Sithis

[quote name='HeroofTime55' timestamp='1302509999' post='2688456'] All people are going to remember about this is the number, and this is going to wind up contributing more to MK dissent than it's really worth, even if TOOL moves to pay it off right away. Sort of a silly mistake to make. [/quote] I'm sure when judgment day is nigh, and the Almighty looks upon MK after their demise and decides their fate, he will recall [b]this day[/b] as but one of many when the corrupt members of the Kingdom lusted after technology, forgoing their morals. And thus the prophet, HeroofTime55, has spoken.

No tech for Umbrella? HARSHEST TERMS EVER.

[quote name='D34th' timestamp='1302366112' post='2687436'] Translation: You joined our hit list RIA. [/quote] Yeah they're right after Duckroll Honestly it's sad to see these two alliances go their separate ways as I like both of you, but judging by the posts in this thread it seems like the relationship had deteriorated beyond repair.

If Doom House is evil, THEN WHO WAS PHONE?

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1301723384' post='2682740'] Followed by the "you are irrelevant" standard. So irrelevant that you know everything we've done in the past year, that your coalition is charging us the second-highest reps, that you were compelled to reply to me but unable to address anything I said. For so much smuggo you've got so little substance. Even your summation of my position belies your inability to understand what I have just said, which was in no way "the treaty web is terrible." But whatever makes you feel important. Come back when you have some ideas. [/quote] I'll bite. First, I don't know everything you've done in the past year. I've only just returned to Planet Bob after a two year hiatus. Everything in my previous post I just put together on a stereotype because I've seen alliances like CoJ since before the Unjust War. The names change, but the people and the bleeding hearts stay the same. Trying to find order in the cess pool that is the treaty web is incomprehensible. Your argument, that alliances were ignoring the political ramifications/obligations/nature of treaties and focusing on social aspect that you summarized as wub and popularity, is entirely correct. However, the reality is that the social aspect of certain alliances is more reliable than the political one. No one can accurately predict political decisions on Planet Bob; judging an alliance based on its members' attitudes and seeing if they're in line with your own is a much more reliable indicator of a successful friendship and treaty partnership. Political situations can change at the drop of a hat. Alliances do often say one thing and then end up obligating themselves to something entirely different, it's usually done out of a necessary sacrifice. Welcome to Planet Bob, take a ticket and have a seat. The problem behind CoJ isn't that you're fighting a useless uphill battle (which you are), it's that you somehow have placed yourself on another hill and look down upon the rest of us. If you're going to argue that the political system of Planet Bob needs a revolution, save your breath. You'll have an easier time convincing people that capitalism is evil.

