Faraway's Future

[Mogar]

I made literally a single IC statement towards Triyun in the entirety of The Cape's existence, which was questioning why China is annexing Great Britain, after it was clarified it would be "another nation" I said good luck to the new government. I generally have only made OOC comments but that was taken as Triyun crying to Sargun about me attacking him, evidently IC bullying is acceptable, OOC pointing it out is not.

[KaiserMelech Mikhail]

And if you'll remember, Triyun didn't invade you in Africa.

Also, Eva, you should take the remainder of Eastern Russia.

[Hereno]

For all the "CNRP is not risk", CNRP also is not monopoly. If you want to play monopoly, go and play that. But this is CNRP. And for all intents and purposes, it isn't a pyramid scheme, nor is it seniority based. If it was, I'd actually be still ranking somewhere around the bottom, for most people are older than me. Yet, I would dare claim that compared to people like Lynneth, I was actually in a better position, up to the point where he left. Why? Because Lynneth mostly sat around, concentrated on space and decided to entrust his security to a strategy of low profile and deterrence through quantity (I think Lynneth will readily admit that he is not going to behave very competently at war). And while this may safe you trouble, it's not going to give you much power. Deliberate choice of his though to prioritise space over international influence and I'm not going to say he made the wrong decision. As long as he's not going to complain about it later.
 
As Justinian said, you people have not even tried. The last time we actually saw actual resistence that was somewhat determined, it was the AUP (before it disintegrated faster than a snowman in the Sahara) and Kankou. That was how long ago? 1.5 years? Ever since, noone bothered, but at least half a dozen complain openly or in silence about an issue they see, that they do nothing about. And no, founding a new RP doesn't count. You have not tried to overthrow anyone, so don't complain that noone tries.
 
I'm not an ally, for all that it is worth. Sure, I'm not going to join some weird quest to overthrow Demon Lord Triyun, just because someone comes along and asks me to, but I think you shouldn't expect that. Noone sells themselves cheap for something like this.
 
Simply by playing you aren't a target. By deliberately being silly an annoying you make yourself a target. I'd think the three reasons the Cape died for is that a. You complained about the actions of Triyun and Cent before, so they thought they'd show you what happens when they don't act. b. You did stand out quite a bit for a person that only wants to be left alone. You know, Faraway came about, because after getting occupied by Cent in France, I wanted to be left alone. And it worked, because I kept a low profile. Negotiated with those like PD or MGL, who then shared the low-profile approach and I did not try to partake in international politics and bickering. In the end, I never got attacked by Triyun and Cent once. Same goes for Lynneth in Tikal, who kept a low profile. c. Your diplomacy completely neglected your national security, by neither having ties, nor army, but relying on some fancy statement that you'd cause ingame trouble. If you stand out, make something of it.
 
In the end, it needs not much to see that for all the claims about just wanting to be left alone, people will just use "I want to be left alone", to cover up a severe lack of spine, but will then proceed to whine behind the scenes about how marginalised they are and how they lose out. Yeah, well, if you play the Game of Thrones, you win or you die. There are risks to trying to matter. There are not so many risks to trying to merely blend in. But by blending in, you will not matter. There is no influence without risk. To state such could be possible is just wrong and it isn't even true for CNRP2, where all the isolationists turn into grandstanding imperialists and hegemons, because for once, they think they can afford the risk. But if you lose, you might still get your fair share of issues.
 
 
First, I did wonder where to go once I reroll. I had some ideas, but mostly I'm tending towards either going to Europe or to Asia. I'm still taking suggestions.
 
Second, true on the ragequit part. Honestly, people accuse Triyun of rolling people out of existence and complain for too often about losing everything. and then they just quit or go inactive when they get into a conflict. The most annoying experience in this regard to me was surely South america, where this happened thrice. And instead of a short nuclear disarmament of Bolivia, I suddenly had two colonies.

No, I'm not going to "try" touching the burner. I know that when it's red, I'm going to get burned, and no amount of taunting is going to make me do something like that for someone else's enjoyment.

