Declaration of war

[paul711]

I'm not trying at all, I was just wondering why you have to use rogues to try and justify your argument against us. Is it our fault that they rogued you?

Because of your past relationship with the people behind the rogues. Are you that dense?

[Daenerys Targaryen]

Because of your past relationship with the people behind the rogues. Are you that dense?

 

Is it our fault they rouged you?

[Rayvon]

Thanks for wasting so much of your time and effort showing your inaccurate stats because here are Hellas actual stats taken on the 26th around 11:00 PM:
 
Jamie Lanister of Kings Landing
3,499.99
200 tech
10 nukes
SDI
Pent
50% spy odds
65 navy
0 air craft
(153,442) sold eff
NS 17,472.926
 
Tintin of Potemkin Crew
3,999.64
418.14
2 nukes
SDI
Pent
70% spy odds
21 navy
47 air craft
(14,627) sold eff
NS 19,005.103
 
Alexandros o Megas of Macedonia
2,799.99
342.55 tech
9 nukes
50% spy odds
43 navy
80 air craft
(69,862) sold eff
NS 17,803.574
 
Eljierro of Vergadentro - 10,468.762
 
2,299.99
416.85 tech
9 nukes
HNMS
70% spy odds out of my reach to spy.
0 navy
0 air craft
(9,712) sold eff
NS 10,468.762
 
JeremyNat of Dimitroupolis
 
1,899.99
260.63
28 navy
1 air craft
(7,128) sold eff
 
NS 9,020.716
 
jackcousteau of Ellas
 
I only grabbed NS stats for this one as I wasn't even going to blitz jackcousteau and our 5th guy (smoke14me of LibertyNation) was never going to fight either, unless jack did want to have some fun with a nation close in NS. He was actually added last minute and replaced a couple of rogues with 10+ k NS but others were keeping them too busy and took too many of their defensive slots.
 
NS: 4,722.308
 
Total NS: 78,493.389
 
Not 64,500, this is a made up stat your trying to pass as the actual stat.
 
You've also exaggerated ours by using our stats after the blitz when many of us built a ton of cash that added more NS ,and it seems all you've done is take the stats from DoW and have made the rest up, you're trying way too hard!

lol - made up?

Look at the nation charts. I didn't "make up" anything, I READ THE SCREEN. Holy Admin "made up" those stats.



You can see day by day what their final was ..

I used the July 26 stats for you guys too - so you can stuff that 'exaggerated after the blitz' line where the air ain't clean .. NS was the only thing I added to your OP stats also .. I tried oh so damn hard for that ... Didn't I? Edited July 31, 2014 by Rayvon

[Daenerys Targaryen]

lol - made up?

Look at the nation charts. I didn't "make up" anything, I READ THE SCREEN. Holy Admin "made up" those stats.

Mine were taken from the nation charts so yes, you made yours up.

 

Even your own friend had Hellas correct stats: http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?/topic/123200-declaration-of-war/?p=3288187

 

 So my stats, your friends stats and admins nation charts are wrong or is it just yours that are wrong? I assume you'll need a lot of time to think about that so do take your time and come back when you're ready to admit your stats are wrong.

Edited July 31, 2014 by Daenerys Targaryen

[Rayvon]

Mine were taken from the nation charts so yes, you made yours up.

Mhmmmmm ... Ok ...

Go take a look at July 26 on all those charts ... Show me which one's I was wrong on .... Show me what I made up ...


Fake edit: inb4 "I don't care enough"

[Daenerys Targaryen]

Mhmmmmm ... Ok ...

Go take a look at July 26 on all those charts ... Show me which one's I was wrong on .... Show me what I made up ...


Fake edit: inb4 "I don't care enough"

The chart is accurate with Eljierro of Vergadentro at 10,469 NS but yours were 9,009 NS.

 

And no, I don't need to go and look at any charts, its you who does. I already know mine are all right.

Edited July 31, 2014 by Daenerys Targaryen

[Rayvon]

Vergadentro is the only one I quoted wrong, I quoted the charted July 27 NS instead of July 26's by mistake .. Either way, the numbers are on the charts - not "made up" as you allege ..

[Daenerys Targaryen]

Vergadentro is the only one I quoted wrong, I quoted the charted July 27 NS instead of July 26's by mistake .. Either way, the numbers are on the charts - not "made up" as you allege ..

