The Pacific Press

Nobody believes that TORN was pushing for the war on OV. It's a pity because it's the truth.

Your attempt to play the victim trips over the usual issue that you declared the war.

And major laughs about linking to ConspiracyHal as 'proof' that there has been a plot against you for months.

I am sure that some people are happy you charged into a position where your grip on the world can be removed, but it is your own fault for starting an aggressive war (against Superfriends and C&G due to OV's ties to those MADP blocs). If you had taken the initial talks with OV seriously then we wouldn't be here now.

People keep talking about how good NPO propaganda used to be, and how you've slid in international standing because you stopped pumping the stuff out, but I don't believe it. You guys have been terrible at it for as long as I've been watching. You had enough muscle that when you threatened people for commenting on it you had quite a bit of success in manufacturing a veneer of positive reception, but you were never really 'winning hearts and minds.'

Now that you're down it's really kind of sad.

You can't spin your aggression into you being attacked. If you wanted to play the victim card seriously you should be trying to defend the CB that started the war. Since you've never bothered to pretend that there was any validity to it, or have expected people to accept it without offering any support for it, this just makes you look like a petulant child crying after he's stomped on his own toy. At this point it's too late anyway, I know. If your CB were valid you should have tried to make it clear at the outset, but substituting this drivel late in the game just looks pathetic.

You've been proud to be precedent setters the whole time you've been here. Now that your precedents are being applied to you on an immensely lighter scale you cry foul. Did you really expect to bend ears with that?

I miss your fail in the CN forums. If you want to say something, say it. Stop hiding your opinion

Ah, my dearest Cortath. I was reading about how in the Six Day War Israel made sure they would not be caught performing a preemptive strike - even when they knew their enemies were mobilizing. When you are surrounded by enemies, it is imperative you are not singled out as aggressors. And because you launched the first strike, you are seen as the conquerors.

Why were you so eager to support a strategically insignificant ally like TORN when it meant that you would have to fire first? You were the masters. Without you TORN is nothing. You do not need allies that will goad you into a war you will lose. Putting the focus back on TORN highlights how you had lost grip on the world. In a very Francoist sense, it was time for a new synthesis.

I believe you should have made more of a point in condemning former allies that participated in the "atrocities" you are being blamed for. Some members of the Karma coalition, whether they brand themselves as members or not, have been willing participants in the wars of old. I believe a case could be made here, breeding distrust between the committed moralists and the opportunists who enjoyed and profited from the Continuum's protection only to abandon it at the last minute.

See, this is why Treaty Webs stink to high heaven. They end up with wars like this, where everyone is fighting everyone else, because they all have treaties that require them to fight.

It was brought to my attention through private means that the rest of my original comment was inflammatory. As that was not my intention, I have opted to edit it and remove the offending portions.

There's enough fighting going on without me bringing more to the table, right?

Never thought I'd see the day when a NPO propaganda maker condemed going to war for conquest.

Even if I never agreed with the francoist ideals NPO stood for it's fairly amusing to see them throw them as far away as they can when the tides turn.

You are choosing for harsh repairations yourselfs. And they'll only get harsher if you keep being stubborn.

Your attempt to play the victim trips over the usual issue that you declared the war.

And major laughs about linking to ConspiracyHal as 'proof' that there has been a plot against you for months.

I am sure that some people are happy you charged into a position where your grip on the world can be removed, but it is your own fault for starting an aggressive war (against Superfriends and C&G due to OV's ties to those MADP blocs). If you had taken the initial talks with OV seriously then we wouldn't be here now.

I'm for the most part just gonna second this.

Some undoubtedly had the desire to roll you and fight because of it, but most didn't want war and were responding to YOUR aggression. They knew that you knew the implications of that aggression: an attempt to take down many on the side of the web that had grown independent of you.

That is the primary reason for why this war has become as big as it is and why so many joined Karma. Does morality into it? Many of the alliances had separated from you in response to your actions or after they had participated in them and found them distasteful. There's no explicit moral cause. However the alliances on our side tend to be those that have held and put into execution the values that have been expressed. That is why the issue of morality has come up and some have claimed the mantle of moral superiority. So it does represent our side but indirectly, not explicitly. That doesn't mean we won't bring in a better world because the balance of power is in greater part held by those alliances, just that there's no grand conspiracy to do so.

I thought it was cool when you tried to run out on TORN and then called them cowards.

I answered this question in the IRON surrenders thread, I answered it for Rok. Everyone's answer will be different.

You're crying foul that this was a war of revenge when you yourselves started GW3 just to get revenge for the first Great "Patriotic" War? Not to mention all the other wars?

The effort in this piece was good, substance was lacking.