[Evangeline Anovilis]

MGL is directly allied to TSI, Horo is, Markus is a troll nation, and Yawoo is inactive, the problem is TSI wants to be taken down, instead of just leaving people alone and allowing people to RP as they wish so long as they are not committing atrocities, and if someone bigger is bullying said people, ignore it, instead of taking the fight that triyun seems to desperately want, just not a hard fight.

 

so basically eva i should suck triyun and cent's dicks for being overlords, instead of being honest with them and saying i take great issue with their style of bullying weaker opponents and avoiding the hard conflicts.

You don't need to be necessarily nice. If you are nice, fine. If not, better to just not interact. First Faraway has for its entire existence seen Tianxia and Athens as the main external threats. I doubt anyone would say I was on good terms with Triyun and Cent. Faraway still has only lackluster relations. I did keep for myself colour-coded war plans, for contingencies, which were reworked two times and were almost enacted two times, first when a war with Germany was to happen, second, when North american committment to Shammy almost dragged Tanis, MGL and me into a war with TSI over noone less than Rota, who went retarded and was then just abandonned. But I still know, America had Shammy's back and we were committed to help him in South Africa.

 

Now, that's a bit of a lesson for two things: First, if you are genuinely quiet, you actually get ignored. Second, Triyun and Cent are not always completely unopposed. Had Rota not gone retarded as Rota always does, who knows what would have happened back in the day. To me, the experience showed, the issue with coalitions is most of all, that many people have no clue how to build them and how to conduct prudent diplomacy. Rota got rolled due to making a coalition with Aggron and Greywall, which Triyun then stomped in. Theirs was an utter failure. They contacted just about everyone, lied about the support they pretented to have received, I'd say, it was quite incompetent and unreliable (sorry guys, but learn from your mistakes at least). Shammy meanwhile had been engineering ties with North America for quite a while, ICly, building on good relations and trust. And he could witness that Tanis, MGL and I were not going to bail out on him (and he not on us). This quadruple alliance was pretty solid, did have quite some strength (at least 2-3 million soldiers) and it served also a mutual interest, by allowing both North america and Shammy to be more independent, at a time when trust in TSI was pretty low.

 

There are different types of people.  People who enjoy the challenge of a competitive environment and people who just want to make it about themselves.  Its not even worth trying to reason between the two anymore half the time because it just turns into me me me.  But Mogar, you'll note I didn't role you in Thailand, so your argument is pretty flawed imo, as much as I do know you WANT to be the center of the Triyun Opposition.

I shall never forget Kankou, the best leader the resistence ever had, though support for her was lackluster.

 

No, I'm not going to "try" touching the burner. I know that when it's red, I'm going to get burned, and no amount of taunting is going to make me do something like that for someone else's enjoyment.

Then don't complain that you won't matter. Influence comes with risks, as ambition comes with competition.

 

And if you'll remember, Triyun didn't invade you in Africa.

Also, Eva, you should take the remainder of Eastern Russia.

Primorsk?

[Mogar]

And if you'll remember, Triyun didn't invade you in Africa.

Also, Eva, you should take the remainder of Eastern Russia.

I also remember the ignoring of my invasion and the numerous requests by member states of the UN of the UN to do something cost that little organization just about all of its members, and proved that IC doesn't actually matter, all that matters is kissing ass OOCly, you can get genocided and nobody's gonna do anything about it if they don't like you OOC, but your neighbor sneezes wrong and you get UN intervention otherwise.

[KaiserMelech Mikhail]

Primorsk?

And the Khabarovsk Krai South and East of the Amur River. This pretty much gives you the best land in the Russian Far East, with the two largest cities (Khabarovsk and Vladivostok), almost all the air bases in the region, the naval base for the surface ships of the Pacific Fleet, and all the major ports on the Pacific including ones that are ice free all year.

[PresidentDavid]

There are different types of people.  People who enjoy the challenge of a competitive environment and people who just want to make it about themselves.  Its not even worth trying to reason between the two anymore half the time because it just turns into me me me.  But Mogar, you'll note I didn't role you in Thailand, so your argument is pretty flawed imo, as much as I do know you WANT to be the center of the Triyun Opposition.