Nice try trying to use post blitz stats to undermine our DoW.

[John More Dread]

Also I don't care about your opinion. :D Come back with some stats proving it was a down declare. Just because i gave them peace doesn't mean i recognized it was a down declare. Some might call it mercy, and some might just want to find an opponent that fights back with more than just nukes, after all we are playing a war game.

 

Also, I still have every stat on every nation before that war, do you?

 

Its funny that you could only find one stat that was evenly matched in the DoW. That alone proves you have no idea what you're talking about because if you'd read the DoW properly, you'd have found the nation count was also evenly matched at 6 per side, the total alliance nuke counts were practically evenly matched at 28 and 30, but our nuke count was slashed in half if you only counted the Misfits involved , the tech was practically evenly matched .

 

The gap came mainly from Hellas lack of aircraft, navy, tanks and soldiers. For example, Jamie lannister, Eljierro and JeremyNat all had 0 aircraft. I guess we should have had 3 of our nations decom all aircraft, half of our navies and most of our tanks/soldiers before we attacked because this is what would have been required for us to do if we wanted the stats to be perfectly equal. If we'd known their war chest levels, we'd have never considered them as a target but I assumed 1 month without war would have given them a decent sized chest. Anyone else would have most likely have kept stomping them and claimed it as an official war but we haven't. This seems to be something you choose to miss but it does show your ignorance. The war is irrelevant now.

This is simply not true. You only counted a very small portion of your alliance, the portion you wanted involved and knew to be active, knowing you had others to back you up if necessary. To say your stats are even, would be like muhammud ali fighting Steve Urkle, but tying one hand behind his back and only weighing one arm before the fight to determine his weight class.

[Rayvon]

OH MY EFFIN GAWD !! MY MISTAKE !!

I undermined your blitz by 1460 NS .. That means I should have quoted their NS at 65,960 compared to your 102,952 instead of the 64,500 I did ..

A huge, massive error of astronomical proportions ...

[StevieG]

If you love each other so much, just fight it out ;)

 

You guys in TEPD declared on Skaro for your first war last round :P You dont have a right to lecture people.

 

John, you declared on 0 nuke capable nations this entire round. You shouldnt be talking either.

[TBRaiders]

I'm not trying at all, I was just wondering why you have to use rogues to try and justify your argument against us. Is it our fault that they rogued you?

 

I didn't bail on the AA and had fun owning all of those rogues.  I got great XP from it and gained a lot of land.  I wasn't even actively playing and would have continued to ignore it (was a collection temp trader) but they hit me, which motivated me to be a lot more active this round.

 

If you love each other so much, just fight it out ;)

 

You guys in TEPD declared on Skaro for your first war last round :P You dont have a right to lecture people.

 

John, you declared on 0 nuke capable nations this entire round. You shouldnt be talking either.

 

I didn't realize they were so easy until after we hit them, but we hit RE as well.  We also declared a great war for our second war, but some crybaby couldn't get past it and brought drama to the rest of the round.

[John More Dread]

 Does it upset you we made an evenly matched war and hit Hellas?

It's interesting how you present a belief that few here seem to share (evenly matched war) as if we all tacitly accepted it. No. It bothers them that you launched a one-sided, unbalanced war against Hellas, which appears to be the consensus. You can make the argument that it wasn't one sided, but to act like it has been established to the satisfaction of your audience shows foolishness, close-mindedness, and just a little narcissism. It also shows an utter lack of respect for the beliefs and opinions of others. It won't convince a single individual you're right, but it may convince a few you're wrong and trying to manipulate the conversation.

 

Again, I actually don't care that you downdeclared on the misfits because people in a nation sim should find in-character ways to deal with rabidly aggressive powers and macroscopic schoolyard bullies, and because those are perfectly acceptable things to roleplay. What I find distasteful is your out of character dishonesty, and your continued commitment to an actual lie after having been called out by multiple people from multiple alliances who are not involved, some of which are currently at odds with each other. Either you have a real problem with human interaction that goes beyond CN and can be found in DSM manuals, or for whatever reason you truly believe that by emphasis or repetition you can somehow force the people calling you out to take your side. I am curious if this second statement is the case,  because if not I cannot think of any explanation for your behaviour other than the first, and this would be the case even if your lie was true, because angry repetition would be no better of a coping mechanism to deal with people not believing you if you weren't a liar.

