.  I'll accept criticism for being too concerend about the realism of my rp, but I won't accept "blame" for merely doing what I think is appropriate in the context of good rp.

 

Yes, RP factors.. and trying to be realistic about protecting india FORCED.. me to occupy it.. until someone else wants to raise a government there.

 

Given DruK Yul and India had good relations it makes sense the remaining military there would want to work with me given the Raj's apparent either assasination or kidnapping and the mysterious circumstances that would surround such a situation. This has turned into little more than ooc whining about my attempts at making sure my rp met higher standards than required.. so I depart this thread due to its nonsensical nature. I reserve the right to respond to further stupidity if needed.

Well, the British managed to do just fine with just the EIC for quite some time. Don't see your issue.

[Lynneth]

Kev, please don't go off-topic in this discussion.

 

That said, I for one prefer the status quo. It's a bit more effort, but I've seen some good stuff come from most people, and that's good.

[Maelstrom Vortex]

Well, the British managed to do just fine with just the EIC for quite some time. Don't see your issue.

 

My issue is that despite the fact I am attempting greater realism.. up until lately.. cnrp has been a bit more insane than the real world in terms of how it fights wars. See Zoots rolling of the Hereno for example... Out of nowhere.. not the best cb.

 

But in light of Putin, I'd say based on reality even my concerns are legitimate :P RL is being more like cnrp daily (This concerns me greatly.).

Edited July 30, 2014 by Maelstrom Vortex

[Evangeline Anovilis]

 

My issue is that despite the fact I am attempting greater realism.. up until lately.. cnrp has been a bit more insane than the real world in terms of how it fights wars. See Zoots rolling of the Hereno for example... Out of nowhere.. not the best cb.

And for this reason you needed to annex it, not just protect?

 

But in light of Putin, I'd say based on reality even my concerns are legitimate :P RL is being more like cnrp daily (This concerns me greatly.).

To some, reality was like this for a long time. Just some people forgot it.

 

And I think there still is some good distance between this RP and reality. Most likely, because reality has serious consequences and no rerolling.

[Maelstrom Vortex]

And for this reason you needed to annex it, not just protect?

Taxes and recruitment to support the protection of the region. I just don't believe some regions are realistically appropriate for protectorates. If the population is to high and the land area to great then without an adequate underpinning it's going to be better to annex other wise you have a tiny nation with a smaller population managing a huge nation with a massive population and that traditionally doesn't work well.
 

To some, reality was like this for a long time. Just some people forgot it.
 
And I think there still is some good distance between this RP and reality. Most likely, because reality has serious consequences and no rerolling.

Yup, at least in rl they're not tossing nukes like candy yet. Edited July 30, 2014 by Maelstrom Vortex

[Mr Director]

Just as an FYI, Maelstrom, you can tax and exploit your protectorates. At least, I've managed to do it in Poland and nobody has complained.

[Maelstrom Vortex]

I traditionally have not, I guess the function of protectorates may need better defined or just naturally vary from player to player. If I'm taxing and deriving value from it and the area is not retaining that for its own governance, I conisder that to be a governmental occupation, not mere protection.

[Evangeline Anovilis]

I traditionally have not, I guess the function of protectorates may need better defined or just naturally vary from player to player. If I'm taxing and deriving value from it and the area is not retaining that for its own governance, I conisder that to be a governmental occupation, not mere protection.

What you RP in your protectorate is yours to decide. If you tax them, your choice. There needs not be more of a "definition".

[Captain Enema]

Is the current system being properly used?