 

It's a Roleplay.... Of course I want to make it about myself unless I invite someone else to join :v

[Evangeline Anovilis]

And the Khabarovsk Krai South and East of the Amur River. This pretty much gives you the best land in the Russian Far East, with the two largest cities (Khabarovsk and Vladivostok), almost all the air bases in the region, the naval base for the surface ships of the Pacific Fleet, and all the major ports on the Pacific including ones that are ice free all year.

Well, my issues with joining Russia is most of all, that I don't like getting nuked much.

[KaiserMelech Mikhail]

Well, my issues with joining Russia is most of all, that I don't like getting nuked much.

I think that was a one-time, one-person thing.

[Hereno]

 
Then don't complain that you won't matter. Influence comes with risks, as ambition comes with competition.

I didn't complain, I simply just don't play it. That's my point, lol

[Uberstein]

Gotta love the "everything is fine if you keep your head down and keep your mouth shut" attitude. Sounds like an abusive relationship. Mom's alcoholism never was a problem unless she noticed us, so what are we complaining about? Surely we should just keep quiet and pray she doesn't take offense to being ignored as well.

At the end of day, we've seen the results. CNRP is significantly less active, and the main people arguing for it are Eva, Melech, and Justinian (if you count throwing insults as an argument).

The vast majority seems happy to play in CNRP2. The facts speak for themselves.

[Triyun]

I want to be able to RP a cyberpunk city, or Japan, but considering you refused to even give me Singapore, I was forced into the cape, and got rolled for it due to Cent refusing to do diplomacy with me, I have made attempts at reconcilation with you, but you enjoy trolling and harassing me, so any attempt is doomed to failure from the start, you are absolutely a great player at competition, but that's the thing, you've won, is it that difficult to admit it and actually allow a challenger to arise, or are you going to continue a stranglehold on power that has killed CNRP1?

 

Singapore is the center of refining middle eastern fuel in East Asia, a major Sino-city, my first major expansion site and home to the most powerful fortress in Asia, and the most important strategic point in the Indo-Pacific.  OF COURSE I'm not going to give anyone Singapore, that'd be like telling America to give up Hawaii.  Judging me by that standard is insane.

[Triyun]

 

It's a Roleplay.... Of course I want to make it about myself unless I invite someone else to join :v

 

That's fiction writing, role play is a community.  I really don't take it personally if anyone wants something I want, I just resolve it IC.  That's sort of my view of it.  Its fine for people to want and go for the same thing, you just need to remember its a communal game not a piece of fiction.  If two people want the same thing may the best man (or woman) win and learn.  One of the things I've always felt is hat facing challenges makes you a better player because it forces you to think.  

 

If you want to RP completely solo that's fine though, not interact with anyone etc.  Where I do get annoyed though (and this is not with claiming land but more with how people RP) is when I see them say want to interact with someone half their size, and try to cow them into submission, but whine about bullying when a big nation comes along.  RP with everyone.   

[Mogar]

 

Singapore is the center of refining middle eastern fuel in East Asia, a major Sino-city, my first major expansion site and home to the most powerful fortress in Asia, and the most important strategic point in the Indo-Pacific.  OF COURSE I'm not going to give anyone Singapore, that'd be like telling America to give up Hawaii.  Judging me by that standard is insane.

but see, why is it that you believe you deserve to have 3/4th of the world, and then wonder why people no longer wish to play in said world? if you were more forthcoming with the spots people actually wanted,(this goes more for Cent and MGL,) then I doubt CNRP would have died as rapidly as it did, I personally would have rolled into Japan in RP1(and might even have actually continued RPing as Siam if it didn't require being your puppet and having to name my ships after animes simply because you don't like me OOCly and were looking for an excuse to roll me like you tried with eva.