[Daenerys Targaryen]

This is simply not true. You only counted a very small portion of your alliance, the portion you wanted involved and knew to be active, knowing you had others to back you up if necessary. To say your stats are even, would be like muhammud ali fighting Steve Urkle, but tying one hand behind his back and only weighing one arm before the fight to determine his weight class..

 

 

OH MY EFFIN GAWD !! MY MISTAKE !!

I undermined your blitz by 1460 NS .. That means I should have quoted their NS at 65,960 compared to your 102,952 instead of the 64,500 I did ..

A huge, massive error of astronomical proportions ...

Wrong, you should have quoted Hellas total NS at 78,493.389.

 

You've also quoted our post blitz NS after we dropped more NS on our nations. For example, you quoted my peak NS after I bought 300 infra, x8 navy ships, x1 nuke, x20 aircraft, max tanks. I have the stats but i'll have to filter a lot of details out but i think i've wasted enough time already on this simply because your desperate to undermined our now irrelevant DoW. You won't catch me trying so hard to dissect your DoW because i just don't care  enough and I'd rather put my efforts out on the battlefield. :gun:

 

E-lawyers bringing knifes to a gun fight. ^_^

[Rayvon]

With the mistaken exception of Vergadentro, I used all July 26 stats .............. You declared on July 27 ............. What sort of timewarp are you living in that July 26 stats are post-blitz?

[John More Dread]

 

 

John, you declared on 0 nuke capable nations this entire round. You shouldnt be talking either.

Again, I HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH DOWNDECLARES. This is a nation sim not a tea party or arena duel. If the US invaded North Korea, some might object, but not because it's a "downdeclare". I read an article in the Atlantic that said "If Iraq were a 9 month old baby the USA would be a 250 pound man" and even though I opposed the war, I thought it was the stupidest argument against a war I had ever heard, since in politics, arranging a "fair" war means increased suffering for both sides. My problem was with a downdeclare being represented as an updeclare.

 

I have every right to talk about what I am criticizing, since I am not a lying liar who lies.

 

For the record, I declared against every nation I was asked for help with, since I am more interested in helping my AA than looking like a tough guy on the internet or even winning, and I pulled two nukes per day from nations I wasn't at war with. (Yes,arcticali, that was me.). Incidentally, I was non nuclear early in the round and fought wars in which I was nuked.

 

But had I just been randomly declaring against weak nations to strengthen my own, I would argue that there is nothing wrong with that as well. But I would also admit to doing it.

 

 

So, guess what! Daenarys, watch and learn.....

 

I declared wars against lower NS nations than myself! AAAAAAAANDDDD I started deliberately unfair wars in order to force those doing damage to my AA mates to surrender!

 

See, it's not that hard to acknowledge reality, even when acknowledging that reality will not win you the community approval you seem to desire so intensely, and seem to feel you can get by angrily demanding the community accept your (lie or fantasy)

 

-Waits for three random arbitrary war declarations-

 

AGAIN, DAENARYS, you cannot in fairness just count the Misfits nations you want to count, since you would have picked the most active and effective AA members to put against all of Misfits, active and less active. As presented in the metaphor above, if your fist weighs as much as my body, you can't even out the fight by promising only to use that fist. What if DEFCON or WD went to war w Misfits, but only used 15 nations that were active at update daily and just slightly larger than yours? And quad blitzed you after building to almost twice your size? Would that be a fair fight?

 

Also, please change the nation listed as your TE nation in your bio as New Valyria does not exist.

Edited July 31, 2014 by John More Dread

[Daenerys Targaryen]

 

I didn't bail on the AA and had fun owning all of those rogues.  I got great XP from it and gained a lot of land.  I wasn't even actively playing and would have continued to ignore it (was a collection temp trader) but they hit me, which motivated me to be a lot more active this round.

 

 

I didn't realize they were so easy until after we hit them, but we hit RE as well.  We also declared a great war for our second war, but some crybaby couldn't get past it and brought drama to the rest of the round.

I knew you wouldn't bail and I'd have enjoyed the rogues too for the XP and i didn't get XP til a few days before the OP war because i was expecting us too get hit earlier and i was to busy at the beginning of the round to raid. The rogues would have motivated me to get the XP and actually helped me grow faster too.

 

I guess some people are always reliant on others to protect them, they forget you must protect yourself at all times.

