Where do we go from here?

[Auctor]

They did make it different. The only person that had a ton of land before DBDC took over their reign of the top 250 was Timmehh. Now there are mercenaries out and about in the top 250 looking for their next easy target. Land has become more important than ever in the past. They aren't cheaters in any way which is what some people make it sound like. I just think the mechanics should be changed. Whether it's nerfing land or boosting tech or getting rid of the +250/-250, something has got to give.

 

 

Nerfing land would just make it impossible to catch up to himes themis. Solves nothing.

 

EDIT: nerfing land's NS would be an awesome boost to the value of land, paradoxically.

Edited April 1, 2014 by Auctor

[Lord Hershey]

They did make it different. The only person that had a ton of land before DBDC took over their reign of the top 250 was Timmehh. Now there are mercenaries out and about in the top 250 looking for their next easy target. Land has become more important than ever in the past. They aren't cheaters in any way which is what some people make it sound like. I just think the mechanics should be changed. Whether it's nerfing land or boosting tech or getting rid of the +250/-250, something has got to give.

 

There is nothing wrong with the game mechanics, it's that many people weren't willing to fight back and would rather peace out. And because of that, DBDC is basically a product for that very specific reason. To be frank, I'm surprised many people, at least in the high tier, have not tried this practice.  :psyduck:

 

And for Chairman Hal, I'm afraid that my nation is too small to meet DBDC's requirements for joining DBDC but hey, at least I met only one of four or five requirements for becoming a member of DBDC. Again, while I find CubaQuerida's NS to be amazing, it's still not impossible to pull such a feat like that.

 

Hime would still wreck Cuba in a war I think. Tech adv rules in war. 

 

OOC of course.

 

OOC, of course, that would be one helluva of a war between Cuba and Hime if that were to happen.  :popcorn:

[White Chocolate]

I just think the mechanics should be changed. Whether it's nerfing land or boosting tech or getting rid of the +250/-250, something has got to give.

If a nation is in the top 250 (or whatever it is required to be outside the game mechanics safety net of only being attack by people within a certain range), then that nation has been around long enough to be able to figure out what's needed in order to reach higher levels. I don't care who is up or who is down in the current politics. Deal with it. There are already far to many game mechanics that take away any sense of actual role play that actual nation leaders have to deal with constantly.

Also, there are 10,770 nations. ANY nation that has the goal of trying to reach number one is going to have to work hard at it and most likely piss a lot of people off (including attacking people) on the way up. The only other solution is sit around forever and wait until everyone else above you gets bored and quits.

If you want to see yourself at the top of the nation list, my advice is to try CN:TE. You'll still have to do a ton of work but at least everyone starts out equal every couple months.

[Rogal Dorn]

Whether it's nerfing land or boosting tech or getting rid of the +250/-250, something has got to give.

What are you smoking? yeah, like that will ever happen. Prior to DBDC the extreme top tier was a tranquil environment and no one fussed and it was previously thought that you could only become top ten by aggressive tech dealing and if nations ahead of you deleted. Now that people raid in the extreme top tier to get ahead and people whine left and right.

[Bed Intruder]

What are you smoking? yeah, like that will ever happen. Prior to DBDC the extreme top tier was a tranquil environment and no one fussed and it was previously thought that you could only become top ten by aggressive tech dealing and if nations ahead of you deleted. Now that people raid in the extreme top tier to get ahead and people whine left and right.

Only the finest kush in all the lands. That aside, it only makes sense that nations should only be able to attack other nations within 75%-133% of that nation's strength. Anything beyond that creates upper-tier instability.

[ChairmanHal]

 

There is nothing wrong with the game mechanics, it's that many people weren't willing to fight back and would rather peace out. And because of that, DBDC is basically a product for that very specific reason. To be frank, I'm surprised many people, at least in the high tier, have not tried this practice.  :psyduck:

 

And for Chairman Hal, I'm afraid that my nation is too small to meet DBDC's requirements for joining DBDC but hey, at least I met only one of four or five requirements for becoming a member of DBDC. Again, while I find CubaQuerida's NS to be amazing, it's still not impossible to pull such a feat like that.