 

You value your own RP as more important than anyone else's, and that is where the disagreement between you and I comes from, it's great that you are so awesome at military tactics, but you are saying we should all be happy to lose to you over and over and over and over, and anything we actually do right to counter you, you also get to improve your technology to prevent us from using that same strategy. So essentially the only way to win would be to pry Cent from you, which, quite honestly is far too much effort when I can RP exactly what I want in CNRP2 and not be threatened by you destroying me because you got bored that week.

 

You need interaction for a RP like this to succeed, give people a reason to actually interact besides simply keeping themselves alive in CNRP1 and perhaps you'd have more activity, but since the only interactions are war, why bother if I don't like war RP?

Edited July 26, 2014 by Mogar

[Evangeline Anovilis]

I didn't complain, I simply just don't play it. That's my point, lol

You stated it was pointless to play, based on that you feel that the people controlling the world in the RP are not going to get dislodged easily. Your point is, you can't be bothered to put in any meaningful effort, but you still reserve for yourself the right to make snarky posts about how our RP is broken.

 

Gotta love the "everything is fine if you keep your head down and keep your mouth shut" attitude. Sounds like an abusive relationship. Mom's alcoholism never was a problem unless she noticed us, so what are we complaining about? Surely we should just keep quiet and pray she doesn't take offense to being ignored as well.

At the end of day, we've seen the results. CNRP is significantly less active, and the main people arguing for it are Eva, Melech, and Justinian (if you count throwing insults as an argument).

The vast majority seems happy to play in CNRP2. The facts speak for themselves.

That is a misreading of our arguments. I think I often enough stated any problems I have with the RP, at multiple occassions in the past and I'm not pretending that all is fine. I however think that the efforts necessary to restore activity are worth making and that we need not and actually must not sacrifice CNRP. If you want a proper example, then you could say that we are the counter-reformation, trying to fix the old, instead of simply overthrowing it. And one might point out that it worked quite well.

 

If you want to say we are merely throwing insults around, well I don't think you could expect a proper debate from the way this discussion started. Because originally, this was actually about Faraway, pointing out issues that exist and hoping to get things somewhat fixed (Instead of pretending they don't exist). But then two individuals, one who has not even joined the RP, the other mostly butthurt that the world doesn't revolve around them, thought they'd need to talk about the evil that is TSI. A pact that has not done anything to them since years ago, if ever.

[Mogar]

It was relevant to the someone else's comment, I null voted because I don't have an opinion on what you should do. I do not believe you will find much more activity anywhere in CNRP unless there is a fundamental change to how the world works, otherwise people will choose the option without 80% of the land that is most valued controlled by 3 people.

 

And before you use the Imperium as an example, I was willing to give MGL Korea, as I would be willing to part with anything besides Japan proper, and even then I am sure I could find a merger agreement acceptable.

Edited July 26, 2014 by Mogar

[Uberstein]

I said Justinian was throwing insults. I feel you actually believe what you're saying. *shrug*

[Hereno]

You stated it was pointless to play, based on that you feel that the people controlling the world in the RP are not going to get dislodged easily. Your point is, you can't be bothered to put in any meaningful effort, but you still reserve for yourself the right to make snarky posts about how our RP is broken.

Someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed this morning. If the truth is snarky, perhaps I'm not the problem.

[JEDCJT]

This is entertaining :popcorn:

[Evangeline Anovilis]

It was relevant to the someone else's comment, I null voted because I don't have an opinion on what you should do. I do not believe you will find much more activity anywhere in CNRP unless there is a fundamental change to how the world works, otherwise people will choose the option without 80% of the land that is most valued controlled by 3 people.

Or you are like me, who was able to get interesting Romania in CNRP2 (which is developing just nicely) and most likely could go cherrypick a location, because apart from France, I mostly would be allowed to settle in the locations I want to go and they are mostly de jure white. Faraway is nice, if North America would not be utterly boring (nothing Tricent caused). But in North America, I'll also not get any new neighbours, because most likely, noone in the near future will bother with Western Canada, especially if the rest of the continent is a giant black US and some crazy Eastern Canada (and Bear Islands' Nation of the Bear).