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1301721369' post='2682720']The core problem of the treaty web is this "love" and "friend" childishness. And that is exactly what it is, infantility in foreign affairs. Treaties are political--not social--commitments. The transformation of treaties from political tools to popularity contests has destroyed all integrity in treaty commitments. Why is that? Because while alliances sign treaties over they still go to war to achieve political means. They have moved treaties--which are tools of war--out of the political realm, while war retains its political nature, thereby creating a conflicting reality, a dichotomy that cannot be reconciled. Practitioners of this huggles diplomacy decry PZI while MADPing alliances that PZI, they decry techraiding while joining blocs with rampant raiding alliances, they talk about white peace while MDoAPing alliances hellbent on reps--and vice versa. They make claims as to their uniqueness and intrinsic values, but don't understand or practice unity of foreign and internal policy, they make themselves flavorless social clubs, or brainless meatswarms fit for nothing but doing what they're told. Their hands are tied by their own lazy, sloppy, stupid practices, and they turn around and complain about how bored they are.[/quote] Classic "the treaty web is terrible" argument. Should've gone with the Chewbacca Defense though, it's much more convincing. [quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1301721369' post='2682720'] Quote the contrary. You're doing the exact same thing that almost every alliance is doing. There is nothing remarkable about Europa, and I say that in the most disinterested, dispassionate manner possible; it is simply my observation and the same observation I have of almost every other alliance. There is nothing distinguishable between 100 alliances who all scream the rhetoric of honor and death before dishonor and friends>infra and we love our friends and which all find themselves sitting on their hands when the time for action comes, or else carefully tip-toeing around so as to appear not to be plotting against their friends or selling them out while they do it. There's nothing different about 90% of alliances, they might as well all merge.[/quote] Thank God that there are those 10% of alliances who aren't afraid to stand up for what they believe in. I don't know what this game would be like without alliances like Cult of Justitia or Celestial Being (RIP). Oh wait, yes I do - it'd be exactly the same. While you are an intelligent person, and you have a fairly good understanding of the tangle of cords that is the treaty web, at the end of the day you have little to no political clout. What you and these "honorable" alliances hoping to spread peace and truth throughout the galaxy (or whatever it is you're trying to accomplish) do, at the end of the day, doesn't matter, albeit my replying in such detail to you may be somewhat paradoxical in this instance. For proof, all I can point to is the fact that CoJ entering or withdrawing from the current DH-NPO conflict really has no impact, at all. I don't mean to suggest that might makes right, but you and your ilk are nothing but a larvae among the flies of Doomhouse's swatter. [quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1301721369' post='2682720'] Statements like this from micros crack me up. CoJ had as many members as Europa pre-war, a higher ANS, more nukes, higher score, and a higher ranking, and--since you got all kindergarten--we have a Senator on top of that. The only differences between CoJ and Europa is that CoJe put ourselves on the line for what we believe in, and that we don't treaty-whore like a bunch of children sending half the class a "do you like me? circle yes for treaty" note. Your one ally is able to leverage tribute money from your other ally while you stand by idle precisely because you do not matter; your ill-contemplated foreign policy has made you impotent and really quite worthless to both sides.[/quote] One difference you left out is the fact that CoJ are the ambulance chasers of CN. Be it tech raiding, hegemony, reps, or whatever bleeding heart cause is permeating these discussions, without fail CoJ will be there to take up the cause. I suppose if it makes you feel important, please continue to be the vanguard of whatever injustices you fool yourself into thinking exist, although don't expect the rest of us to act like you actually matter. [quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1301721369' post='2682720'] Quite the contrary, the broad trends of foreign policy effect us all. [/quote] On this we agree. Unfortunately not enough people realize that it is the [b]broad[/b] trends that affect us, and instead live on these boards and nitpick every tiny detail of foreign affairs. And here we are.

This is fantastic, although I wonder how much of CN remembers GUARD.

As some of you may have noticed, my commitment to CNRP has waned in the past few weeks. I've been too busy with some RL stuff and no longer have the time to commit to CNRP. Coupled with the fact that the CNRP I remember is a lot better than the one that exists now, I must retire from this community. I know I'm mid-RPs with some of you, my apologies for ducking out without any warning. See you all around. Sithis

[quote name='Olliee' timestamp='1301412634' post='2679957'] To be honest, who can trust an alliance that doesn't even realise that a 'Duke' is several orders higher than a 'Lord'! [/quote] It depends on what system of peerage you're referencing, but in most instances the term Lord (or Lady) is used to refer to all nobility, be it Viscounts, Barons, Dukes, etc.

Should've posted this a while ago, but I'm locked. IRL stuff.

Wow, that's terrible news. Good luck to Bob and his sister, hopefully everything turns out for the better.

I support all things having to do with yacht clubs. This is good. Also, this: [quote name='Kalasin' timestamp='1301117779' post='2676889'] you took issue with max and not rey? seriously? [/quote]

[quote name='Systemfailure' timestamp='1301057761' post='2675995'] Silly Avalon don't you know the fastest way to winning a war is a single all out blitz? [/quote] Like everyone else on the other side of this war, Avalon's surrender is inevitable. If they come out of peace mode, their term negotiations will probably go better than if they just sat in it for the duration of this conflict.

[quote name='Guffey' timestamp='1301056748' post='2675988'] we declared on all of doomhouse, but have only been engaging MK and umbrella. There were already plenty of alliances on goons, so we saw no point engaging them. [/quote] Not sure if you've been paying attention, but some of the actual combatants in this war just surrendered to GOONS. Maybe you should adjust your strategy (here's a suggestion - come out of peace mode). [quote name='Guffey' timestamp='1301056748' post='2675988'] We would have declared only on MK and umbrella, but since DH already saw a DoW on one of them as a DoW on all of them, we saved them that trouble. [/quote] How considerate of you.

GOONS deserves recognition for the consistent, effective fighting they did on this front of the war (among others), and NSO does as well. Congrats to peace for both sides, here's to rebuilding.