 

TEPD/TPC hit RE/Skaro and RE hit TPC on the same day of last round this round too. I felt bad for RE because i know Skaro weren't going to be much help so it was basically RE vs TEPD/TPC. Everyone knows what Skaro are, they're a newbie alliance and everyone that hits them are just looking for an easy war so they can get a growth advantage. Minimal damage and XP, we don't have to play dumb every time one of these so called "elite" alliances hits them at the start of every round. They're basically taken advantage of and bullied by the school yard bullies because they don't want to pick on someone their own size until they have the advantages. But if you play this game then your a legitimate target for war, its more a moral thing. Some of us actually care about the newbies and keeping their games as fair as possible otherwise they'll quit playing.

[Daenerys Targaryen]

With the mistaken exception of Vergadentro, I used all July 26 stats .............. You declared on July 27 ............. What sort of timewarp are you living in that July 26 stats are post-blitz?

Wars were declared on the 26th not 27th. Seriously, just give up and save yourself further embarrassment.

[Daenerys Targaryen]

It's interesting how you present a belief that few here seem to share (evenly matched war) as if we all tacitly accepted it. No. It bothers them that you launched a one-sided, unbalanced war against Hellas, which appears to be the consensus. You can make the argument that it wasn't one sided, but to act like it has been established to the satisfaction of your audience shows foolishness, close-mindedness, and just a little narcissism. It also shows an utter lack of respect for the beliefs and opinions of others. It won't convince a single individual you're right, but it may convince a few you're wrong and trying to manipulate the conversation.

 

Again, I actually don't care that you downdeclared on the misfits because people in a nation sim should find in-character ways to deal with rabidly aggressive powers and macroscopic schoolyard bullies, and because those are perfectly acceptable things to roleplay. What I find distasteful is your out of character dishonesty, and your continued commitment to an actual lie after having been called out by multiple people from multiple alliances who are not involved, some of which are currently at odds with each other. Either you have a real problem with human interaction that goes beyond CN and can be found in DSM manuals, or for whatever reason you truly believe that by emphasis or repetition you can somehow force the people calling you out to take your side. I am curious if this second statement is the case,  because if not I cannot think of any explanation for your behaviour other than the first, and this would be the case even if your lie was true, because angry repetition would be no better of a coping mechanism to deal with people not believing you if you weren't a liar.

You're actually a good front man for them. I just skim over your post because you have no idea what your talking about and whats the point really? If you want my answers then go back and read all my comments, you should find my answers to your questions in them. 

[Daenerys Targaryen]

If you love each other so much, just fight it out ;)

 

You guys in TEPD declared on Skaro for your first war last round :P You dont have a right to lecture people.

 

John, you declared on 0 nuke capable nations this entire round. You shouldnt be talking either.

The irony, i know :facepalm: Its worth a few good laughs though. :D

[Daenerys Targaryen]

Again, I HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH DOWNDECLARES. This is a nation sim not a tea party or arena duel. If the US invaded North Korea, some might object, but not because it's a "downdeclare". I read an article in the Atlantic that said "If Iraq were a 9 month old baby the USA would be a 250 pound man" and even though I opposed the war, I thought it was the stupidest argument against a war I had ever heard, since in politics, arranging a "fair" war means increased suffering for both sides. My problem was with a downdeclare being represented as an updeclare.

 

I have every right to talk about what I am criticizing, since I am not a lying liar who lies.

 

For the record, I declared against every nation I was asked for help with, since I am more interested in helping my AA than looking like a tough guy on the internet or even winning, and I pulled two nukes per day from nations I wasn't at war with. (Yes,arcticali, that was me.). Incidentally, I was non nuclear early in the round and fought wars in which I was nuked.

 

But had I just been randomly declaring against weak nations to strengthen my own, I would argue that there is nothing wrong with that as well. But I would also admit to doing it.

 

 

So, guess what! Daenarys, watch and learn.....

 

I declared wars against lower NS nations than myself! AAAAAAAANDDDD I started deliberately unfair wars in order to force those doing damage to my AA mates to surrender!

 

See, it's not that hard to acknowledge reality, even when acknowledging that reality will not win you the community approval you seem to desire so intensely, and seem to feel you can get by angrily demanding the community accept your (lie or fantasy)

 

-Waits for three random arbitrary war declarations-

 

AGAIN, DAENARYS, you cannot in fairness just count the Misfits nations you want to count, since you would have picked the most active and effective AA members to put against all of Misfits, active and less active. As presented in the metaphor above, if your fist weighs as much as my body, you can't even out the fight by promising only to use that fist. What if DEFCON or WD went to war w Misfits, but only used 15 nations that were active at update daily and just slightly larger than yours? And quad blitzed you after building to almost twice your size? Would that be a fair fight?