 

My hope is that settling elsewhere, it'll be creating a more dynamic region and cause people to settle there.

 

I said Justinian was throwing insults. I feel you actually believe what you're saying. *shrug*

For as crazy as it sounds, I believe in many silly things. I do think that one day Kankou will return. And I'll be waiting.

 

Someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed this morning. If the truth is snarky, perhaps I'm not the problem.

Well, joke's on you. I pulled an all-nighter, because by the time I finished reading this interesting manga, it was 4 am and I had to get up early to start pick apples, so we could make apple cake today.

[Justinian the Mighty]

I said Justinian was throwing insults. I feel you actually believe what you're saying. *shrug*

You have a lot of nerve talking about me like your poo doesn't stink. I don't throw insults, I throw truths. I know TSI could have been taken down with real effort, but all I ever saw were complaints about how mean Cent and Triyun were and why their evil alliance needed to be broken up. And instead of playing to your strengths and exploiting their weaknesses some people created your own rp. That's fine, but they can stop complaining about how bad cnrp is now that they have their Utopia. Instead of dismissing my posts because I use words like "rag-tag" and "silly" focus on the content. Look at the weak link in TSI and the UN. Which parties seem least satisfied with a TSI controlled world? Remove them from the equation then act, or just stick to cnrp2 and ignore what goes on in cnrp. Edited July 26, 2014 by Justinian the Mighty

[Uberstein]

I can't control what Mogar or Hereno do. Go !@#$%* at them if you want them to stop pointing out the flaws in your game.

 

I only hopped in this thread cause I was bored and found Eva's argument of "Keep quiet and you'll be fine" (at least that was my interpretation of it) to be absurd and similar to the abusive relationships I have dealt with in reality.

 

And I've got plenty of nerve, lol. It's CNRP. The amount of respect I have for the people here, if quantified in some form, would struggle to fill a thimble. Oh no I insulted somebody's honor by saying their arguments were poor, whatever will I do?

Edited July 27, 2014 by Uberstein

[Evangeline Anovilis]

I only hopped in this thread cause I was bored and found Eva's argument of "Keep quiet and you'll be fine" (at least that was my interpretation of it) to be absurd and similar to the abusive relationships I have dealt with in reality.

My argument is that people always will tell Triyun and Cent (or any other person that invades them with even just remote success) that they are evil, because all they ever wanted was "to be left alone". However, someone who genuinely wants to be left alone, will keep to themselves and close friends, not go out seeking attention. Especially not negative attention.

 

This is less about telling a victim of abuse that they should keep quiet about it. It's more like telling someone to not cause a ruckus and annoy everyone, lest they want to end up alone and possibly get into trouble. It is not Triyun's duty to protect Mogar from harm, nor is it Triyun's fault that no meaningful support was given to Mogar. And no, Dillon, Kevin and Markus are not meaningful support, in that situation they'd just get overrun. If Mogar wants to make anyone responsible for his misfortune, then Vektor, for using the chance to jump on a person that managed to lose any meaningful community support.

[Mogar]

So your argument is you HAVE to suck up to others OOCly in order for them to care about you ICly, I don't particularly like you OOCly and yet I am making an IC overture to you, not that I expect it to be successful, and fully expect 150% snarkiness from you throughout the meeting just as Triyun is giving, but yet I am still not letting my OOC opinion of you have a basis on my IC treatment, there is no real IC/OOC line in CNRP1, that is a severe problem to a political game, since it gives you nations who have no basis of allying in reality deciding to ally one another because they're friends, even though their IC nations would never do so. Seriously, how many times have Fascists been best friends with democracies, Socialist Paradises allying with dictatorships, etc.