 

No, actually the game mechanics were tinkered with in the past and have created some unintended consequences.  Some of those consequences weren't fully understood until recently.  Naturally, any discussion of fixing the issues breaks down into several groups--those that don't care (mostly because they feel the current situation doesn't affect them), those who care and want to protect their advantage, those who care and want to protect the advantage their friends have, and of course those that oppose them and have offered a variety of solutions.

 

As for me, DBDC isn't my problem anymore since I don't game in CN2, nor does my alliance.  However, when I see an obvious problem with a game, I feel compelled to point it out and offer solutions.  But rather than turn this into another Suggestion Box thread, I'll end simply end by suggesting that people who feel as I do about it let their voices be heard, whether that is in the Suggestion Box, or privately to Admin.

[Castellano]

Coming Soon! Merger annoucement: The Doomcave Protection Force

 

 

Take that instability!

 

 

Lol, I hate you!

[White Chocolate]

Only the finest kush in all the lands. That aside, it only makes sense that nations should only be able to attack other nations within 75%-133% of that nation's strength. Anything beyond that creates upper-tier instability.

In my opinion, there should be at least some tier on Planet Bob where "stability" is NOT the primary concern. Thank admin I'm finally there!

[Bed Intruder]

In my opinion, there should be at least some tier on Planet Bob where "stability" is NOT the primary concern. Thank admin I'm finally there!

So you're saying in a nation simulation game, you believe there should be a TIER of nations where "stability" isn't the primary concern. Stability is described as being a resistance to change, ESPECIALLY sudden change or deterioration. That's what I'm getting at. If an alliance of non-neutral upper tier members are all able to destroy other non-neutral nations without any consequences, it will ultimately destroy the upper tier in total! While you may not understand that or want to because you're in DBDC, many others whom it doesn't affect whatsoever at this point in time (such as myself) see the issue and are looking for plausible ways to fix it and make the game ultimately better. 

[White Chocolate]

So you're saying in a nation simulation game, you believe there should be a TIER of nations where "stability" isn't the primary concern. Stability is described as being a resistance to change, ESPECIALLY sudden change or deterioration. That's what I'm getting at.

What I'm saying is that in a nation simulation game, it is reasonable in my opinion to have some tier where the nations in it actually have to deal with a similar situation to what actually can happen outside of Planet Bob. The potential threat that larger nation(s) who is/are capable of bringing down some major hurt on smaller ones and the smaller ones having to figure out how to deal with that situation.

I'm okay with low and mid-tiers having NS restrictions for attacks. Gives people time to get a feel for how things are done here and encourages cooperation, etc. But that hardly simulates what it's like to be a leader of a nation. By the time a nation reaches a certain level, why NOT make a nation simulation game more realistic at least in this small way?

In terms of my AA, I joined DBDC nine days ago. I'm not saying what I'm saying because I'm a DBDC member. I am a DBDC member (at least in part) because I'm practicing what I'm talking about :P

[Stewie]

Above 50k NS make it a free for all in my opinion.

[Ogaden]

You know, there is more to this game than stat accumulation.  It's open ended, pick any goal you want.

[Commander shepard]

Above 50k NS make it a free for all in my opinion.

 

That's dangerous, to test it out maybe we should start by making your nation a free for all and see how it works out for you when a nation in the top 50 attacks you with nukes. 

[Stewie]

 

That's dangerous, to test it out maybe we should start by making your nation a free for all and see how it works out for you when a nation in the top 50 attacks you with nukes. 

 

 

YAY!  CASUALTIES :D

 

 

Seriously though.

 

 

In games like Astroempires, (for example) & I can say it here as this is not an IC forum, Below level 10, you can't be hit by anyone.  Above level 10 up to level 30 you can only be hit within a +/- 10 level window.  Above that you can be hit in a free for all manner.  All nations can hit upwards from any level but lose protection for a period for 24 hours.

 

In CN, such a system could possibly translate.

 

Up to 50k NS you can only be hit by nations in the current 75/133% ranges.  Above that you can hit without restraint.

 

 

This would fundementally change the gameplay however.  

Potentially something to try for TE first?