 

Also, please change the nation listed as your TE nation in your bio as New Valyria does not exist.

Thanks for reminding me about the nation bio. :)

 

Our extra NS mostly came from our militarization build up but everything else was pretty evenly matched. One of our guys even went over the numbers.

 

Hellas:
(3,499.99 + 3,999.64 + 2,799.99 + 2,299.99 + 1899,99) * 3 + (200 + 418.14 + 342.55 + 416.85 + 260.63) * 5 = 14,499.6 *3 + 1638.17 * 5 = 43,498.8 + 8190.85 = 51,689.65

Misfits:
(2,599.99 + 3,499.99 + 3,869.99 + 2,259.99 + 2,481.41) * 3 + (500 + 259.56 + 258.94 + 500 + 376.67) * 5 = 14711,37 * 3 + 1895,17 * 5 = 44,134.11 + 9,475.85 = 53,609.96

 

Hellas: Infra NS + tech NS = 51,689.65

Misfits: Infta NS + tech NS = 53,609.96

 

On average per nation we had a:

42.35 infra and a 51.4 tech advantage.

 

To: Daenerys Targaryen    From: IzaMoss    Date: 7/31/2014 2:49:08 AM

Subject: RE: Your targets

 

Message: Basic nation stats wise we did a almost 2k NS downdeclare on a 5vs5 war ... we should go commit Sudoku as we have shamed our families.

(yes, I know Sudoku's the number game and not the self-inflicted sword through belly thing)

 

 

 

:lol1:  And for the last time, i didn't pick anyone, those representing Misfits were based on whoever could make the update. Besides, if i was to pick our nations, isn't that what you should be doing anyway, picking the most active and effective AA members? IMO, that just shows competence in leadership. This is war, not a boxing fight and this is TE war, everyone takes advantage of using the blitz. And are you saying we should never have blitzed them and let them know we were going to attack them? That would have been fairer but again, this is TE not a boxing ring with a ref and start bell.

[StevieG]

 

I didn't bail on the AA and had fun owning all of those rogues.  I got great XP from it and gained a lot of land.  I wasn't even actively playing and would have continued to ignore it (was a collection temp trader) but they hit me, which motivated me to be a lot more active this round.

 

 

I didn't realize they were so easy until after we hit them, but we hit RE as well.  We also declared a great war for our second war, but some crybaby couldn't get past it and brought drama to the rest of the round.

You and TPC vs RE and Skaro, with RE hitting TPC means it is essentially RE vs TPC and TEPD vs Skaro plus nations in RE that you hit. You like to keep playing the "I dun know Skaro were so bad dude" card, when you were around the prior rounds with their rather amusing beginnings.

 

You also pulled a cheap, obvious flag running stunt, hitting me almost a full day before your war. You were the aggressor, you brought the drama. But please Mr. we dont flag run, go on and explain why 3 of your nations left TEPD for war doves this round for a greater chance at a prize.

[Daenerys Targaryen]

You and TPC vs RE and Skaro, with RE hitting TPC means it is essentially RE vs TPC and TEPD vs Skaro plus nations in RE that you hit. You like to keep playing the "I dun know Skaro were so bad dude" card, when you were around the prior rounds with their rather amusing beginnings.

 

You also pulled a cheap, obvious flag running stunt, hitting me almost a full day before your war. You were the aggressor, you brought the drama. But please Mr. we dont flag run, go on and explain why 3 of your nations left TEPD for war doves this round for a greater chance at a prize.

They're also essential taking the WD's members flags who've been with them since the start too if they do win them and because of their alliance size, they are easily favorites to take them. How generous of the Doves to let flag runners join your aa and help them win the flags they only play for.

[StevieG]

They're also essential taking the WD's members flags who've been with them since the start too if they do win them and because of their alliance size, they are easily favorites to take them. How generous of the Doves to let flag runners join your aa and help them win the flags they only play for.

I wouldnt go that far ;)

[Auctor]

Stevie G accusing others of flag running is like a fat kid accusing others of liking cake.