[Evangeline Anovilis]

So your argument is you HAVE to suck up to others OOCly in order for them to care about you ICly, I don't particularly like you OOCly and yet I am making an IC overture to you, not that I expect it to be successful, and fully expect 150% snarkiness from you throughout the meeting just as Triyun is giving, but yet I am still not letting my OOC opinion of you have a basis on my IC treatment, there is no real IC/OOC line in CNRP1, that is a severe problem to a political game, since it gives you nations who have no basis of allying in reality deciding to ally one another because they're friends, even though their IC nations would never do so. Seriously, how many times have Fascists been best friends with democracies, Socialist Paradises allying with dictatorships, etc.

No. You have to stop annoying others OOCly. Sucking up won't give you any favours. Sucking up will make others see as much reason to help you as you may be useful to them in the future. And frankly speaking, in global politics, the Cape was useless. The reason you got rolled is because Vektor correctly saw a chance in getting away with rolling you. The few Africans that might stand up to him were hurriedly pressured into standing down by Cent and Triyun, who rather not wanted Vektor to just take over these states too (strength disparity was not too small). These however are actions these two took, out of a desire to preserve their influence, while not having to deal with Vektor and you. If you want to get a realistic interest-based action, that was one. Not a single person gives enough of a damn to send troops all the way to South Africa to fight a large-scale war with thousands of dead, just for the Cape. It's not in their interest. Your importance to the world is nonexistent, the global order is not threatened, the backlash can be expected to be minor. NATO does not appreciate Russia taking parts of its neighbours. But NATO did not send troops to Georgia and it will not send troops to Ukraine, as long as Russia keeps it limited. Instead there are a few sanctions, which Tricent also enacted (though it did little, due to how CNRP works). The reason the global order can go on, despite the breach, is because it's not a random act of violence that could affect just anyone. It hit you, due to your obnoxious nature and people might learn that being less disagreeable will save them from sharing your fate. And for that, you need not hail the overlord and support all their actions. You can just simply not interact and not comment on their acts, instead of making negative rematrks and openly displaying a certain hostility (talking all the time about Ticent rolling you or killing your character is not a friendly act). If we got a horrid IC/OOC divide, this divide was not as much visible in the course of events here, but would be more visible if anyone saved you. Because rationally, reasons to save the Cape are sparse IC and most people just help out, because OOCly, they'd think you are victim of unprovoked aggression and Vektor thus is a jerk for attacking you. But neither IC, nor OOC reasons existed for most of us to go to great lengths to help you, especially after you stopped ranting about Vektor being a jerk and more about how this was a great conspiracy of Triyun and Cent to get you rolled by proxy.

 

Romania has replied to your request in a manner that is entirely justified by IC reasons. I don't know how you get the idea I'm treating you any differently due to OOC, based on my pretty neutral reply to the sole contact we had. Whether it'll be successful or not is dependent on what objectives you have. As I don't know what you seek, I can't say whether you'll be successful. If you got anything to offer that Romania can actually find useful, I might accept, if you get unreasonable, I got no issue with the meeting staying a teatime chat with no agreement whatsoever. as I stated, Romania is pretty much like China. I do not go out of my way to antagonise people, I do not go out of my way to be friendly. If people are cooperative, I might be cooperative. If people are in my way and a mere roadblock to my national ambition... expect hostility. If there's a difference in how China went and how Romania went, then it definitely is, that in Romania a claims for security agreement approach worked, in China it failed. And I can tell you already now, if someone tells me they'll go, take part of Romania and cleanse it of Romanians to settle got knows what there that are not Romanians, I'm going to be just as much inclined to use armed force to protect Romanians and Romanian soil, as I did when a certain someone in a ragefit told me that they'd replace all Chinese on Taiwan with Japs. Which btw reminds me... it is funny to see you claiming moral highground in CNRP2, after voting me out over the Taiwan dispute. Cry harder about me being abbrassive, after two days where you did little besides swearing and cursing me, because I let you not get your way, while I mostly stayed silent and civil.

 

But I'm not going to use Romania for revenge and although I do feel that you are petty, narcissistic, spineless and as a consequence an annoyance that I rather not bother with, I acknowledge that you also exist in this RP and will treat you as the country you RP, not the person you are (though both share the irritating habit of self-aggrandisement). It also is your turn to reply to our meeting.