Edited April 3, 2014 by Stewie

[spearo]

 

 

YAY!  CASUALTIES :D

 

 

Seriously though.

 

 

In games like Astroempires, (for example) & I can say it here as this is not an IC forum, Below level 10, you can't be hit by anyone.  Above level 10 up to level 30 you can only be hit within a +/- 10 level window.  Above that you can be hit in a free for all manner.  All nations can hit upwards from any level but lose protection for a period for 24 hours.

 

In CN, such a system could possibly translate.

 

Up to 50k NS you can only be hit by nations in the current 75/133% ranges.  Above that you can hit without restraint.

 

 

This would fundementally change the gameplay however.  

Potentially something to try for TE first?

Just no, that would probably lead to CN dieing in less then 3 months.

[Commander shepard]

No it's a terrible idea, it is the sort of idea you only use in jokes.

[Auctor]

would lead to 500k NS nations getting nuclear staggered by 50k NS nations. 500k NS nations would crush 50k guys but they'd still eat a nuke and you could keep that stagger going forever for much cheaper than it would take to do it with 250k NS nations.

[spearo]

would lead to 500k NS nations getting nuclear staggered by 50k NS nations. 500k NS nations would crush 50k guys but they'd still eat a nuke and you could keep that stagger going forever for much cheaper than it would take to do it with 250k NS nations.

In reality it would just be a race to raid the smallest nations you can find slots on and the bigger you are the more tech you profit. 

[Auctor]

In reality it would just be a race to raid the smallest nations you can find slots on and the bigger you are the more tech you profit. 

 

Doubt it, there are way too many nations above 50k NS for that to work.

[spearo]

 

Doubt it, there are way too many nations above 50k NS for that to work.

900 nations are 100k+, 1200 are in the 50k to 80k range. There is profit to be made even if they have to eat nukes.

Edited April 3, 2014 by spearo

[Auctor]

Assuming those 50k NS nations have enough land to profit from. It's pretty easy to scorch the earth and turtling isn't an unknown tactic.

[spearo]

Assuming those 50k NS nations have enough land to profit from. It's pretty easy to scorch the earth and turtling isn't an unknown tactic.

i think youd find most 50k nations will peace out when faced with 10-15k+ tech nukes.

Edited April 3, 2014 by spearo

[Auctor]

Everyone above 50k NS hitting each other would get rid of the upper tier distinction. If I was on the numerically superior side, I could sacrifice my 50k NS nations to keep super tier guys in anarchy and use my upper tier guys to down declare on guys they can do massive amounts of damage to. If I had to guess, there's a lot more people willing to take damage in a group of 2100 than there are in a group of 250.

 

I agree it's a bad idea, but it's not a bad idea for the reason you think it is.

Edited April 3, 2014 by Auctor

[ChairmanHal]

Above 50k NS make it a free for all in my opinion.

 

Everyone above 50k NS hitting each other would get rid of the upper tier distinction. If I was on the numerically superior side, I could sacrifice my 50k NS nations to keep super tier guys in anarchy and use my upper tier guys to down declare on guys they can do massive amounts of damage to. If I had to guess, there's a lot more people willing to take damage in a group of 2100 than there are in a group of 250.

 

I agree it's a bad idea, but it's not a bad idea for the reason you think it is.

The FODC (Friends of Doomcave) have spoken.   :rolleyes:

 

Seriously, both of you manage to come tramping into every single DBDC thread on these forums at some point and act as semi-official apologists.

 

What you are proposing would be great fun for your friends for a few months, but most everyone else who is actively hustling out there trying to build up their alliances and interact with each other (both in positive and negative ways) just aren't interested in mastodon hunts (particularly when the mastodons have people continuously providing them with aid, thus ensuring the sausage grinder would run far longer than necessary), or reviving Shark Week.  Actually, I can't figure out if you two are wanting to return to the "glory days of 2007" (FYI: they weren't even remotely as glorious as you are remembering) or you've also given up on the game and just hope to see a good smash up before you quit.  Either way, enough of the silly suggestions.

[Auctor]

If DBDC needs me for a defender, they really are screwed. Not sure you know what you think you know.